Heroes of Star Trek (HoST) Discussion Thread

[Just_a_Bill]

Trying to start the ball rolling (again) on converting the $15 WizKids Star Trek: Tactics Away Team pack (Kirk, Spock, McCoy, Scotty, Uhura, Sulu, and Chekov) into classic-style Heroscape figures.

General Thoughts

• With only seven sculpts* available, the goal is to create classic-style units for the regular game without a bunch of special rules, icons, etc. Players can mix these figures into the game normally, or play specifically against something like a Marro or Soulborg theme army for an "Enterprise crew vs. space monsters" scenario. (*Maybe someday there'll be more Trek clix, but we can't assume that. If it does happen, we can always redefine all this any way we want.) I'm approaching this as basically a two- or three-booster expansion set for classic Scape. Like, what if Hasbro somehow had the Trek license and made a very small number of Trek figures, in normal boosters for playing with the normal game.
  
  
• For now, assume these guys fight for an existing general (perhaps Jandar or Einar). There really aren't enough sculpts to justify creating a whole new general. But, it may be possible or desirable to do them like Marvel, where there really is no general. For synergy effects, we will want to be able to refer to the "Starfleet people" as a group, and it may be that the general could be the way to do that, or we might have to have an icon — though I hope to avoid any special rules, since normal Hasbro boosters didn't introduce new rules. Ideally, a player should be able to pick up any one of these units, add it to an army, and start playing correctly using only the Army Card.
  
  
• Which reveals the fact that I will be caring just as much about theme and design elegance as I will about getting all the math right.
  
  
• Regardless of sculpts, assume all characters have phasers and thus all have range. (Or maybe Bones doesn't get range, since he's too busy trying to heal people and being a sniper isn't all that compatible with the Hippocratic Oath.)
  
  
• With these deeply established iconic characters, it's probably best to work on special powers first and get them just right before worrying about stats and costs too early.
  
  
• In general, though, they will largely have the same Attack numbers, since everybody has range. Spock's super-human strength, for example, doesn't really make him a far better phaser shot than Scotty. Good fighting ability (Kirk, Spock, Sulu) will thus need to be reflected in the special powers. For example, Sulu's main special should be a scaled-down version of SWORD OF RECKONING in acknowledgement of his "combat fencing training" and the sword shown in the sculpt. That Agent Carr approach probably makes sense for Spock as well, and he could have extra-high Defense to recognize his Vulcan strength and uncanny immunities. McCoy should have the lowest Attack (1 point below everyone else) due to his age and reluctance to kill (Hippocratic Oath again). However, he could have a special ability that gives him an adjacent Defense bonus (remember how he deftly used his thumb to turf Elias Sandoval in The Paradise Syndrome?).
  
  
• We'll probably have to recognize that some of the special abilites these characters have will, by necessity, be more lethal in Heroscape than on TV (such as Kirk's habit of knocking lots of people unconscious).
  
  
• For game balance, we'll want to ignore the fact that "real" phasers would instantly destroy whatever figure they hit. Perhaps we can assume that in a chaotic fog-of-war battle scenario, Kirk would order the phasers dialed to a setting somewhere between Stun and Kill — let's call it Wound — to minimize the chance of collateral casualties. (Yes, phasers actually had graduated settings even in TOS.)

Rather than jump into any of the numerics too soon, in the next post I'll list my initial thoughts on thematic special powers.

[Just_a_Bill]

Captain James T. Kirk



FISTICUFFS 2
If Captain James T. Kirk is attacking an adjacent figure, add 2 dice to Kirk's attack.

ROUNDHOUSE PUNCH SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 1. Attack [4]. Choose any number of small and/or medium figures adjacent to Captain James T. Kirk. Roll attack dice once for all affected figures. Each figure rolls defense dice separately. You cannot inflict more than one wound per figure using Roundhouse Punch Special Attack.

(Inspired by what is perhaps Kirk's silliest and best mass-knockdown ever, in "A Taste of Armageddon.")

CAPTAIN'S ORDERS
If order marker 1 is placed on Captain James T. Kirk, then instead of taking that turn with him, you may take a turn with up to 2 other [Starfleet personnel] Heroes you control. Any [Starfleet personnel] Hero that is taking a turn instead of Captain James T. Kirk must be within 8 clear sight spaces of Kirk prior to its movement.

(Templated from Ornak's Red Flag of Fury Aura.)

STARFLEET INSPIRATION
If all Order Markers for a round are placed on [Starfleet personnel] Army Cards, and at least one Order Marker is placed on Captain James T. Kirk, then all [other] [Starfleet personnel] you control (except Captain James T. Kirk) become inspired. Inspired figures add one to their Move number and 1 extra attack die and defense die for the rest of the round.

