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  #25  
Old June 26th, 2019, 07:10 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

I like the idea of calling them Blazing Hell Cats if naming them is one of the things we're talking about.


I like the idea of markers to start the game however I believe those markers should be decision points, and should not be lost or gained through any action other than the decision to use them. I believe we should balance the marker buff around it being a set number of uses. To that end, I'm wondering if we should limit their use to once per turn and buff each cat when using one? If so is +1 move and +1 attach good enough?
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  #26  
Old June 27th, 2019, 09:36 AM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

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Originally Posted by Jaur0n View Post
I like the idea of markers to start the game however I believe those markers should be decision points, and should not be lost or gained through any action other than the decision to use them. I believe we should balance the marker buff around it being a set number of uses. To that end, I'm wondering if we should limit their use to once per turn and buff each cat when using one? If so is +1 move and +1 attach good enough?
+1 Move and +1 Attack is pretty darn good for a squad. It would be very tempting to burn through them quickly.
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  #27  
Old June 27th, 2019, 12:35 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

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Originally Posted by lefton4ya View Post
Yea I don't like Elemental or Moltarn - How about Panthera or Puma - the two main Genus of "Big Cats", I could see someone making a Lion or Cougar Heroscape figure eventually and using these guys in some kind of synergy. Just think of them as Big Cats on fire - Aka "Fire Cats"...
Which "Big Cat" do they look like most? We can name them after it, AKA Blazing Cougars or Fire Leopards .
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Long eared bat View Post
Lions are the only big cat that hunt as a group. As a name what about: Ukushisa Pride.
Ukushisa is Zulu for blazing.
I actually liked @The Long eared bat 's suggestion for a name. Personally I think Ukushisa Cougars or Fire Leopards is better than Hell cats - IMHO they are not demons from hell just big cats ON FIRE!!! Speaking of which, which general are people leaning? I would prefer not UTGAR as too many Lava Resistant figures come from Utgar and not enough from elsewhere - maybe AQUALLA or ULLAR? However we have to be mindful of the whole AotP set and try to even out the Generals, so maybe the general (and a backstory) is the last thing we decide on.

For Stats is the consensus somewhere around:

1 Life
7/8 Move (less if Markers can buff)
1 Range
2/3 Attack (less if Markers can buff)
4/5 Defense (less if Markers can buff)

As far as powers I guess we are all agreeing on WATER WEAKNESS and LAVA RESISTANT as given, but are debating on FIRST STRIKE or INFLAME/FLAME REKINDLED or other "Counter" power. I really liked @All Your Pie 's suggestion though

Quote:
Originally Posted by All Your Pie View Post
8/1/3/5 stats or something similar would bring these figures into a similar line with the Deathstalkers or Marrden Hounds. Pairing that with some kind of conditional attack boost would make them occasional menacers who are also pretty decent blockers the rest of the time.

Here’s a spitball idea, using Captain Stupendous’s concept:

Inflame
Start the game with 3 red flame markers on this army card. Before attacking, you may remove a flame marker to add 1 to the attack value of this card. If there are no flame markers on this army card, subtract 3 from its defense value. At the end of each round, if any of your (figure name) are on a molten lava or lava field space, you may place a flame marker on this card, to a maximum of 3.

Extinguish
If one of your (figure name) enters a water space, remove all flame markers from this army card.
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  #28  
Old June 27th, 2019, 12:55 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

Lava resistance -I get why this seems/is mandatory, after looking through units, it seems damn near anything fire related unit has it. I agree it's needed.

I personally dislike Water Weakness unless it's a counter to a too strong something else.


If it's just some tacked on thematic thing my concern is we are telling people if the map has lava and no water, this is a good unit. If it has water and no lava, don't use it. That feels bad to me.

Last edited by Jaur0n; June 27th, 2019 at 01:11 PM. Reason: typo/formatting
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  #29  
Old June 27th, 2019, 01:10 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

@Jaur0n : Almost all maps have water - but with this unit having a high move and being double-spaced they can walk over water in most circumstances, so Water Weakness would rarely affect the unit - it is just very thematic. However I would use @All you Pie's Extinguish over Water Weakness. Lava Resistance is almost needed for theme, but that doesn't mean the unit isn't playable on non Lava Maps - just a bonus on them. Basically this unit should be usable on almost any map, just slightly better on lava maps, and slightly worse on maps with a lot of water (swamp water counts)

I just suggested this on (Chandra Nalaar, Pyromancer) that would help with the suggested Inflame power
Quote:
Originally Posted by lefton4ya View Post
...
Quote:
[LAVA CAST] / [OBSIDIAN FIELD]:
All land spaces adjacent to [CN,P] are considered lava field spaces [for special powers and end of the round rolls].
Note: text in brackets is optional for clarity. Helps any Blazing Firecats Synergy that is boosted by lava field, causes end of the round wounds to opponents next to [CN,P], plus assist all LR figures. ...
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  #30  
Old June 27th, 2019, 04:02 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by lefton4ya View Post
As far as powers I guess we are all agreeing on WATER WEAKNESS and LAVA RESISTANT as given, but are debating on FIRST STRIKE or INFLAME/FLAME REKINDLED or other "Counter" power.
No, I do not agree. Not outright at least. If we go with the direction discussed in Chandra's thread that they instead recharge from taking damage from powers that do not damage Lava Resistant figures, then I do not want them to have Lava Resistance (the two powers would clash). Yeah, they would then die in lava. Lava is super, super hot.

