Unit Debate #22 -- Su-Bak-Na Vs. Tor-Kul-Na

[MegaSilver]

Two of the Hivelords are having boarding house issues....

Which Hivelord, Su-Bak-Na, or Tor-Kul-Na, is the best?



1. Stats/Special Powers

2. Playability

3. Overall Usefulness

4. Who Would Win Head-To-Head

5. Army Builds

6. Best Strategic Use

7. Situational Usefulness

Next week:

Spoiler Alert!

Utgar minis.
This was submitted by tuba, elffy, and probably others...

MegaSilver

[nyys]

SBN, that +1 on the D20 always seems to play a big role.

[Toad Rocket]

Two hive lords, Two different functions

SKN is more a cheer leader with that +1 d20 roll buff that comes in handy for a number of Marro. He makes a decent clean up unit with flying and a heavy attack, just a wee bit fragile.

TKN is more like main battle tank. His stats abilities are such that you throw him into combat and see how much damage he can do.

[Jexik]

Tor-Kul-Na is a stomping good time. SBN has never been very useful in the size of games that I usually play. Maybe up in the 800+ range he could be good, but he's got Raelin-style defense at twice the cost!

[dok]

I think SBN is slightly underrated. (EDIT: after reading this thread, I no longer think that!) He was given a boost with the arrival of the nagrubs, and another with the arrival of the dividers. His d20 bonus is a good one (I argued it's worth about 30 points on its own in a SBN/grubs/divider army) and he is very good in the late game against opposing cheerleaders and cleanup heroes.

All of that said... he doesn't hold a candle to TKN. He's up there with Nilfheim and Q9 in terms of figures that are comfortable facing down both heroes and squads. His only real weakness is that the layout of the map can make trample stomp difficult to use. Yes, 220 points is a lot, but he's well worth it.

[Elginb]

I hate to vote against Su-Bak-Na-- he's cheaper, gives a boost to any number of Marro or Marrden units, and can fly (all great attributes in my book)-- but Tor-Kul-Na's one trick is pretty darn good, and his greater survivability is enough to edge out the bone dragon.

[A_Train]

It's really hard to compare these two, with such a vast difference in cost. Sure TBN is better, but is he 60 points better?

Actually probably.
I love SBN, he is my favorite figure, but I'd have to concede that TBN is more useful, in virtually all ways. Having said that, I am more likely to take TBN on his own, with maybe a set or two of nagrubs, but not necessarily any other Marro.

With SBN, it is likely that I am building and army of Drones, Dividers or Stingers and have full intentions of leaving at least 160 for SBN to boost them (and probably another 30 or 60 fo nagrubs).

[Lucas the beast]

I voted Su-Bak-Na he just seems to help out all the Marro so much because the +1 has always played a roll in the games I've used him. However he is a bit fragile. If you want a tank go Tor-Kul-na if you want synergy go Su-Bak-na. Either way always draft Nagrubs with these guys. It would have been better if you compared Wo-Sa-Ga and Su-Bak-Na closer in cost

-Lucas

[ABOMINATION]

Had to vote SBN. In a 500 point game, TBR is really going to eat up your points, and his ability doesn't work well unless you can have him stay on flat ground, which usually means that range will take him out. SBN can fly, has a beastly attack, and adds 1+ to rolls; his only weakness is his defense. That can be solved for the most part by the nagrubs, who he can bond with and live longer with. It's close, but I think that SBN would pull through in the end.

[clancampbell]

Stompy is just so much fun to play. Stepping on people is fun, and he's got a killer amount of attack dice to throw at those pesky hero's.

SBN can be usefull, but mostly he stands in the back while the rest of the army does the job.

Its really hard to compare the 2 directly because, as said, they preform different roles in an army.

I voted stompy, because I have more fun with him.

Imagine the fun you'd have if you could fit both into a build, an enhanced stomp would be even more fun!

[A_Train]

Originally Posted by clancampbell

Imagine the fun you'd have if you could fit both into a build, an enhanced stomp would be even more fun!

Tor Kul Na
Su Bak Na
Wo Sa Ga
Nagrubs x 6
695 points


Its a heck of a lot of fun, especially if you play against a hero heavy army. It sucks to play it against a mass of range squads (especially if the masses are 4th Masses.)

[Retlaw]

This one was almost flip a coin:

SBN:
Pro:

• helps out 20D rolls for marro
• high attack
• flies

Con:

• glass jaw - that 3 defense and 5 life just never seems to be enough
• usually relegated to a cheerleader role

TKN
Pro:

• stompy stompy stompy
• good defense and 6 life

Con:

• Cost 60 points more (i.e., one less squad of stingers)
• no fly = harder to move on battlefield

I went with TKN