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  #25  
Old June 5th, 2017, 03:36 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

I did not. I assume we wouldn't want it to work with that?

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  #26  
Old June 5th, 2017, 03:52 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

I think it is technically a temp. control roll since you take temp. control and move the figure before returning control. Just curious on how you ruled on it and if it came up in your tests with him doing his string pull from much farther away. Now that he needs to be within 4 spaces to make use of the spell effect, his defensive power has a little more significance. I'm not sure if it is a problem or not as the spell only last the one round any you would only have to attack Puppet Master with the Enchanted figure if they were engaged with each other and no one else. If it is I'm sure we can word it to have the bonus only apply during a figures turn rather than when rolling for a power while not your turn. Who else has an out of turn d20 temp control power?

Also, do we need to clarify that Poison Ivy's Pheromone Seduction does not count as temp. control even though control reverts back once she is destroyed? Or should it count as temp. control since control can be returned at some point?
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  #27  
Old June 5th, 2017, 06:38 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

What about this?

Quote:
At the start of any round, before rolling for initiative, this figure may cast this spell and choose a Unique Hero within 4 clear sight spaces. Until the end of the round, whenever any figure within 4 clear sight spaces of the Enchanted figure chooses the Enchanted figure for a special power and rolls the 20-sided die to take temporary control of that figure, add 4 to the roll.
That would cleanly cut out Reactive Mind Control. I don't know that it needs to, but it might be a good safeguard against similar powers. Plus, RMC already makes figures super-annoying to attack, I don't know that it needs any help.

I'd rule that the power has to say "temporary control" in order for the bonus to apply.

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  #28  
Old June 5th, 2017, 06:48 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin View Post
I'd rule that the power has to say "temporary control" in order for the bonus to apply.

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  #29  
Old June 15th, 2017, 01:31 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

Here are a couple of Enchant Spell tests.

Army Test 1
- Does it pass, Yes or No? yes
- What should be the unit's point value? Hard to say from this test as it had no impact even though it was cast.
- Give a brief preview. Thinking I may have Enchantress cast Enchant on her Bodyguard, Lizard, here to see how increasing the bonding odds with a figure that can heal themselves works out. The mutants have a strong healer themselves in opposition in Wolverine, along with a Fast Ball Special option in Colossus, who bonds with Lockheed. Wasp will hopefully be able to spring into action when an opponent gets down to 1 life and end them, if not then at least she can hopefully be a decoy to distract a fully enraged Wolverine away from Enchantress.
Map: Island Wellspring (no glyphs)
Units: Enchantress II, Lizard, Enchant Spell, Wasp (600) vs. Colossus, Lockheed, Wolverine (600)
Spoiler Alert!

Play-by-Play:
Spoiler Alert!

Recap: Things got off to a good start for Enchantress but then things cooled off and she couldnít finish off Wolverine before he took down Lizard. Wasp ended up being too far out of position to do her job when she was activated, settling for a W on Colossus instead of Wolverine and unable to distract Wolverine and buy Lizard any time to heal. The Enchant spell ended up being used on Colossus after Lizard fell and ended up having no effect. Had I used it the round before on Lizard it also would have had no effect. Sometimes the d20 just canít be influenced. At the end their wasnít much doubt that Colossus was going to beat the Enchantress for the win but there was one point where had the spell worked and she had Charmed Colossus 1 or more times that round, she may have been able to win this one or at least had a much closer finish. Since Colossus ended up being no help with her efforts to put Wolverine down, Wolverine lasted long enough to put 3W on Enchantress and that made a big difference at the end of the game.

Army Test 2
- Does it pass, Yes or No? yes
- What should be the unit's point value? Again tough to say as for the second game in a row the spell was cast and the +4 bonus had no impact on the outcome of any rolls.
- Give a brief preview. Raven is the cheapest option to get Enchant into play for Puppet Master, then I added in Spider-Man to the army to help pull figures away from Puppet Master should he get into trouble now that he must be so close to the action.
Map: Island Wellspring (no glyphs)
Units: Raven, Enchant Spell, Puppet Master, Spider-Man (600) vs. Luke Cage, Iron Fist, Jewel (600)
Spoiler Alert!

Play-by-play:
Spoiler Alert!

