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  #61  
Old March 26th, 2008, 01:26 PM
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I was wondering if this thread could have a poll added to it, as scapers are usually more willing to provide feedback through this format. Again, I encourage those interested to look back at previous threads (e.g. http://heroscapers.com/community/sho...505c101b8efdb1) to see how most folks played prior to the free flip rule. I am beginning to think that Revdyer and R˙chean's way of playing to be more reasonable at this time, with the assumption that the wording should have been changed between v2 and v3 to reflect this. I do still believe that with v1 and v2 rules, players were limited to flipping only at the beginning or end of their move (otherwise effectively reversing direction of the figure). Flipping was never addressed previously, and thus was a result of having the leading edge move to the space occupied by the trailing edge.

Anyway, since it appears that WotC cannot adequately answer my question, a poll showing a consesus would certainly take its place.
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  #62  
Old March 26th, 2008, 03:00 PM
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I asked the question in a visual way to WOTC:

If I am moving my double space figure across the board from left to right and i flip him in the middle of my move, does my next move now go right to left or can I continue to move across the board left to right?

And I got the following response:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Customer Service Representative Wizards of the Coast
Thank you for writing. If you were to flip mid-move, you would then have to move from right to left. You have to follow the end you chose to lead with.

Good Gaming!

But is this response reliable? Unfortunatly that is the big question.

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  #63  
Old March 26th, 2008, 03:14 PM
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NO

It isn't.

They are not taking the time to think about it. They are looking at the rules as they are written and formulating their responses based on that alone. Somebody over there needs to actually evaluate the question and formulate a response based on in game play, not an archaic rule.

Below quoted because I fully agree:

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1Mmirg
This may be moot, but I believe the whole "lead edge" thing is designed primarily to remind the player moving the unit that the second edge (whichever follows) must follow exactly behind the front edge. Thus, the lead edge is more about the first space being moved from and then on to, rather than being about which side of the sculpt is leading. (I can free flip my 2-hex guy all I want, but I cannot change which hex space is the first one from which my move has begun and which hex remains the second space on which my guy must still fit.)

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  #64  
Old March 26th, 2008, 04:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R˙chean
NO

It isn't.

They are not taking the time to think about it. They are looking at the rules as they are written and formulating their responses based on that alone. Somebody over there needs to actually evaluate the question and formulate a response based on in game play, not an archaic rule.

Below quoted because I fully agree:

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1Mmirg
This may be moot, but I believe the whole "lead edge" thing is designed primarily to remind the player moving the unit that the second edge (whichever follows) must follow exactly behind the front edge. Thus, the lead edge is more about the first space being moved from and then on to, rather than being about which side of the sculpt is leading. (I can free flip my 2-hex guy all I want, but I cannot change which hex space is the first one from which my move has begun and which hex remains the second space on which my guy must still fit.)
That is how I play it as well...never really thought about it, just kind of did it
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  #65  
Old March 26th, 2008, 05:27 PM
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Wow, WOTC drops the ruling ball again..
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  #66  
Old March 26th, 2008, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by ZtruK
Wow, WOTC drops the ruling ball again..
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  #67  
Old March 27th, 2008, 11:13 AM
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Guys,

R˙chean and Rev are correct. Here's a few key notes.

1. You can flip at any point in your movement, before, during or after, BUT you MUST be able to stand on the spaces you're on, no matter which direction you face (the only exception to that rule is going up or down levels of terrain. You CANNOT flip midair in between movement spaces. You must stop on 2 spaces, then flip on those same 2 spaces and be able to stand facing both directions for the flip to work.

2. R˙chean and Rev are correct in their assumption of the "leading side" issue. The "flip" was added in the 3rd edition of the rules, and thus, sometimes, things get missed. You will be able to proceed in the same direction after a flip. The "leading side" rule is to help illustrate the snake-like movement of double-spaced figures and to keep players from crab walking.

I wouldn't be surprised if WOTC fixed this ruling shortly. They have done that before.
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  #68  
Old March 27th, 2008, 11:52 AM
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Thanks for another great clarification Guru. Thats not how I played at all, and never would have. Do you know anything about the Ninja vs Rechets question? Thanks again.
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  #69  
Old March 27th, 2008, 12:05 PM
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Sorry you are wrong about your flip rules. (Unless you can tell what page of which rulebook or FAQ you found it in)
Where did you find this rule?
Quote:
Originally Posted by theGuru
You CANNOT flip midair in between movement spaces. You must stop on 2 spaces, then flip on those same 2 spaces and be able to stand facing both directions for the flip to work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by theGuru
BUT you MUST be able to stand on the spaces you're on, no matter which direction you face (the only exception to that rule is going up or down levels of terrain....
How do you explain this then?
[/

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  #70  
Old March 27th, 2008, 12:11 PM
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In that example you would flip Grimnak before entering the nook, instead of backing in and then flipping him around.

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  #71  
Old March 27th, 2008, 12:12 PM
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That example (from the first edition rulebook) is not showing movement, it's showing examples of "Fitting" on a space.

Quote:
Originally Posted by me
You CANNOT flip midair in between movement spaces. You must stop on 2 spaces, then flip on those same 2 spaces and be able to stand facing both directions for the flip to work.
Page 11 of the SOTM Rules:
"A figure cannot move through or onto a space that it can't fit completely onto."

The example then shows that leading with this right foot, Tor-Kul-Na could not move onto a space, however, if he flipped before moving on to that space he COULD move onto it by leading with his left foot.

My note of flipping middair was in response to an earlier post talking about flipping all over the place. For example

Spaces
1 2 3 4 5 6

Tor-Kul Na is leading with his right side while on spaces 1 & 2, he moves onto 2 & 3 then before moving onto 3 & 4 he flips mid air to land and lead with his left side (because he couldn't move onto 3 & 4 while leading with his right side. You can't do that. You would have to flip while still on 2 & 3 and be able to stand there (with no obstructions) then continue moving.
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  #72  
Old March 27th, 2008, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theGuru
That example (from the first edition rulebook) is not showing movement, it's showing examples of "Fitting" on a space.

Quote:
Originally Posted by me
You CANNOT flip midair in between movement spaces. You must stop on 2 spaces, then flip on those same 2 spaces and be able to stand facing both directions for the flip to work.
Page 11 of the SOTM Rules:
"A figure cannot move through or onto a space that it can't fit completely onto."

The example then shows that leading with this right foot, Tor-Kul-Na could not move onto a space, however, if he flipped before moving on to that space he COULD move onto it by leading with his left foot.

My note of flipping middair was in response to an earlier post talking about flipping all over the place. For example

Spaces
1 2 3 4 5 6

Tor-Kul Na is leading with his right side while on spaces 1 & 2, he moves onto 2 & 3 then before moving onto 3 & 4 he flips mid air to land and lead with his left side (because he couldn't move onto 3 & 4 while leading with his right side. You can't do that. You would have to flip while still on 2 & 3 and be able to stand there (with no obstructions) then continue moving.
You are correct. I was to quick to say you were wrong.

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