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Competitive Armies Discussion Discuss, critique, and build ideas for tournament-caliber armies.

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  #13  
Old June 26th, 2008, 06:51 AM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Quote:
Originally Posted by NecroBlade View Post

110 Acolarh
080 Emirroon
140 Aubrien Archers x2
050 Arkmer
100 Warriors of Ashra x2
020 Kyntela Gwyn
I like it, if you don't mind me saying so. However, I think a lot of people will note that it lacks a knock-out punch. They would be right, though I think your army can widdle the opponent down instead.

Here's a hodgepodge army, with the flavor of Arkmer, that can also deliver a wallop with either Mimring or Cyprien. (borrowing your army posting style)

120 Nakitas
080 Raelin ROTV
050 Arkmer
100 WOA X2
150 Mimring or Cyprien

Here's an alternate, less cliche version using Raelin SOTM for the greater aura, and delivering its knockout with Sgt. Drake ROTV.

120 Nakitas
120 Raelin SOTM
050 Arkmer
100 WOA X2
110 Sgt. Drake ROTV

In both of the above armies, the Nakitas and WOA fan out early, backed by Raelin. Your force should be amply protected from range, so the opponent will have to come in close and risk your engagement strikes. Once they are tied up with your WOA, send in your heroes to knock them off.
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  #14  
Old June 30th, 2008, 12:21 AM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Sorry for taking so long to respond to this thread - life got complex this past week and I wanted to do each of your comments justice.

Junge Roman,

I have to agree about the surprising power of the pipsqueak, Arkmer. Any Elf army is lucky to have him, though a lot of what I like most about him is that he benefits from Ulginesh - letting the Elves throw multiple powerful ranged strikes.

rdhight,

I tend to agree that the army with the 120 point slot is better for the Elves - but the 180 might be better in actual tournaments. Among other things, I don't feel that a three die attack with Jorhdawn is anything to sneeze at.

jedilou,

Not sure what value I see in adding Krug to the mix. Without the Arrow Gruts to give him free activations he's pretty ignorable in my mind. As an end game unit I can see your reasoning, but I think what the Elves need is something that boosts their staying power.

Alastair,

No go on the NORCAL, my friend - not gonna be able to attend. I gotta agree with your Zetacron love - though I would argue to you that he is the Elves in miniature - lots of power in a fragile frame.

Clarissimus,

I waffle on whether Raelin is worth it in an army with Kyntela and Emiroon. But in an Elf army sans one or the other...? Yeah, I think Raelin could be huge toward making them competitive.

Necro,

One of these days I'm going to have to force myself to believe Acolarh could be genuinely worthwhile in an army again (I like him for fun, but in competition?). But I think it'll take Ulginesh himself to convince me to try it. Emiroon might be able to keep it together... hmmm... I dunno. I'd love to play against the army you listed. That way, after it kicked me around a couple of times I could acknowledge how great it is in practice even though I can't quite see it on paper.

Thanks for all your thoughts

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  #15  
Old June 30th, 2008, 02:52 AM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Never underestimate the power of Acolarh. I played a 6OO point game with my little brother and his revival ability braught back Ulginesh twice, Jhordawn once, and Kyntela once. I ended up losing that game. If you still don`t like him, go roll 10 dice and see how often you get 3 of those pesky symbols. Not to mention the move enhancement. Emeroon summons him and moves to height, then summons him again.

speaking of Emeroon, my bro wanted me to ask to play him with Therucus. Get him to height, drop Emmy,

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  #16  
Old June 30th, 2008, 08:50 AM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alastair MacDirk View Post
I hate to rain on the Elves day in the sun here, but I just don't see the Wizards being the core of a competitive army. What you have in there are too many points wasted in support units to get off 2 decent ranged attacks per activation (of Uglinesh). Heck Kaemon Awa or Q-10 can do that by themselves and they are more mobile than 4-5 Elves in a clump. But you know the key to a good tourney army is either having dominant range or being able (either through bonding or using AE, 10th foot, 4th mass, or Marro Warriors) to get 4 attacks per activation. Please, someone tell me how 2 attacks from a fairly immobile cluster of 2 defense Wizards will ever contend with that?????
Well, I for one don't play in tournaments. Never have, but I don't have anything against the idea. I just prefer a loose, friendly game rather than a really competative one (and let's face it, with free 'scape as the prize, it's gonna be competative...on all fronts ).

That said, I think the elves rule! Both games that I played that featured them had the elves kicking butt. In only one of them did even a single elf die (it's hard not to when facing Jotun...). There wasn't any height, either. Just a flat swamp with jungle trees and bushes everywhere.

