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Old March 18th, 2022, 11:36 PM
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Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

This is something I plan on trying to work on more and I've talked to a few folks who don't have sanctum access about it and they've expressed interest, so just going to put it out here so they can easily see it. These are mostly untested (other than a couple little ones here and there, but I plan to run some playtests with a mostly powerless enemy (Cursed Earth T-Rexes) next week to see how the basics feel before committing to doing stuff with special powers.

Here's where I'm currently at:

C3G RULES FOR SOLO AND COOPERATIVE PLAY

Spoiler Alert!


Sample Villain Card for activation:

Spoiler Alert!

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #2  
Old March 19th, 2022, 12:26 AM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

I’ll just put my thoughts in this post as I read through so I don’t miss anything or forget anything by the time I get through all of it.

-villan cards. I like the three villain archetypes. My suggestion for this would be to simply use three cards for the entire enemy force. One card for each archetype. These would be reference cards and would have a corresponding symbol for each type on the card that you could have a matching token to place on each villains card. This would save much table space and work just as well. Otherwise great ideas here.

-villain startzone deployment. I didn’t think of this, very cool as you have it spelled out.

-unit activations and unit types. With this one I think that less calculating and less paperwork would be more enjoyable as you’lol be doing this every single turn. So in a word, less is more. I really like the frostgrave creature rules I posted in discord for this. Not to a T of course but the same general idea.
1. Is a villain engaged, if so it makes an attack
2. If a villain can make an attack, it proceeds to attack
3. If a villain can’t make an attack it moves to a location that it can attack
Basically as simple as this but tailored a little differently to the different villan types.
Aggressive- when I think of aggressive I think out for blood. Indiscriminately attacking the closest and/or weakest target. Could be strongest?
Supporting- Id say for supportive you could keep step 1 and or 2 then 3 would be to move to towards the closest villain character that it can support or objective.
Calculating-same as 1 and 2 attack weakest/strongest figure whichever is the more tactical choice.

All in all. A couple step process. Less is more when repeating a mechanic over and over.
Vulnerability- I’d just chalk it up to whatever enemy figure is easier to wound.

-do no harm and optimize are perfectly in sync with my above suggestions. I like these. In future edits I would keep the same concepts but try to simplify the text if possible. Otherwise looks great.

-choosing a target space, staying on target, move with attitude concepts look good. Simplifying the text and incorporating the specifics into the villain archetype card would be optimal.

-unit attacking. These traits should also be incorporated into the different archetypes cards.
-the last part of that falls into a category I’d call target priority. You could simplify it by using different stats to determine attacks. For instance: highest threat-most damage output, easiest kill- lowest defense or life value, then of course point value in some aspect.

Villain card example: after seeing these examples very last, I’ll say that these add a whole next level of complexity to the entire process. I didn’t realize the extent of special rules per each unit card. With my basic knowledge of the sheer amount of different characters in C3G, doing individual cards for each and every character is a genuine fear of strength.

Overview- I believe that making a 3 or maybe even a 4 tiers of different villain archetypes is a great idea, but make them have a generic, easy to remember subset of things each archetype uses. All figures already have their own fairly complex army cards to set them apart from one another. The amount of testing and literal mental paperwork of keeping each and every army card with their corresponding villain card straight in a game would probably take a good bit of fun out of things. However, if each different army card is supposed to have a specific archetype, a list of the different cards with their archetypes could be sufficient. Overall the biggest thing I could say to add would be to consolidate and simplify the AI to easy to understand terms that require a lesser amount of book keeping. I also would not make individual villain cards for each and every character. That’s a lot of extra design work, physical paperwork on the game table, and much, much more book keeping. I would say sure to this for an event hero. Leaving it to a more generic would allow people to use this system for any Heroscape they wanted instead of having to have specific villain cards. The only other issue that would need a bit more thought would how to determine what army cards are what archetype on a generic level? There could be additional brainstorming to determine these things.

Hopefully my input has brought up some valid points. I can tell you, the average person will most likely not want to print out an extra individual card for each and every c3g card the have already.(myself included). I also see it as a super duper giant miss, if all this work goes into this solo/coop mode that doesn’t allow you to use it for any and all Heroscape.

making it rain with all my Pennies!

Edit: keep in mind, my input is also looking from the outside in. As I’ve not been part of or privy to any sanctum discussion on the topic. Im looking at it from a functional approach, that is as simple as it can be, but still work. If none of my points are to your liking feel free to dismiss me back to whence I came.

