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  #229  
Old May 17th, 2021, 05:41 PM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

I only got two hours of sleep last night, so I'm not much in the mood to argue. However, the short explanation is this:

(1) Dividers are good
(2) There are results to back up (1)
(3) Dividers probably aren't the worst A- (see Fire Elemental, Laglor)
(4) Dividers don't really have any bad matchups in B+ and under
(5) Following (4), every team should bring Dividers if they're legal, because they're fine/good into everything (every other army has some better and worse matchups)

Last edited by OEAO; May 17th, 2021 at 06:22 PM.
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  #230  
Old August 28th, 2021, 10:40 PM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

Huge update!!!

Last edited by OEAO; August 28th, 2021 at 10:40 PM. Reason: Laglor is trash
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  #231  
Old August 29th, 2021, 01:13 AM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

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Huge update!!!
Anything in particular? Notable changes we should be aware of?

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  #232  
Old August 29th, 2021, 10:50 AM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

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Huge update!!!
Anything in particular? Notable changes we should be aware of?
Laglor is now in his rightful spot.
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  #233  
Old September 2nd, 2021, 05:03 PM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

I feel like Fen Hydra should be an A. It was in dok’s old GC winning army back in the cheese era.

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(I've also played many matches with great, fun people who were using Q9. So using Q9 doesn't make you a tool. But being a tool sure seems to make you use Q9.)
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  #234  
Old September 2nd, 2021, 05:25 PM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

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I feel like Fen Hydra should be an A. It was in dok’s old GC winning army back in the cheese era.
I'm lower on Hydra than some other people; A- feels right for me.

I think Hydra just has some bad matchups where it struggles to ever want OMs (WtF squads, bonding Dragons, etc.). And to me having bad matchups into non-A+ figures defines the gap between A- & A better than anything else.

In my mind, Hydra is a great way to achieve matchup smoothing for certain armies. But those type of figures tend to fall into the A- range more than the A range.
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  #235  
Old September 2nd, 2021, 08:07 PM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

Hydra is extremely inconsistent so people can have wildly varying opinions of him as a result. I think Cleon has him as a the fifth best figure in the game on his rankings. Hydra completely bailed me out for a win in my R3 Sideboards ScapeCon game vs. @JohnnyFrisbee by refusing to ever not block attacks from Knights of Weston, after Johnny caught my Krav early and Hydra was my only choice left. But he Hydra can easily vary the other way and lose a head on his first attack. Personally I think he's an a A, not A-. But I think Orc is really leaning into the personal opinion rankings here with Axegrinders at A.
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  #236  
Old September 3rd, 2021, 05:37 PM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

I view Hydra the same way I view Airborne: great when it's great, terrible when it's terrible. IMO, it's just too inconsistent (from both a matchups and variance perspective) to be an A.

Axegrinders are the opposite- they are always good. You sacrifice some better matchups into specific things to get smoother matchups overall than, say, Heavies (the Orcs' reliance on Grimnak is sometimes great, and sometimes terrible).

Last edited by OEAO; September 3rd, 2021 at 05:38 PM. Reason: Ken agrees with me on Axegrinders, so I'm in good company...
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  #237  
Old September 5th, 2021, 10:20 AM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

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Originally Posted by vegietarian18 View Post
Hydra is extremely inconsistent so people can have wildly varying opinions of him as a result. I think Cleon has him as a the fifth best figure in the game on his rankings. Hydra completely bailed me out for a win in my R3 Sideboards ScapeCon game vs. @JohnnyFrisbee by refusing to ever not block attacks from Knights of Weston, after Johnny caught my Krav early and Hydra was my only choice left. But he Hydra can easily vary the other way and lose a head on his first attack. Personally I think he's an a A, not A-. But I think Orc is really leaning into the personal opinion rankings here with Axegrinders at A.
At this point I’m gonna drop it down a tier (A+ to A) whenever the next time I update it, I think the past year and a half playing/playing against it has solidified that for me. I am higher on it than a lot of people but its inconsistency pulls it away from the top tier. My philosophy was that it can kill so much and on the flip side you don’t lose that many points if it’s a dud....but you still likely lose activations and board control if it’s a dud. Granted I haven’t played it with 16 rats flooding the board in a while but I think it belongs in A or right below the highest tier.

Axegrinders I view as literally the border between A- and A so I’m kinda cool with either. If there isn’t a lot of 4th and 10th in the field they really shine.

