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  #61  
Old December 14th, 2008, 02:31 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

Here's a situation that just came up in a game: a Drudge starts out engaged but then uses tunneling to come up on the other side of the figure the Drudge is engaged with (and is still engaged with the same figure). Does the Drudge take a disengagement roll?

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Last edited by quozl; December 14th, 2008 at 02:37 PM.
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  #62  
Old December 14th, 2008, 02:45 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

Quote:
Originally Posted by quozl View Post
Here's a situation that just came up in a game: a Drudge starts out engaged but then uses tunneling to come up on the other side of the figure the Drudge is engaged with (and is still engaged with the same figure). Does the Drudge take a disengagement roll?
Did your Drudge figures come with one of these?



If so, take a minute to read it. All the way to the bottom.


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  #63  
Old December 14th, 2008, 03:54 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

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Originally Posted by CheddarLimbo View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by quozl View Post
Here's a situation that just came up in a game: a Drudge starts out engaged but then uses tunneling to come up on the other side of the figure the Drudge is engaged with (and is still engaged with the same figure). Does the Drudge take a disengagement roll?
Did your Drudge figures come with one of these?

(snipped the image of the card which of course we read!)

If so, take a minute to read it. All the way to the bottom.
So it seems obvious to you. But my opponent (who was using the Drudge) argued that the Drudge was not leaving the engagement since the Drudge was still engaged to the figure after the tunneling.

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  #64  
Old December 14th, 2008, 04:16 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

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Originally Posted by quozl View Post
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Originally Posted by CheddarLimbo View Post
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Originally Posted by quozl View Post
Here's a situation that just came up in a game: a Drudge starts out engaged but then uses tunneling to come up on the other side of the figure the Drudge is engaged with (and is still engaged with the same figure). Does the Drudge take a disengagement roll?
Did your Drudge figures come with one of these?

(snipped the image of the card which of course we read!)

If so, take a minute to read it. All the way to the bottom.
So it seems obvious to you. But my opponent (who was using the Drudge) argued that the Drudge was not leaving the engagement since the Drudge was still engaged to the figure after the tunneling.
You know, it did seem obvious the first time I read it, but now I think I may have spoken too soon. I've gone back and looks at disengagement rules, and it seems that the qualifying event is for the figure to be moved or placed in a space that is no longer adjacent to the figure it was originally engaged with. In the situation you describe that's not really happening.

In my head it seems that yes, the figure should get to take the swipe against the Drudge, but by the letter of the rules it's not so certain.


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  #65  
Old December 14th, 2008, 04:26 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

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Originally Posted by killercactus View Post
I think the Drudge are another unit that people are considering for the wrong reasons. If you're gonna use these guys, you shouldn't be counting on Tunneling and the +1/+1 bonus for swamp water. What you should be counting on is that you can field more of these units for the price than any other ranged unit in the game (except Arrow Gruts, but they never come alone). The Mass and 10th cost slightly more per piece and get another attack per turn marker, so they're usually the better pick, but the fact remains that the Drudge are the cheapest ranged unit in the game that isn't reliant on other units.

I've had some success with Krav/Raelin/Drudge x6 against some strong armies, including Minions and Cyprien. That many ranged units can really be a pain for your opponent. Add in Swamp Water and Tunneling on the right map, and they can work very well. This is one of the next units I want to take to a tournament, after Sonlen.
It's true that they're a very cheap ranged squad... but they're cheap for a reason. For only 10 points more, you get what you could get out of a swamp-heavy map with the Marro Drudge, but with the Marro Stingers. Also, on most maps, swamp water is at level 0, giving your opponent a height advantage, and making the swamp water defense bonus null. Also, at a 55% chance, the Marro Stingers have the chance of 4 attack no matter where they are on the board.

Of course, we already know that the Stingers are the better between the two, but I don't think that having a cheap point cost with the Marro Drudge really helps their playability.

