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  #3745  
Old January 21st, 2014, 01:00 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

That's my fault about the Gruoark card. I rearranged my photobucket account on the assumption that people who had been using my cards from the MCC had saved them to their computers.



I believe this is still the most recent version.

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  #3746  
Old January 21st, 2014, 01:07 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

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Originally Posted by Ixe View Post
Yep, I've been playtesting with C3V as I can. I've done the ones they currently have up and they've already filled the one I haven't. I read that a way to become more involved with the customs community is to post constructively on these threads, so I'm offering opinions as I can. It is okay, right? Let me know if I'm overstepping my bounds.
Yup, you're fine, I just wanted to be sure your thoughtfulness was also being applied to C3V units (and I now remember reading one of your reports; it was well done).

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  #3747  
Old January 21st, 2014, 02:45 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

I love the idea of Gruoark being a close in fighter that leads his troll army through example. Even with high life and regenerate, I can see that there might still be a bit of a risk in loading order markers on the conqueror and risk losing him. He looks to be pretty reasonable against squads in that he should be able to reliably destroy one and call in his troll brethren. I love to see support for interesting army builds that would otherwise never be possible. Without him, a group of trolls wouldn't be able to do much of anything with the sharks all fighting for order markers.

The sculpt looks awesome, but I would minorly disagree with the planet you put him on. While he does look much closer to Krug than the Feral Troll in skin color, there hasn't been any evidence that the trolls from Feylund can actually regenerate. As any seasoned D&D player can tell you, there are tons of different subspecies of troll so Gruoark could easily be from Toril or even Eberron and just have some slightly different cosmetic appearance. I suppose he could still be from Feylund as just a different subspecies that regenerates, for that matter.

I look forward to hearing how he plays and hope he can withstand the scrutiny and join the ranks of accepted custom units.
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  #3748  
Old January 21st, 2014, 03:20 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Sundol looks like a beautiful unit just dripping with flavor. Blaze of Glory is just perfectly named. Having a big giant with reasonable stats (who is even an option to bond with the dreadgul raiders) seems like something to be happy with even if you never get the chance to make him explode.

The tension created between wanting to load up on wounds to maximize the area of the blaze certainly seems like an interesting one, and 5 spaces out can certainly hit a lot of units. The fact that he needs a few wounds first to hit a larger area seems to inherently limit him going off too soon and doing too much damage too early, a problem with the swinginess of Deathwalker 7000.

One thing that always bothered me about the deathwalker was that it was supposed to go off in this big explosion, but it would only affect those immediately adjacent to it. It could be the force of 8 unblockable wounds but only encompass the area of a hand grenade (even less if that grenade hit a double based figure). In contrast, it seems that Sundol blazing out should feel like a proper firestorm bursting out across the battlefield. The fact that it deals at most 1 wound makes it much painful for squads. Meanwhile, while Deathwalker 7000 could act as a limited anti-range unit, it really didn't offer much besides an uninspiring bomb. In contrast, Sundol is still an impressive giant who can deal some damage with his 5 attack before exploding.

I have no idea how he actually plays and how well he does. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if some of the details of the numbers needed to be tweaked overall. For one, he needs to take a few wounds before going out so, depending on how you play him, both sides may already be diminished or at least more spread out in figures by the time he is ready to go. When he does, particularly if you were bonding him with the non-lava resistant dreadgulls, there is a chance that you will catch one or two of your own. Still, within a 4 space area it would not be unreasonable to catch 4-6 enemy units to your 1-2, burning on average a little over two units of the lot of them, most likely on their side. Killing two or three squad members before dying isn't too terrible, considering that he probably killed a few before that point. It can be especially useful against high point and evasive squads like the minions or the krav, but against low point squads I can see it potentially being tough to kill his points worth. Again, I'd have to play with it more and see what's reasonable to be around him before he explodes in given matches to get a better sense of what his average would be. I wouldn't be surprised if that target number could be bumped down a shade or two.

Overall, great looking unit. I look forward to hearing how he tests.
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  #3749  
Old January 21st, 2014, 05:18 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixe View Post
Yep, I've been playtesting with C3V as I can. I've done the ones they currently have up and they've already filled the one I haven't. I read that a way to become more involved with the customs community is to post constructively on these threads, so I'm offering opinions as I can. It is okay, right? Let me know if I'm overstepping my bounds.
Yeah, it's perfectly ok that you're giving your opinions. Obviously you're "vote" doesn't count, but your thoughts can provide some valuable insight for us Judges.
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  #3750  
Old January 21st, 2014, 06:21 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Grommel Bronzewielder certainly looks like a cool unit (and one I already have, so bonus), and I do like how the theme of his hammer is carried through his card between his attack and Foe Hammer 14 power.

Foe Hammer certainly seems fun and potentially incredibly satisfying to land against your opponent's figures. The crucial and for affected figures being adjacent to both the original target and Grommel keeps the area from getting ridiculous. I like that you only need to roll once instead of each the affected figures as well, as you do for some other powers. It will only hit at most two anyway (unless they ever make some strangely convex heroes, I suppose), and can be particularly devastating to squads once you land it. I also noticed that you can bump off your own in the process, too, so you may have to be careful with how you place him or sometimes just take the risk.