Edit: Also removing Kelda from the glyph pool definitely doesn’t help the Hydra’s case.
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  #238  
Old March 26th, 2022, 09:01 AM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

Could someone explain to me what exactly makes Sgt Drake (SOTM) A- tier? The only situation in which I'd even consider running him is if I'm bringing a 4th Mass build and am exactly 170 points under, and even then, I'd probably still rather take Alastair + Sam Brown. If you're looking for a can opener, Eltahale is 30 points cheaper while boasting better mobility (thanks to Thunder Step) and a multi-target 4-dice SA, and Alastair's ability to move 10 spaces at once and hit something with a double attack of 5 (although admittedly not on the same turn) makes him more effective than Drake for this purpose as well. I'm not even convinced that SOTM Drake is even that much better than ROTV Drake - most armies would rather bring another squad of commons than pay a 60 point premium for 1 extra life and defence. Fundamentally, 170 points is just a lot to pay for a single-attack-per-turn hero who's other abilities could at best be considered 'somewhat useful'. (4th and gladblast are the only top tier armies that are really bothered by Thorian Speed - the other ranged armies either don't mind engaging him or predominantly use special attacks anyway). He's still a good figure, but I can't help but feel that B+ would be a better ranking for him than where he currently sits.

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  #239  
Old March 26th, 2022, 10:47 AM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

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Could someone explain to me what exactly makes Sgt Drake (SOTM) A- tier? The only situation in which I'd even consider running him is if I'm bringing a 4th Mass build and am exactly 170 points under, and even then, I'd probably still rather take Alastair + Sam Brown. If you're looking for a can opener, Eltahale is 30 points cheaper while boasting better mobility (thanks to Thunder Step) and a multi-target 4-dice SA, and Alastair's ability to move 10 spaces at once and hit something with a double attack of 5 (although admittedly not on the same turn) makes him more effective than Drake for this purpose as well. I'm not even convinced that SOTM Drake is even that much better than ROTV Drake - most armies would rather bring another squad of commons than pay a 60 point premium for 1 extra life and defence. Fundamentally, 170 points is just a lot to pay for a single-attack-per-turn hero who's other abilities could at best be considered 'somewhat useful'. (4th and gladblast are the only top tier armies that are really bothered by Thorian Speed - the other ranged armies either don't mind engaging him or predominantly use special attacks anyway). He's still a good figure, but I can't help but feel that B+ would be a better ranking for him than where he currently sits.
I'm torn.

On the one hand, I'd almost never (perhaps actually never) include SotM Drake in a bring-1 army, which is a strong argument against an A- ranking. On the other hand, he is actually a strong counter to most of the other heroes in the A-/A tiers given his 6 attack and strong survivability, so there are some bring-1 armies I might run where I'd rather not see my opponent having SotM Drake. That kinda puts him in the niche counter-pick option, like the Cultists in C3V, in my view.

Regarding SotM Drake v. RotV Drake, I almost certainly rank SotM Drake higher because I don't think I'd ever use RotV Drake over Alastair, and at least SotM Drake has a point total where he becomes a better option sometimes.

I think I disagree on taking Alastair + Sam Brown instead of Drake, as I don't think you're going to get useful OMs on Sam Brown almost ever, which kinda makes it more of a direct comparison between SotM Drake & Alastair and Drake just has the better stat line and survivability via Thorian Speed.

In some sense, I see SotM Drake as a somewhat similar figure to Cyprien insofar as he's a stand-alone hero that you'd normally pair with some common squad. Cyprien is clearly the better option to me, although he does have more terrible matchups than Drake does (but also way more great matchups).

So I really don't know where I'd rank him, but I wanted to throw some of these thoughts out there.
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  #240  
Old March 27th, 2022, 05:04 PM
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Re: OEAO's Power Rankings

So I dug back a little bit in the discussion. When I first posted these, I had initially moved Drake SotM down to B+. A few people pushed back on it (Dysole and Jexik), with the reasoning being that he's really good for 4th Mass at some specific point totals (notably 450 and 520 points). I guess you could make an argument for Charos to be moved up for a similar reason? Like 4th Mass with Charos at 500 is similarly good... although I'd probably rather have 5x Mass, Alastair, Eldgrim at that point total. Obviously all of this also depends on figure limits too (I'd probably rather have 6x Mass Eldgrim instead of 4x Mass Drake SotM at 450 if I have 24 hexes).

I do think I'd rather have Drake SotM over Alastair and Sam Brown for the same reasons Chris laid out.
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