On another note, I tip my hat to you for being an optimist and seeing the best in each unit. I followed your shot at success with Runa, and I think it's awesome that you're trying to bring out the best in each unit. Good luck in the future with Sonlen + Marro Drudge.
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  #66  
Old December 14th, 2008, 04:57 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

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Originally Posted by CheddarLimbo View Post
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Originally Posted by quozl View Post
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Originally Posted by CheddarLimbo View Post
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Originally Posted by quozl View Post
Here's a situation that just came up in a game: a Drudge starts out engaged but then uses tunneling to come up on the other side of the figure the Drudge is engaged with (and is still engaged with the same figure). Does the Drudge take a disengagement roll?
Did your Drudge figures come with one of these?

(snipped the image of the card which of course we read!)

If so, take a minute to read it. All the way to the bottom.
So it seems obvious to you. But my opponent (who was using the Drudge) argued that the Drudge was not leaving the engagement since the Drudge was still engaged to the figure after the tunneling.
You know, it did seem obvious the first time I read it, but now I think I may have spoken too soon. I've gone back and looks at disengagement rules, and it seems that the qualifying event is for the figure to be moved or placed in a space that is no longer adjacent to the figure it was originally engaged with. In the situation you describe that's not really happening.

In my head it seems that yes, the figure should get to take the swipe against the Drudge, but by the letter of the rules it's not so certain.
This situation is comparable to Flying; the wording is as follows:

When counting spaces for Kelda's movement, ignore elevations. Kelda may fly over water without stopping, pass over figures without becoming engaged, and fly over obstacles such as ruins. When Kelda starts to fly, if she is engaged she will take any leaving engagement attacks.

Specifically the bolded bit. This is worded exactly the same as the ending of the Tunnel ability. (Unless I missed something) When you start flying it is considered leaving engagement. Thats it. There is no other clarifications on the rule, so since the wording is the same I would assume that Tunneling does deserve disengagement strikes in this situation (just like all others).

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  #67  
Old December 14th, 2008, 08:38 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

GreenLanturn is right. Flying = tunneling is the comparison to make. You take the swipe at the moment of "takeoff," even if you later end the special move engaged to the same figure. The card says that the Drudge must take the swipe "when it starts to tunnel," which is the same effect as flying.

The FAQ on Drudge says that a tunneling Drudge must "take leaving engagement attacks from any figures(s) it was engaged with before using Swamp Water Tunnel." This also makes it sound like the Drudge takes the swipe "before" he resurfaces (possibly next to the same figure), just like non-stealth flying.

Maybe there's a way to torture those words until the Drudge can supposedly "circle" underneath the enemy and pop up on the other side unharmed, but I'm not biting. When they wrote the card, they copied the way fliers take swipes. So there you go.
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  #68  
Old December 14th, 2008, 10:10 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

I just read this from the beginning, and any points I wanted to make were already made! (tunneling, Marro Warriors) Looks like you guys don't need me! Well, I must say, like K-Cactus, I like to use those maligned figs, and am glad for the suggestions. How do you guys come up with this stuff?

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  #69  
Old December 14th, 2008, 11:44 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

Making tunneling like flying makes sense. Thanks all!

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  #70  
Old December 15th, 2008, 01:50 AM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

They really help my fave army out.

2X Obsidian Gaurds
2X Dzu Teh
3X Marro Drudge

Cross your fingers for a board with one of the 3.
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  #71  
Old December 15th, 2008, 09:30 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

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You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to killercactus again.
Very interesting observation, killercactus.

If I were to venture an opinion on the Krav/Raelin/Drudge x6 army, I would suggest that you need a Q9 killer/heavy hitter more than you need the Krav (or 2-3 squads of Drudge).

I'm sure you could find a way to fit in any of the following cleanup/heavy hitters:
- Kaemon Awa [remove 2 Drudge squads or the Krav]
- Sgt. Drake (SotM) [remove Krav & 1 Drudge or 3 Drudge]
- Agent Carr [remove Krav]
- Sonlen [remove Krav & 1 Drudge or 3 Drudge]
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  #72  
Old December 15th, 2008, 09:45 PM
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Re: The Book of Marro Drudge

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Originally Posted by Thorgrim View Post
They really help my fave army out.

2X Obsidian Gaurds
2X Dzu Teh
3X Marro Drudge

Cross your fingers for a board with one of the 3.
Nice to see I'm not the only one who likes combining Drudge and Dzu-Teh. I make most of the maps for my group, and I throw in a snowy swamp every so often so I can play them together.
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