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Competitive Armies Discussion Discuss, critique, and build ideas for tournament-caliber armies.


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  #85  
Old June 21st, 2017, 10:52 AM
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Re: 450 point army

I've tried a couple of Death Knight builds at this point, trying to find something that takes experience to play well:


Death Knights x 2 - 120
Khosumet - 195
Anubian Wolves x 3 - 420
Air elemental - 450


Death Knights x 2 - 120
Dumutef Guards x 4 - 220
Khosumet - 295
Anubian Wolves x 2 - 445


So, meh. #1 faced an opponent it couldn't handle well (Marro Hounds), but I haven't completely given up on it. #2 Seems like too few squaddies. I'll probably drop Khosumet and add a squad of wolves.


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  #86  
Old July 6th, 2017, 02:40 PM
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Re: 450 point army

Quote:
Originally Posted by vvildeyedjoker View Post
The difficulty of the army is kind of why I want to try it. It fits a certain gencon event that I think having think having the army and practicing it will give me an advantage that my opponent won't have.

Or it may fail miserably...
I did Elves last year in the Main Event (when it was 600, so substantially easier to put together enough wizards) and made the second day.. I agree that they are hard to play. My army was Ulginesh, Raelin, Jorhdawn, Chardris, Kyntela, Arkmer, Morsbane and Otonashi. If I were to do it over I'd probably change Morsbane and Otonashi for Acolarh. Morsbane really burned me on Day 2 and Acolarh is less high variance.

I agree with Kevin that Elves are hard at 450. I think 490 is really the number where they shine (Ulginesh, Raelin, Arkmer, Kyntela, Jorhdawn, Chardris). At 450 you have to cut something and play bad filler. You don't really want WoA in wizard armies, since that takes OMs off Ulginesh and you want to take turns with him exclusively.

My main advice is that Emiroon is quite bad and not at all worth 80 points. The army will be much much better with Raelin. Raelin benefits high life heroes so much since she drastically slows the rate at which they take wounds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnubianWolf88 View Post
I've tried a couple of Death Knight builds at this point, trying to find something that takes experience to play well:


Death Knights x 2 - 120
Khosumet - 195
Anubian Wolves x 3 - 420
Air elemental - 450


Death Knights x 2 - 120
Dumutef Guards x 4 - 220
Khosumet - 295
Anubian Wolves x 2 - 445


So, meh. #1 faced an opponent it couldn't handle well (Marro Hounds), but I haven't completely given up on it. #2 Seems like too few squaddies. I'll probably drop Khosumet and add a squad of wolves.


AW88
I've tried the Death Knights + Anubian + Dumutef Relentless army in the past but it has three problems:
1. Death Knights aren't that good.
2. Anubians aren't that good.
3. Adjacency requiring attack boosts for melee that move on order markers separate to the figure that will receive the boost aren't that good.

If it's for Gencon, maybe those are weaknesses you want to have. But it's probably weaker than the average army people bring to RtW
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  #87  
Old July 6th, 2017, 09:45 PM
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Re: 450 point army

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnubianWolf88 View Post
I've tried a couple of Death Knight builds at this point, trying to find something that takes experience to play well:


Death Knights x 2 - 120
Khosumet - 195
Anubian Wolves x 3 - 420
Air elemental - 450


Death Knights x 2 - 120
Dumutef Guards x 4 - 220
Khosumet - 295
Anubian Wolves x 2 - 445


So, meh. #1 faced an opponent it couldn't handle well (Marro Hounds), but I haven't completely given up on it. #2 Seems like too few squaddies. I'll probably drop Khosumet and add a squad of wolves.


AW88
Where is the range? Neither of those armies would stand up to an army with some decent range/engagement swarms. Gorillinators + Nakitas, Syvarris, Blastatrons + Gladiatrons, Q9, even aubrien archers + venocs would be a serious problem for this army.
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  #88  
Old July 7th, 2017, 11:39 AM
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Re: 450 point army

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoomCarrot View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnubianWolf88 View Post
I've tried a couple of Death Knight builds at this point, trying to find something that takes experience to play well:


Death Knights x 2 - 120
Khosumet - 195
Anubian Wolves x 3 - 420
Air elemental - 450


Death Knights x 2 - 120
Dumutef Guards x 4 - 220
Khosumet - 295
Anubian Wolves x 2 - 445


So, meh. #1 faced an opponent it couldn't handle well (Marro Hounds), but I haven't completely given up on it. #2 Seems like too few squaddies. I'll probably drop Khosumet and add a squad of wolves.