(Templated from Spartacus' Gladiator Inspiration, with brevity revision. Need to figure out how best to indicate "Starfleet personnel.")

(Kirk has too many special powers, and currentely overlaps functionality with the Starfleet Security Detail; but I want to keep all these ideas in place for now.)

Commander Spock



VULCAN STRENGTH 3
If Commander Spock is attacking an adjacent figure, add 3 dice to Spock's attack.

NERVE PINCH
Instead of attacking, you may choose any small or medium figure adjacent to Commander Spock. Roll the 20-sided die. If you roll higher than the chosen figure's (Life + Move + Defense – wound markers), remove all order markers from the chosen figure's Army Card (or cards if your opponent has more than one Common card for that figure) and no special powers may be used on those Army Card(s) for the rest of this round. Nerve Pinch does not affect Constructs, Soulborgs, Warforged, Undead, or destructible objects.

(A little too much math, perhaps. But I kinda want to mull it for a while.)

MINDMELD
If Commander Spock inflicts a wound (or successfully uses Nerve Pinch) on an adjacent opponent's unique figure and that figure is not destroyed, you may look at all of that opponent's order markers. Mindmeld does not work against destructible objects.

Dr. Leonard McCoy



HEALING TOUCH
After moving and before attacking, choose a wounded hero figure adjacent to Dr. Leonard McCoy. Then roll the 20-sided die to add or remove wound markers from the chosen figure's card: If you roll 1, add 2 markers. If you roll 2-5, remove 1 marker. If you roll 6-17, remove up to 2 markers. If you roll 18-20, remove all markers.

(Copied directly from Kelda the Kyrie Warrior — although I think a variation on this healing effect may be better for Bones. It just needs to retain "Healing" in the title if Sulu keeps his botany thing.)

EXOANATOMY KNOWLEDGE [1]
When rolling defense dice against a normal attack from an adjacent figure, Dr. Leonard McCoy adds [1] die.

HE'S DEAD, JIM
When a friendly figure within [6] clear sight spaces of Dr. Leonard McCoy is destroyed, before removing that figure you may place McCoy on any empty space adjacent to that figure. If you do so and Captain James T. Kirk is now within [6] clear sight spaces of McCoy, you may place Kirk on any empty space adjacent to McCoy before removing the destroyed figure. Figures who are engaged when they start to move for He's Dead, Jim will take any leaving engagement attacks.

(Maybe Bones doesn't get range.)

Lt. Cmdr. Montgomery Scott



SITE-TO-SITE BEAMING [10]/[16]
If Lt. Cmdr. Montgomery Scott begins his turn unengaged, instead of moving and attacking normally, he may use Site-to-Site Beaming. Choose any one friendly figure within [6] clear sight spaces of Scott, along with up to two other friendly figures adjacent to the first one and on the same level. Roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 1, the chosen figures are destroyed. If you roll a 2–[9], nothing happens. If you roll a [10] or higher, place the chosen figures anywhere on the battlefield as an adjacent grouping all on the same level. A figure moved by Site-to-Site beaming never takes any leaving engagement attacks. If you roll a [16] or higher, after beaming you may take a turn with one Army Card belonging to any of the beamed figures.

(The first sentence is templated from Samuel Brown's Fire and Rush Special Attack. The beamed figures must be "adjacent" as a group, meaning a row of three is okay even though the two end figures are not immediately adjacent to each other; this follows the same understanding of "adjacent to each other" used on Roman Archers. Note also that this special power conceptually does not require the Enterprise to be orbiting Valhalla; rather, the storyline would be that your army has stolen some tech from Tul-Bak-Ra, and Scotty has figured out how to use it. It's a bit of a stretch, but I'm taking some inspiration from Airborne Elite's The Drop, which replaces aircraft with Kyrie flying really, really high.)

DISARM TRAPS
When you roll the 20-sided die for a Treasure Glyph trap with Lt. Cmdr. Montgomery Scott, you may add 4 to your die roll.

(Copied directly from Darrak Ambershard.)

Lt. Nyota Uhura



INTERCEPT TRANSMISSIONS
If at least one order marker is on Lt. Nyota Uhura, you may add or subtract 4 from your initiative roll. For each opponent who controls any Soulborgs, you may add or subtract 2 more from your initiative roll.

(Needs a second special power.)

Lt. Hikaru Sulu



COMBAT TRAINING 3
If Lt. Hikaru Sulu is attacking an adjacent figure, add 3 dice to Lt. Hikaru Sulu's attack.

EXOBOTANY
You may add 2 to your die roll when you roll for any Healing power on any Army Card if either the healing figure or the figure to be healed is adjacent to an Evergreen Tree, Jungle Piece, or other plant.