Last edited by TREX; March 19th, 2022 at 05:04 AM.
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Old March 19th, 2022, 04:04 AM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

Is this what I ran for the Anti-Monitor?
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Old March 19th, 2022, 05:07 AM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tornado View Post
Is this what I ran for the Anti-Monitor?
If it is, I would love to know your thoughts on it. Iím curious about the level of book keeping that goes into it. I love the layout, but think it could be simplified a little bit just from looking at it from face value.
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  #5  
Old March 19th, 2022, 08:11 AM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

Seems like what I tried was specifically tailored to Anti-Monitor.
I just cannot remember what we were using to trigger his actions.
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Old March 19th, 2022, 08:24 AM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

It is. Anti also had a specific villain card to tell you how to use his special powers.

Fwiw if I took the individual villain cards approach, I wouldn’t translate our entire library. I’d just aim for some of the more iconic Event Heroes and villain teams.

I totally get the villain card concern when it comes to being an end user. The issue is, I think, that special powers are so diverse and often include so much player choice that they are very hard to direct with an overall rules set and make it still feel like the AI is making the decisions rather than the player just playing themselves.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #7  
Old March 19th, 2022, 08:27 AM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

Yes. Here is one revision after my last test I believe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmBatman View Post
Let's try this as a middle ground, then:

NAME = ANTI-MONITOR

SPECIES = ENTITY
UNIQUENESS = EVENT VILLAIN
CLASS = DESTROYER
PERSONALITY = MALEVOLENT
SIZE/HEIGHT = HUGE 20

LIFE = 30
MOVE = 4
RANGE = 6
ATTACK = 6
DEFENSE = 6
POINTS = 1600

MASTER OF TIME

If Anti-Monitor wins initiative, each player must immediately remove one unrevealed Order Marker from one of their Army Cards at random.

ERASE FROM EXISTENCE
When activated, instead of attacking with Anti-Monitor, roll the 20-sided die once for each figure within 3 clear sight spaces of Anti-Monitor. If the figure is a Squad figure and you roll 8 or higher, destroy it. If the figure is a Hero figure and you roll 20 or higher, destroy the Hero.

MASTER OF SPACE
When activated, reveal the "X" Order Marker on Anti-Monitor's card, if possible. If you do, Anti-Monitor immediately takes an additional turn. During this turn, instead of moving Anti-Monitor normally, place him on unoccupied spaces within 10 spaces of his current position. When Anti-Monitor moves with Master of Space, he will not take any leaving engagement attacks.




ACTIVATION RULES

SKULL: Move Anti-Monitor within attack range of the most Vulnerable Enemy Target. After his turn, activate Master of Space.

SHIELD: Without leaving engagement, move Anti-Monitor to the highest level unoccupied spaces possible that are still within attack range of at least one enemy figure. If you revealed Order Marker 3 at the start of this turn, then his turn, activate Master of Space.

BLANK: Without leaving engagement, move Anti-Monitor to within 3 clear sight spaces of as many enemy figures as possible and activate Erase from Existence, adding X to each roll, where X = the number of players. If you revealed Order Marker 3 at the start of this turn, then his turn, activate Master of Space.

SUPER STRENGTH
FLYING


VOCABULARY:
Spoiler Alert!
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  #8  
Old March 19th, 2022, 08:29 AM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

My main issue was before he was forced to leave engagement to use EFE.
Overall I thought it played well .
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Old March 19th, 2022, 08:29 AM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

But yeah, I am super in favor of simplifying where possible. Doing that while still make it feel like the game is playing you rather than you playing the game (and making what happens when super clear) is the challenge.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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Old March 19th, 2022, 08:30 AM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tornado View Post
My main issue was before he was forced to leave engagement to use EFE.
Overall I thought it played well .
Iím glad!

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #11  
Old March 19th, 2022, 02:14 PM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmBatman View Post
But yeah, I am super in favor of simplifying where possible. Doing that while still make it feel like the game is playing you rather than you playing the game (and making what happens when super clear) is the challenge.
Cool. Yeah, the individualized villain cards for event heroes would be fine and not too extensive. I really like the whole direction you are going with it. I guess the word that could describe it best is streamlining what you currently have to make it even easier for the player.
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Old March 19th, 2022, 06:33 PM
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Re: Solo/Coop Mechanics Discussion

For sure. I'm 100% down with that, I just need help? Like if an experienced game player like yourself wanted to take a shot at editing my draft above, I'd welcome it. Figuring out what needs to be kept and what doesn't for the sake of clarity can be tough sometimes.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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