Otherwise, I must concur with vegietarian18 over a few questions raised. If we strive for thematic consistency behind the numbers, one could scratch their head at where his life and move come from. I understand that they can be essential for the build to perform, but without some kind of explanation for why he is so beefy and quick, it doesn't feel quite right. I don't feel that he necessarily needs a defensive power, but I could see bringing his move and life down by 1 and increasing his defense by one as reasonable for the build and mold. You cited his defense being low because of how he looks, but the figure is actually wearing a full suit of armor. The red is just a tabard over it, but the steel underneath will still protect you just as well. Plenty of dwarves are able to move 6 anyway, so that might not really have to change. I personally don't think it matters if he doesn't follow Aquilla or doesn't have a defensive power. I think the game needs to be allowed to grow without us extrapolating wildly on what the original creators would have done. There are plenty of cases of trends that were set only to be overturned, like Einar finally getting some non-historical units.

The thing I am having the most trouble with is the tactical repositioning. I admire an ability that provides any alternative to the annoyingly effective rats, but my concerns fall in line with vegietarian18 for this one. There isn't really an option to try to avoid it except for different order marker placement, and the times that it does trigger is for against unique heroes. I just wonder if that amounts to kicking the guy in last place, metaphorically speaking (that would probably be either the common heroes or unique squads, if I had to guess). Though I suppose, flavor wise, the axegrinders are most effective against the big guys who themselves are typically unique heroes. Maybe it gives them some crucial edge in certain match ups against tough heroes, but I fear that vegietarian18 may be right in that it will make a rather unfun game state for your opponent in a few too many match ups. In the competitive front, there is so much bonding running around that the ability may never trigger in the first place.

In general, I think this a solid unit with a lot of potential. I admire the attempt at an alternative scatter through a hero, and I think there are options available for that, still. Imagine if it was flavored to be reinforcements for every time he was attacked in melee with a normal attack, or if he capitalized on his foe hammer type ability and could call for a charge after landing the special strike. I'm only taking stabs at the dark, but I think there is plenty of unexplored space to discover something that works great.

Last edited by Ixe; January 21st, 2014 at 06:40 PM. Reason: typos/didn't finish a sentence
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  #3751  
Old January 21st, 2014, 06:50 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

Ixe you should totally pop over to the Pre SOV thread while your at it. There's at least 4 units over there that would appreciate a thorough once over like what you've got here.

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  #3752  
Old January 21st, 2014, 07:25 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

I really like Jarek Guy and the contribution he makes to the story within Heroscape. I love the idea of his suit being more or less a proto-soulborg and what that says about what happened on Alpha Prime. The figure otherwise looks great, with his stats fitting great for his figure. I like that even though he has two swords, you didn't force him to have double attack. Double attack is a great power and I don't bat an eye when a unit dual wielding has it, but there are plenty of examples of figures with twin swords without the power, like Cyprien.

Exosuit is great power for representing the suit and effectively boosts his defense. It's nice to see repeatable grenades on a unit after the airborne elite, and the short range keeps it him in melee. I can see some tough decisions where you have to choose whether or not to hit yourself with the grenade, even if it's just to stop the deathreavers from scattering.

With the Mariedians, he seems like a great addition on paper with potential outside just that one army. I hope that he continues to test well and get through the gauntlet to become inducted into SoV.
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  #3753  
Old January 21st, 2014, 07:28 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

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Ixe you should totally pop over to the Pre SOV thread while your at it. There's at least 4 units over there that would appreciate a thorough once over like what you've got here.
Oh, I'm planning on it. Doing the rounds first : P. I'm working on some customs of my own right now, too, and I will definitely submit them to Pre SoV once I work through them a bit.
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  #3754  
Old January 21st, 2014, 10:25 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

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Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
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The fire ants by Scytale seem interesting. I can't see anything flagrant about them for them not to be reviewed and play-tested further,
Expect an update on them soon. They have been on hold for a while for reasons that will become apparent.
Is the problem that it may become confusing to identify which ants did or did not move that turn for who gets the attack bonus? I guess I can see that being an issue.
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  #3755  
Old January 21st, 2014, 11:29 PM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

I updated the picture for Gruoark, but I still need Ti move the image to my photobucket account. Because of Ixe's comment I realized that I accidentally wrote Feylund as his home world even though I meant it to be Toril. Hopefully this wasn't a big thing in the unified review and won't cause problems.
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  #3756  
Old January 22nd, 2014, 10:57 AM
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Re: Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

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Is the problem that it may become confusing to identify which ants did or did not move that turn for who gets the attack bonus? I guess I can see that being an issue.
No, that's not even anything new to remember. With most common squads you need to remember which ones you moved, as those are activated and may attack, and you can attack with any others beyond that.

There's a fair amount of contention over the Soldier class, but there's another reason as well that I'll elaborate on later.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toogwick_tuk View Post
I updated the picture for Gruoark, but I still need Ti move the image to my photobucket account. Because of Ixe's comment I realized that I accidentally wrote Feylund as his home world even though I meant it to be Toril. Hopefully this wasn't a big thing in the unified review and won't cause problems.
There wasn't any concern about the homeworld either way in UF review. I don't think changing it to Toril will cause a problem (and I think it fits better too).
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