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  #49  
Old September 1st, 2012, 06:30 PM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

Finally updating... sorry for the delay.

Arashara Goshiri: A ton of points to sink into such a frail figure, but if you keep her safe, Shifting Sands can be positively game-changing. B+

Command Courier: Very nice filler for a Vydar army, providing a meat shield, Order Marker flexibility, and a decent cleanup force. B

Deathstrike Thrall: Their powerful self-sacrifice attack synergizes nicely with Nicky and the Preybloods. But it does, you know, kill them. C+

Elaria the Pale: Even if her cheerleading abilities are tricky to use, she is tough to take down in cleanup. B+

Havech Eradicators: Great stats justify the price. Generally, you're better off taking a melee attack if you can find one, but the risky ranged attack gives you valuable tactical flexibility. B+

Martial La Hire: Strong stats for a low price, but tough to get into position before endgame. B

Myrddin: Effective either as a special attacker with the 4th, or as a booster for high-leverage d20 powers. B

Priscus: the adjacency requirement prevents him from being truly effective as a low-cost replacement for Spartacus, but he remains a solid gladiator hero that brings a much-needed special attack. B

Skeletons of Annellintia: Devastating with a hot d20, but can require subtle play to take advantage of the animation mechanic. B+

Skull Demons
: Obnoxiously hard to kill for common squads. Effective either as a standalone hero or as a booster for the Death Knights, who can really use the extra attack. B+.

Ulfrid Hornwrangler: A strong frontline hero with a powerful special attack that can be used to assassinate a key hero or clear a key space. And even if it backfires, at least your Axegrinders are fast. A-

Vulcanmech Incendiborgs
: If they can work their way to high ground before their markers are gone, they will often dominate the game. A-

I guess the only ones where I'm really breaking from the consensus are the Command Courier and the Skull Demon. The CC is hardly gamebreaking, but a defensive power, and free extra moves, is a nice little package. Throwing a few couriers in with Skahen makes for lots of movement synergy. And the Skull Demon is just really nice at shoring up the front line in a Valkrill army.
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  #50  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 12:25 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

Great job Dok! FYI, Vulcanmech Incendiborgs are spelled wrong in the master list.

Once again, an incredibly balanced wave. It is funny the most powerful C3V card (by rank) is a Unique Squad. Underpowered no more!
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  #51  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 12:43 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

Although I haven't used her, I'm not quite sure Arashara deserves a B+, much less any B grade at all. She really doesn't seem like she can do enough to earn her points. If she were ranged, then I might change my tune, but as is all you can do with her turn is chance a Shifting Sands roll and a melee attack of 4. Her being pretty frail also means that using her attack might be an effective way of blowing two-fifths of a standard army. I'm not saying that she's a waste of points (I'm sure than in a Roman build, she'll be used to get your soldiers turtling very easily even after some wounds have been put on them), but I would think that more soldiers would be better. Or at least more durable Warlords.

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  #52  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 01:18 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Although I haven't used her, I'm not quite sure Arashara deserves a B+, much less any B grade at all. She really doesn't seem like she can do enough to earn her points. If she were ranged, then I might change my tune, but as is all you can do with her turn is chance a Shifting Sands roll and a melee attack of 4. Her being pretty frail also means that using her attack might be an effective way of blowing two-fifths of a standard army. I'm not saying that she's a waste of points (I'm sure than in a Roman build, she'll be used to get your soldiers turtling very easily even after some wounds have been put on them), but I would think that more soldiers would be better. Or at least more durable Warlords.
Romans (and Sacred Band) are quite cheap, so an expensive bonding hero is feasible for them at regular point totals.

Shifting Sands is an incredibly versatile power. You can move Raelin or other non-bonding cheerleaders around without wasting OMs by sand shifting them with Arashara or with squad figures. You can assassinate opposing cheerleaders or hoeroes by yanking them into the middle of a pack of Romans/Greeks. You can steal glyphs from opponents with ease. You can toss opposing figures on lava fields on turn 3. You can switch opposing figures to low ground, a-la Warforged. The list goes on.

And yes, it sucks when your 200 point figure dies quickly, which can happen. That's why she's not in the "A" range.
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  #53  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 01:50 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Although I haven't used her, I'm not quite sure Arashara deserves a B+, much less any B grade at all. She really doesn't seem like she can do enough to earn her points. If she were ranged, then I might change my tune, but as is all you can do with her turn is chance a Shifting Sands roll and a melee attack of 4. Her being pretty frail also means that using her attack might be an effective way of blowing two-fifths of a standard army. I'm not saying that she's a waste of points (I'm sure than in a Roman build, she'll be used to get your soldiers turtling very easily even after some wounds have been put on them), but I would think that more soldiers would be better. Or at least more durable Warlords.
Romans (and Sacred Band) are quite cheap, so an expensive bonding hero is feasible for them at regular point totals.