Ensign Pavel Chekov



NAVIGATION [8]/[2]
All friendly [Starfleet personnel] figures within [8] clear sight spaces of Ensign Pavel Chekov may add [2] to their Move number as long as they start at a lower level than Chekov.

(Partly templated from Kozuke Samurai's Charging Assault.)

SITE-TO-SITE BEAMING [12]/[18]
If Ensign Pavel Chekov begins his turn unengaged, instead of moving and attacking normally, he may use Site-to-Site Beaming. Choose any one friendly figure within [6] clear sight spaces of Chekov, along with up to two other friendly figures adjacent to the first one and on the same level. Roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 1, the chosen figures are destroyed. If you roll a 2–[11], nothing happens. If you roll a [12] or higher, place the chosen figures anywhere on the battlefield as an adjacent grouping all on the same level. A figure moved by Site-to-Site beaming never takes any leaving engagement attacks. If you roll an [18] or higher, after beaming you may take a turn with one Army Card belonging to any of the beamed figures.

(Works just like Scotty's version, but the die rolls are 2 units more difficult.)

Starfleet Security Detail

Squad of three, made by repainting and slightly hacking a second copy of the Away Team pack. The Kirk sculpt gets a red shirt and a new hair color (a good color, not the crappy baby-poop yellow abomination you see in this photoshop hack). The Scotty sculpt becomes African-American (which helps further diversify the crew & maximize visual distinctiveness, since the pose and tunic remain the same as normal Scotty) and gets his tech tool clipped off, but keeps his communicator. The Sulu sculpt gets a red shirt and a dye job, loses his sword, and takes a phaser from the extra Uhura. Ideally the squad would be common, but I think it has to be unique (reasons are in my next post).



RED SHIRTS
Any time a figure you control would receive one or more wounds, you may instead destroy an adjacent Starfleet Security Detail member.

AWAITING YOUR ORDERS, SIR
After revealing an order marker on this Army Card, before taking a turn with the Starfleet Security Detail, you may take a turn with one [Starfleet personnel] Hero you control that still has unrevealed order marker(s) on its Army Card.

(Kinda overlaps with Kirk, but I really like how this effect makes you carefully consider OM placement on the heroes, and makes the "X" marker quite valuable.)

PHASERS AT THE READY
If one to three Starfleet Security Detail members you control are successfully transported by Site-to-Site Beaming, you may then take a turn with those figures. Each use of Site-to-Site Beaming may result in only one extra turn for the Starfleet Security Detail.

(Too many specials, of course. Just getting all the ideas on the table.)

Nurse Chapel

After stealing the spare Uhura's phaser for the redshirts, I'm hoping it won't be too difficult to turn that Uhura into a Chapel.



SURGICAL ASSISTANCE [2]
You may add [2] to your die roll when you roll for any Healing power on any Army Card if the figure to be healed is adjacent to Nurse Chapel.

FIELD TRIAGE
When any figure adjacent to Nurse Chapel receives two or more wounds, you may subtract one from the number of wounds that figure receives. Nurse Chapel's Field Triage does not affect Constructs or destructible objects.

COME QUICKLY, NURSE
When a figure for whom Nurse Chapel could use Surgical Assistance or Field Triage is not adjacent to Nurse Chapel but is within [4] clear sight spaces of her, you may place Nurse Chapel on an empty space adjacent to that figure in order to use that power. If Nurse Chapel is engaged when she starts her Come Quickly, Nurse move, she will take any leaving engagement attacks.

(The more I think about it, the more I'm settling into the idea that Chapel and McCoy should have only 1 Range, like Kelda.)

(Note that Nurse Chapel is happy to save lives on either side of the battle. This can be a sneaky way to temporarily tie down an opposing figure if you don't mind sacrificing Christine.)

[Gurei-Ornery]

I like what you are trying to do, but shouldn't the Security Detail have some kind of "we always die first power"? Something similar to C3G Beat Cops Protect and Serve or Horned Skull Brutes Expendable Rabble.

[Just_a_Bill]

Originally Posted by Gurei-Ornery

shouldn't the Security Detail have some kind of "we always die first power"? Something similar to C3G Beat Cops Protect and Serve or Horned Skull Brutes Expendable Rabble.

Ooh, quite right. Looks like the Protect and Serve template will do quite nicely:

RED SHIRTS
Any time a figure you control would receive one or more wounds, you may instead destroy an adjacent Federation Security Detail member.

Not only is this the best-known characteristic of these guys, but it makes them generally useful even in a non-Trek build, while still synergizing nicely with the Federation heroes: monster tries to wound Uhura; redshirt sacrifices; McCoy runs to the screams with Kirk right behind; monster now takes a shot at Kirk; another redshirt jumps in to save him.

