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  #1045  
Old June 25th, 2010, 11:37 PM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

Stimulating discussion in the theoryscape thread? Sarpedon, you thread is finally earning some respect. Don't let it go to your head.


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  #1046  
Old June 25th, 2010, 11:42 PM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

I wish I had read this tread before I posted this.. That said, KA...let me know when you all are doing a non-weekend event, and I'll do my best to be there; just for a game evening or whatever.
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  #1047  
Old June 26th, 2010, 02:23 PM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

I think many/most scapers play various type of games. Every time it comes up people talk about how they draft, move, attack, house rule, have different goals, maps, custom figures, etc., different than the "tournament" standard.

However much like Standard Italian in Italy we need a common ground so we can communicate. I may never play a normal tournament but I know how it works and can discuss it. This is the common ground I write strategy articles from, since if I based them on my random Draw games no one would understand why I think Expensive units are so good, and cheerleaders suck.

I think the problem is we forget to add the pinch of salt to our discussions to make sure everyone knows we are talking about the simple and arbitrary tournament rules.


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  #1048  
Old June 26th, 2010, 05:10 PM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

The Italian analogy is a good one, wriggz. We all speak dialects of our HeroScape experience and local "culture." When we speak together, we do best when we modulate our language to communicate and share our points-of-view.
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  #1049  
Old June 28th, 2010, 02:49 AM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

Can 1x commons ever be effective? I based an army around 1x KoW, Krav, and the vikings. What I did was bonded with 3 KoW and sent out all 3 Vikings. When they died their spirits went on the Krav, who then wipped the map.

My question to you guys is are there any other builds where 1x commons are effective.

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  #1050  
Old June 28th, 2010, 03:10 AM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

Quote:
Originally Posted by tcglkn View Post
Can 1x commons ever be effective? I based an army around 1x KoW, Krav, and the vikings. What I did was bonded with 3 KoW and sent out all 3 Vikings. When they died their spirits went on the Krav, who then wipped the map.

My question to you guys is are there any other builds where 1x commons are effective.
The problem with 1x Commons is that once figures start dying, you get less than full value for an order marker. Therefore, the squads that can be effective at 1x have to either have use that doesn't require order markers, or have a use that isn't significantly reduced by losing figures.

An example of the first type is the Deathreavers. Once they are in position, you get the most use by Scattering when your opponent attacks them. They don't require order markers so they can be useful at 1x (although more are better).

An example of the second type could be 1x Arrow Gruts with multiple Beasts. In this case, you aren't using the Gruts at all - all you care about is their Beast Bonding. The Grut card is just a place to put Order Marker to give you flexibility with your Beasts. This is basically what you did with your 1x Knights and multiple Human Champions. Any cheap squads with multiple bonding options could work like this, but the Arrow Gruts are especially nice because they are so cheap (fewer wasted points).
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  #1051  
Old June 28th, 2010, 03:15 AM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

Quote:
Originally Posted by tcglkn View Post
Can 1x commons ever be effective? I based an army around 1x KoW, Krav, and the vikings. What I did was bonded with 3 KoW and sent out all 3 Vikings. When they died their spirits went on the Krav, who then wipped the map.

My question to you guys is are there any other builds where 1x commons are effective.
Yeah, what you said with the vikings/knights, greenscales x1 with Zelrig (grab some glyphs while you bomb). Rats x1 often makes a good filler. Nagrubs x1 is a good filler if you have a hivelord. Gorrilanators, since they are just Nakita shields, and you never put OM's on them (at least with one squad). Sentinelsx1 will last for a while. Repulsors x1 for filler in a sniper army, or if you are playing Cyprein.

Last edited by TurtleKing99; June 28th, 2010 at 09:12 PM.
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  #1052  
Old August 7th, 2010, 06:35 PM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarpedon View Post
To me, a competitive unit is one that I would include in my tournament army that I believe (key word) gives me the best chance to win that particular tournament.
The key word in that definition is "best". So, for you, a competitive unit must be the best (in your opinion) at some point level (and format) in order to be competitive? Is that accurate?

If that's what you think, then I guess I agree with you that the Fen Hydra isn't competitive in that sense. After all, other than for a fairly narrow set of drafting situations that don't really count, I can't think of a scenario where the Fen Hydra is the absolute #1 pick for me. Very close to #1, maybe, but not all the way there.
I've changed my mind.

The Fen Hydra is competitive, full stop. Three of the four armies in the semifinals had a Hydra.
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  #1053  
Old August 7th, 2010, 06:38 PM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

How many had Hydras in their Regular Build and how many added a Hydra for their Reinforcement
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  #1054  
Old August 7th, 2010, 06:40 PM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

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Originally Posted by Devil's Advocate View Post
How many had Hydras in their Regular Build and how many added a Hydra for their Reinforcement
Ronin and I both had it on day 1.
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  #1055  
Old August 13th, 2010, 04:02 AM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post
The Fen Hydra is competitive, full stop. Three of the four armies in the semifinals had a Hydra.
Just wondering, how well do you think the Hydra would of done without rats?

The rats compliment a lot of units, any ranged unit seems better with them. That being said, the Hydra is borderline competitive and I think the rats are what pushes it over that line. With no rats, you just have a big, slow moving, 2-range unit that common squads can get to, easily. It's a fairly cheap unit for it's stats and I can see why you chose it for you're army.

For 30 more points you can have a very fast hero killer, Cyprien. He does the same thing the Hydra does for Q9, and that is protect him from heavy hitter hero's. Except, he is a lot faster and could potentially be more of a threat. The big difference is that the Hydra is a lot worse when it engages and Cyprien doesn't give a damn where he goes.

I have been play-testing (quite a bit, actually)
Rats X3
Q9
Krav
Cyprien
at 550

and I can see it doing better then the Hydra build.

Gencon is different though, you have to plan an army that will do good in day 1 and have units that actually benefit the army to re-enforce.

So how about
Rats X3
Q9
Cyprien
Sonya

That could make day 2 without too much trouble.
Add Krav for day 2.

You are sacrificing Raelin, but you're getting some lethal offense that is sure to get there.

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  #1056  
Old August 13th, 2010, 04:20 AM
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Re: 100% Theoryscape

Raelin adds so much to the army. Boosting Rats from 4 base to 6 Defense is huge (and that isn't mentioning insane 8 def for Hydra and 9 def for Q9)

The Hydra is the Better choice for the following reasons:

-Can use the Rat screen better whereas Cyprien needs to become engaged

-Hydra is more reliable. 4 attacks of 4 is more reliable than a high chilling touch number more often than not

-The Hydra is infinitely better vs Soulborgs than Cyprien if you need something to attack them.

-Huge Size Immunity helps protect him from some powers (for example Chomp)
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