If we do not go that direction, I'm perfectly fine with Lava Resistant. I'm also fine with Water Weakness/Negative Element. We need to then have the discipline to restrict ourselves to not putting more than one other bell/whistle on it without really good reason.
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  #31  
Old June 27th, 2019, 04:31 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

My main worry with the charging from fire-based damage direction is that itís a little bit thematically inconsistent. I donít mind them being vulnerable to molten lava, but I do find it somewhat odd that they would be charged by Chandra and Searing Intensity but not by Fire Line or Burning Breath. This is more a fault with prior heroscape designs than it is with us, but itís still kind of an odd failing. It also might be a little too niche for the steps weíd be taking to make it happen.

The thing I do like about the marker direction is that three turns with +1 attack is going to be enough a lot of the time that you might not feel the need to recharge them even if you can. This works out whether or not we make them rechargeable, as the synergy will remain light if they have it but they wonít feel lacking if they donít. That said, I kind of like the interplay between my version of Inflame and Scytaleís alternative to Lava Resistant. You might hesitate to burn your last marker if it costs you survivability, but lowering your defense makes it easier for Chandra to light them up again. That combination also allows us to cut the last clause from Inflame, since the power that lets them absorb fire damage already covers it.

Iím still a little up in the air on this, but Iím curious how everyone else feels here.
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  #32  
Old June 27th, 2019, 04:45 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by All Your Pie View Post
My main worry with the charging from fire-based damage direction is that itís a little bit thematically inconsistent. I donít mind them being vulnerable to molten lava, but I do find it somewhat odd that they would be charged by Chandra and Searing Intensity but not by Fire Line or Burning Breath. This is more a fault with prior heroscape designs than it is with us, but itís still kind of an odd failing.
Personally I don't see it any more thematically inconsistent than adding a Lava Resistance immunity to a power. Figures that can bathe in lava are already killed by Fire Line like everything else, so it has to be magic fire or something. It's an unfortunate side effect of the Heroscape system, which lack damage types.
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  #33  
Old June 30th, 2019, 12:32 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

RE: name and general. Hellcats is good, but I also like <something> Pride. Kind of gets across that these are magical animals that just happen to be fire cats.

I also like them as Aquilla, but that’s just me. We’re going to have a lot of Utgar I feel.
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  #34  
Old July 4th, 2019, 01:06 AM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by All Your Pie View Post
My main worry with the charging from fire-based damage direction is that it’s a little bit thematically inconsistent. I don’t mind them being vulnerable to molten lava, but I do find it somewhat odd that they would be charged by Chandra and Searing Intensity but not by Fire Line or Burning Breath. This is more a fault with prior heroscape designs than it is with us, but it’s still kind of an odd failing. It also might be a little too niche for the steps we’d be taking to make it happen.

The thing I do like about the marker direction is that three turns with +1 attack is going to be enough a lot of the time that you might not feel the need to recharge them even if you can. This works out whether or not we make them rechargeable, as the synergy will remain light if they have it but they won’t feel lacking if they don’t. That said, I kind of like the interplay between my version of Inflame and Scytale’s alternative to Lava Resistant. You might hesitate to burn your last marker if it costs you survivability, but lowering your defense makes it easier for Chandra to light them up again. That combination also allows us to cut the last clause from Inflame, since the power that lets them absorb fire damage already covers it.

I’m still a little up in the air on this, but I’m curious how everyone else feels here.
In favor of non-recharging counters or recharging counters (maybe random to make it NOT a sure thing every round) over time (innate magic).

Not in favor of recharging via taking fire/molten lava damage or dependency of another unit. Less complexity that way.

Ambivalent of lava resistance.
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  #35  
Old July 4th, 2019, 09:23 AM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

Quote:
In favor of non-recharging counters or recharging counters (maybe random to make it NOT a sure thing every round) over time (innate magic).
I agree with this. With water weakness instead of lowering their defense it could evaporate their recharging counters and when a cat is on a water space it can't recharge.
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  #36  
Old July 4th, 2019, 12:16 PM
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Re: [Pod 1] UNIT NAME (Blazing Firecats) - Design

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Originally Posted by The Long eared bat View Post
Quote:
In favor of non-recharging counters or recharging counters (maybe random to make it NOT a sure thing every round) over time (innate magic).
I agree with this. With water weakness instead of lowering their defense it could evaporate their recharging counters and when a cat is on a water space it can't recharge.
Water weakness, like this as well, instead of defense penalty.
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