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  #17  
Old June 30th, 2008, 09:39 AM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hal0fan117 View Post
Never underestimate the power of Acolarh. I played a 6OO point game with my little brother and his revival ability braught back Ulginesh twice, Jhordawn once, and Kyntela once. I ended up losing that game. If you still don`t like him, go roll 10 dice and see how often you get 3 of those pesky symbols. Not to mention the move enhancement. Emeroon summons him and moves to height, then summons him again.
The probability is about 22% of the time.

Ulginesh
Jorhdawn

Arkmer
Emiroon

This build is pretty easy to keep close enough together for Jorhdawn to Rain Fire down on your enemies while keeping Ulginesh out of harm's way. Arkmer is a beast if you get some common elf squads in the mix. I prefer the AA because of their ability to frenzy and their good range, but with only 120 points to spend they become less attractive.

I would consider either 1x AA + 1x WoA or 2x WoA + Kytella to fill these remaining points. The common elves can also help Emiroon with his summoning (although I always forget about his summoning bonus).

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  #18  
Old August 24th, 2020, 02:13 PM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Gonna necro this thread. I've got all the Elf Wizards except for Acolarh, and I'm trying to figure out when it'd make sense to try to bring them. Are they viable at all at lower point totals?

Looking at Orc's Power Rankings, he's got Arkmer at B+, so he's necessary/ the best value.
Ulginesh, Jorhdawn, and Kyntela Gwyn are all B's, and Ulginesh seems like the most essential to the function of the army. Emiroon is also a B, and seems helpful to get the pod set up quickly, but would Raelin be better?

Arkmer 50
Ulginesh 200
Jorhdawn 300
Kyntela Gwyn 320
Emiroon/Raelin 400

Even with the Raelin build above, that gives you a total of 4 Elf wizards, which is the minimum for J'dawn's attack to hit with 4 dice.

I've sold/lost most of my true bonding armies, so I'm struggling to decide what I'd play if I ever end up playing in something like a 4x400.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fomox View Post
(I've also played many matches with great, fun people who were using Q9. So using Q9 doesn't make you a tool. But being a tool sure seems to make you use Q9.)
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  #19  
Old August 24th, 2020, 02:22 PM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

I probably would go Emiroon over Raelin in that 400 point build. When you build an Elf Wizard army that instantly permanently loses Jorhdawn dice when Kyntela dies, good players will make sure Kyntela dies. Honestly even relying on Kyntela and Arkmer both is a little sketchy. I won a Gencon Main Event game vs. Ulg/Jorh/Arkmer/Kyntela/Chardris/Raelin pretty handily by focusing down Arkmer and Kyntela to neuter the fire wizards.

Emiroon is surprisingly solid too, especially for helping the Elves win games that they shouldn't via teleport tricks. Which is really what you need to pull out a 4x400 win with Elves lol.
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  #20  
Old August 24th, 2020, 02:34 PM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Yeah, I think I’m with Vegie on Emiroon in that build. I ran Arkmer, Kyntella, Johrdawn in Main Event a few years back (no Ulginesh), and the trick was to just kill Kyntella. It let me get free wins in RtW, and I was able to correctly protect Kyntella when I played it myself.

Also, if it’s at GenCon, we all have whatever you’d want to play. You can borrow whatever you need from at least me (and I’m almost positive Ken/Jeter would be willing to lend to you as well).

Edit: also, yes, Arkmer is the best value, imo. I think he’s a B+ even outside of Elf Wizards builds, assuming you’re running Raelin. He packs a lot of value for only 50 points (ok survivability, great attack, Engagement Strike).

Edit 2: I also had 2 squads of WoA in that build. I had Arkmer up to 6-8 defense pretty consistently, and that was without Raelin.
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  #21  
Old August 24th, 2020, 02:37 PM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Could always consider playing Haduc too, of C3V design. Automatic shields for OMs and Elven Supremacy to help d20 rolls.

But overall, the Elf Wizards aren’t that hot.

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  #22  
Old August 24th, 2020, 02:53 PM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
But overall, the Elf Wizards aren’t that hot.

So maybe weak enough for RtW, even if fairly optimized?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fomox View Post
(I've also played many matches with great, fun people who were using Q9. So using Q9 doesn't make you a tool. But being a tool sure seems to make you use Q9.)
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  #23  
Old August 24th, 2020, 04:15 PM
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Re: Wizards plus _____?

Elf wizards are a pretty good RtW pick. I ran them in 2016 (600 point total) and got to Day 2, and really the only reason I haven't run them since is because I like to do new things every year. A lot of people were trying to talk me into breaking them out again when they fit the Gencon 2018 490 point total nicely. Chill ran them that year and made it to Top 4.
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