I think this helps solve another problem, too. Generally I would like this squad to be common, but the physical limitations of this project suggest they should be unique:

• You have to buy an entire $15 Away Team pack every time you want another squad of redshirts.
• There's nontrivial effort involved in repainting and modifying the sculpts.
• When I try to envision the Trek figures in an actual booster-pack configuration, I end up putting these guys in with one or two unique heroes.

I think the Red Shirts special power could be a reasonable gameplay justification for the squad being unique, especially with all the mobility-synergy I'm proposing for the Trek figures.

Hmm, maybe Scotty can "beam in" reinforcements by recycling redshirts that have been removed from the battlefield. Will have to think about that.

[Ryougabot]

I always wanted a flying side kick for Kirk's special power. I would debate the effectiveness of the roundhouse or the flying side kick, but they are both iconic

[SirGalahad]

Well done!

[Just_a_Bill]

And, since I'll have an extra Uhura sans phaser...

Nurse Chapel



Her proposed special abilities are listed up in the main post.

I'm really starting to think now that Chapel and McCoy should not have range.

[Just_a_Bill]

What should we call this effort? I like the sound of TrekScape, but it probably makes sense not to conscript that label since that (much grander) effort could still continue on its course.

The pattern already established by the Star Wars and Middle-Earth efforts (HoSS and HoME, respectively) suggests Heroes of Star Trek or HoST.

Seems reasonable ... but does anybody have an objection or a better idea?

[SirGalahad]

Looks good

[Jim]

Originally Posted by Just_a_Bill

The pattern already established by the Star Wars and Middle-Earth efforts (HoSS and HoME, respectively) suggests Heroes of Star Trek or HoST.

Seems reasonable ... but does anybody have an objection or a better idea?

Heroes of Trek. It's HoT!

[Just_a_Bill]

Originally Posted by Jim

Heroes of Trek. It's HoT!

Hey, not bad. Better acronym than "host," for sure.

EDIT: ... hmm, except that I just realized that the acronym is already taken by Heroes of Trollsford. So I think I'll stick with HoST.

In other news...

One thing that has been bothering me is Dr. McCoy's plagiarism of Kelda's Healing Touch:

• The 5% chance of actually doing harm feels wrong for this character. McCoy is probably the most experienced xenophysician in the Federation, and part of the Hippocratic Oath is to "never do harm to anyone." It makes sense for magic-based healing to have high risk, but modern medicine is comparatively conservative — and this is Federation medical technology in the hands of a master.
  
  
• I'm not sure the 15%+ chance of immediately removing all markers makes sense either. It seems to stretch credibility for a non-magical healing method. Given that all the other one-figure-heals-another powers in the game seem to have a magical or spiritual basis, it seems like future medical treatment probably needs to work differently. Is it more effective or less? Good question. But I think it's different. On the one hand, Federation medical technology is amazingly advanced. On the other, McCoy doesn't have access to sickbay, the ship's research library, his medical staff, etc.; he's performing whatever treatment he can accomplish in the field.
  
  
• While reading the Book of Rhogar Dragonspine today, I saw several comments about Rhogar's healing being more "consistent" than that of earlier figures and realized that this should be the feeling I get from McCoy as well. After all, while in Valhalla he's not facing some mysterious space affliction that makes you devolve into a spider; he's treating typical battlefield injuries for the most part. His medical kit should be sufficient to stop bleeding, close wounds, set bones, remove poison, and halt infection.
  
  
• So maybe what those last two bullet points suggest is this: McCoy's healing ability could perhaps be the most dependable in the entire game (possibly even automatic, so no d20), but be limited in how much it heals, who it affects, how long it lasts (kit runs out of supplies), degree of wounding of the hero (more than n wound markers makes the hero too damaged to successfully treat), or something.
  
  
• It's probably a mistake to mix science/tech healing with magical/spiritual healing, so I think I need to nix Nurse Chapel's ability to help the magical healers (and probably Sulu's, too, but I'm just not sure what else Botany can do; it does seem like this "holistic medicine" concept can bridge the gap between old-world and new-world medicine, perhaps?).
  
  
• The phrase "and before attacking" throws it in our face that McCoy could heal somebody, then wheel around and brutally grease somebody else. Kelda, Ana, Rhogar, and Sonlen can all do that, too, but they are warriors; Bones is not. I'm thinking his healing needs to come "instead of attacking," even though this is a nontrivial price to pay in Heroscape. But maybe having to pay that price can be a balancer that helps allow McCoy's specific healing method to be outstanding in some way.

Anyway, I'm trying to put together some alternatives, but wanted to get these thoughts out there so folks can mull, or refute, or tell me I'm over-analyzing....

[SirGalahad]

You're not rambling, just typing prolifically.
And all the ideas are sound.
Yes to HoT
Very cool