Recap: Very little went right for team Raven here as the d20 pretty much failed again and again. Puppet Master did have one turn where he scored two successful String Pulls (without the spell having been played yet) but outside of that it was pretty dismal as Puppet Master had 1 other String Pull and Spidey dodged just 2 attacks. All other d20 rolls failed while Luke & Iron Fist were able to double team Raven and put her down. The Enchant spell was played but had no effect on the outcome of any d20 rolls again. It did have an impact on the game in that I put 2 #OM on Puppet Master in an attempt to take advantage of the spell but his two turns only resulted in 1 String Pull out of 4 attempts. Had I not played the spell I most likely would have only given him 1 #OM and used the other 1on Spidey or Raven for an attack from HG. I think the spell is thus best served when played in the company of a figure that the temp. control power is an additional perk to a decent attack, Puppet Master really is all or nothing on the Spring Pull.
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  #30  
Old June 15th, 2017, 01:44 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

I updated the SP with Ronin's wording to clearly eliminate RMC.

As for my test results, two games in a row where it was cast but the spell had no effect on the outcome what-so-ever of any d20 rolls made. Makes it tough to gauge the price when it can score 0 value for you after being used, but also has the potential to result in a big swing in momentum when it does change the outcome of a roll in your favor and then you go on to really hurt your opponent with that temp. mind control turn. Looking at comparative value here then and a spell that is easy to cast and last an entire round is certainly something that appears like a pretty good points investment. As such I would think it would be more valuable than the Final Ruin & Condemn spells as their is no guarantee you will ever get a chance to play them. However even though it is easy to play the impact could still be 0 so it's not all that better than those spells you might never play but when you do it is a for sure 1W dealt. On the high end of the impact scale though, taking a temp. turn with an opponents figure can lead to much more than 1W in damage being dealt even before taking board control/positioning is taken into account. With it's potential impact being so much higher, combined with the ease of use, even though it can result in 0 impact I'd say it is still worth the 20 point gamble we have been testing it at.
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  #31  
Old June 16th, 2017, 01:20 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

Yeah. I wouldn't mind seeing one more set of games, but 20 points feels like a fair gamble based on what we're seeing so far.

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  #32  
Old June 16th, 2017, 02:03 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

Yeah, another set of games with another persons opinion on the value could bring this one home.
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  #33  
Old July 6th, 2017, 03:42 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

Any takers out there for a quick set of tests here?
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  #34  
Old July 7th, 2017, 05:50 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

Life has finally slowed a little for me, and I'm hoping to test a little this weekend. I'll make this top priority. Any combos that we're really worried about? What's showing strongest?

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  #35  
Old July 7th, 2017, 09:26 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

Nothing alarming from what I've seen after the last update. Puppet Master still remains a good option as an ally because he gets to roll twice per OM, then any MD figure that can cast it and use the boost themselves is the second best use I've seen. We have also been casting it on figures that are already weak-minded to try and make it really easy to grab control of that figure. The spell can be cast on friendly or opponents figures so having a weak minded figure in either army is a good idea.
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  #36  
Old July 8th, 2017, 03:37 PM
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Re: The Spellbook of Enchant

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE PLAYTEST UNIT: Enchant

Army Test
Map: Sewer Labyrinth
Units: Enchant (20), Brother Voodoo (210), Wong (90), Jason (175) (495) VS Black Canary (190), Nite-Owl (130), Robin: Dick (100), Robin: Damian (80) (500)
Spoiler Alert!



Army Test
Map: Sewer Labyrinth
Units: Enchant (20), Puppet Master (140), Malekith (220), Bizarro (330), Zombie (120), Angel (90) (920) VS Cosmic Boy (260), Lightning Lad (180), Saturn Girl (220), Timber Wolf (260) (920)
Spoiler Alert!


___________________________________________________________


THOUGHTS ON THE TESTED UNIT'S COST, BALANCE, & DRAFTABILITY: Hard to say what the value is here. In the first game, it got about average luck, coming up once in 4 rolls, and that one time was pretty valuable. Without it, that game isnít nearly as close. In the second game, it didnít come up thanks to fluky luck on PMís part. Had it worked, it takes what was a very possible loss into a very probable win.

Itís definitely worth drafting at 20 points, and will be worth much more than that in some games, but itís also tricky to use and may not affect any rolls. 20-30 seems like a reasonable spot to me.

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