Shifting Sands is an incredibly versatile power. You can move Raelin or other non-bonding cheerleaders around without wasting OMs by sand shifting them with Arashara or with squad figures. You can assassinate opposing cheerleaders or heroes by yanking them into the middle of a pack of Romans/Greeks. You can steal glyphs from opponents with ease. You can toss opposing figures on lava fields on turn 3. You can switch opposing figures to low ground, a-la Warforged. The list goes on.

And yes, it sucks when your 200 point figure dies quickly, which can happen. That's why she's not in the "A" range.
But all of that is still assuming that she gets her roll. Yes, it might be easy, but nobody claims how overly strong the NotNW are. If she fails her roll, she likely puts herself in the very thick of the battle (a range of 4 for 2 separate figures isn't very long and might not be easy to get), which is a very easy way of losing her. You get a really cool power, but that power is atrociously dangerous to use.

Versatility doesn't mean great, just ask Sonlen.

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  #54  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 02:01 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

How good would Sonlen be if he bonded with Romans?
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  #55  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 02:07 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post
How good would Sonlen be if he bonded with Romans?
Considering he's ranged, I'd think he'd be a better with them than Ara. Cheaper too.

I'm not trying to make a case for any unit here, I'm just trying to say that Arashara probably isn't worth the points in a tournament setting, where more Romans/Greeks would be much more effective. Arashara is just way too casual, and maybe a bit too weak on the survivable side to be a B. I could see her being at a C range though.

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Last edited by flameslayer93; September 2nd, 2012 at 02:08 AM. Reason: Discussing HS in the wee hours of the night... This is what heroscapers is about...
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  #56  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 09:04 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post
How good would Sonlen be if he bonded with Romans?
Considering he's ranged, I'd think he'd be a better with them than Ara. Cheaper too.

I'm not trying to make a case for any unit here, I'm just trying to say that Arashara probably isn't worth the points in a tournament setting, where more Romans/Greeks would be much more effective. Arashara is just way too casual, and maybe a bit too weak on the survivable side to be a B. I could see her being at a C range though.
Ya know, you can only theoryscape so much..... Why don't you give her a try?

I think you might just change your mind.....

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  #57  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 10:01 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

Quote:
Originally Posted by boromir96 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post
How good would Sonlen be if he bonded with Romans?
Considering he's ranged, I'd think he'd be a better with them than Ara. Cheaper too.

I'm not trying to make a case for any unit here, I'm just trying to say that Arashara probably isn't worth the points in a tournament setting, where more Romans/Greeks would be much more effective. Arashara is just way too casual, and maybe a bit too weak on the survivable side to be a B. I could see her being at a C range though.
Ya know, you can only theoryscape so much..... Why don't you give her a try?

I think you might just change your mind.....
She is swingy, but when she swings your way it is impressive. I have only used her 3 times and 2 of 3 she was the difference. I do agree she will unlikely be a tournament mainstay do to her points.
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  #58  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 10:15 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

I think Iskra deserves a boost. For only 50 points, she is a good option with skeletons. 4x skeletons, Iskra, Isamu, and Marcu is good for 500. 4x skeletons is good, and Iskra reborns an average of 15.5 skeletons, or almost the same amount you started with!
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  #59  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 11:01 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gurei-Ornery View Post
She is swingy, but when she swings your way it is impressive. I have only used her 3 times and 2 of 3 she was the difference. I do agree she will unlikely be a tournament mainstay do to her points.
She can be devastating when she hits her rolls. If she doesn't hit her Shifting Sands rolls, that's why you have a lot of cheap Greeks/Romans to act as a screen. Since Arashara moves before her squad, she can be surrounded by Greeks/Romans after her turn to protect her.

It is the unexpectedness and incredible versatality that gives Arashara her strength. Glyphs aren't safe, Raelin isn't safe, Cyprien isn't safe, she can move figures from the back to the front, the list goes on. Definitely play her with Raelin if the point totals allow, having Raelin really helps Arashara's survivability and you never need to place an order marker on Raelin to get her in position.
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  #60  
Old September 2nd, 2012, 11:17 AM
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Re: C3V/SoV-inclusive Power Rankings

I'll be another to say that Arashara, while swingy, should be a B+. While the roll for SS is high enough that it might never work, it's also low enough to make your opponent try hard to avoid it, even if the alternative is a slightly worse position.

In one game I played, she made one SS roll to move her opponent's Raelin towards her just a few spaces, failed an attack roll, then died. Yet that one move was just enough to give the rest of her army the win, because the other army was so much weaker without Raelin.

I agree with those CC and Demon rankings, dok. I've seen both in action, and know that they can win you games.

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