AW88
Where is the range? Neither of those armies would stand up to an army with some decent range/engagement swarms. Gorillinators + Nakitas, Syvarris, Blastatrons + Gladiatrons, Q9, even aubrien archers + venocs would be a serious problem for this army.
That's the point. These particular armies may need range but for a RtW type format like GenCon, sometimes an unbalanced army is what you need in order to beat it yourself. Because if you have an unbalanced army but your opponent has a balanced army with both range and melee and you get his army for the RtW round then you'll probably have the advantage and be able to beat it. Remember that RtW encourages building an army strong enough to win but not too strong you can't beat it yourself, and not adding range may make certain armies weak enough to beat when you have to play against it, but not too weak that you can't win with it yourself.
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  #89  
Old July 7th, 2017, 12:36 PM
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Re: 450 point army

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoomCarrot View Post
Where is the range?

Even with RtW considerations, this is a legitimate criticism. The GenCon maps are somewhat larger than the DFW metagame - we tend to pick melee friendly. While there are some of those on the GenCon map roster, maps like Elswin Plateau are very range-friendly.


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Last edited by AnubianWolf88; July 7th, 2017 at 12:37 PM. Reason: Silly quoting syntax error
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  #90  
Old July 7th, 2017, 02:30 PM
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Re: 450 point army

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarissimus View Post
4th Mass 4
Sam Brown
Dund
You misspelled Marrden Nagrubs and TKN as "4th Mass" and "Sam Brown", respectively.
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  #91  
Old July 7th, 2017, 04:34 PM
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Re: 450 point army

Honestly, I kind of am used to large maps, which is why I value range so much. Considering the snall tourney maps, I suppose melee armies could be useful. A small map melee army I used to love is:

Saylind the Kyrie Warrior: 80
Alastair MacDirk (or sir Gilbert): 110 (100)
MacDirk Warriors x3: 240
Isamu: 10

Total: 440 (430)

Strategy is fairly simple like most small armies: Charge in with MacDirks and their champion, keep Saylind in your spawn somewhere safe. As soon as your champion has suffered enough damage to maxamize your MacDirks' attack, use saylind to summon him back to the spawn. Your opponent will probably be forced to face every single last one of your MacDirks at full strength before they can kill your champion. The remains should hopefully not be too much for your three heroes to clean up. The major weaknesses are squad killers obviously, and anything with disengage.
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  #92  
Old July 7th, 2017, 04:47 PM
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Re: 450 point army

That Saylind OM will be a killer even if you time it right. You're probably better off just running away in the usual fashion.

I played against a MacDirk build once that had Isamu punch Alistair in the face on the first OM of the game, then just hit Alistair in the back while using another champion. Against a melee or short-ranged opponent who didn't have any assassination figures, it could be kind of unstoppable if you were throwing 6 dice from the get-go.
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  #93  
Old July 7th, 2017, 04:58 PM
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Re: 450 point army

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
That's the point. These particular armies may need range but for a RtW type format like GenCon, sometimes an unbalanced army is what you need in order to beat it yourself. Because if you have an unbalanced army but your opponent has a balanced army with both range and melee and you get his army for the RtW round then you'll probably have the advantage and be able to beat it. Remember that RtW encourages building an army strong enough to win but not too strong you can't beat it yourself, and not adding range may make certain armies weak enough to beat when you have to play against it, but not too weak that you can't win with it yourself.
This is an interesting point. In the past I probably would have argued with you and said that the ideal RtW army is one that doesn't have any bad matchups but also doesn't have any great ones. But the last three Main Events have been won by armies that do have some great and some terrible matchups (Hounds, Vipers, Cutters). So maybe there is something to creating an army with intentional weaknesses
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  #94  
Old July 9th, 2017, 01:56 AM
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Evil Genius right there

Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post

I played against a MacDirk build once that had Isamu punch Alistair in the face on the first OM of the game, then just hit Alistair in the back while using another champion. Against a melee or short-ranged opponent who didn't have any assassination figures, it could be kind of unstoppable if you were throwing 6 dice from the get-go.
After thinking about this for a second, that is simply brilliant. Evil, and seriously risky, but brilliant. Sure you do have to gamble that you won't need that 110 points, but man...

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  #95  
Old July 13th, 2017, 08:32 PM
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Re: 450 point army

Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarissimus View Post
4th Mass 4
Sam Brown
Dund
You misspelled Marrden Nagrubs and TKN as "4th Mass" and "Sam Brown", respectively.
I've actually done that army, a long time ago in Arkansas. There is a battle report somewhere. But I don't think I would take it to GenCon; it would get mauled by squadscape.

Lately I'm contemplating Dividers with Tul-Bak-Ra. Not that TBR is any good, I just love Dividers.

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  #96  
Old July 13th, 2017, 08:46 PM
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Re: 450 point army

I'm not surprised; I knew you had done it with Gurei-Oni before.
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