Project Pokemon Playtesting Thread: Kangaskhan and Bulbasaur

[DrAwsm]

Originally Posted by DeathDoom

On freeze: should revealing an order marker on a Fire-type negate it?

I think that could work, but in the games, I believe Freeze only goes away if you use a Fire-type move. So, technically, only Fire-types could negate it anyway. I guess I wouldn't have a problem with a Fire-type's revealed OM negating it, but I think we should test it first.

[White Knight]

Originally Posted by DeathDoom

On freeze: should revealing an order marker on a Fire-type negate it?

The problem is that we decided not to reference types for classic Heroscape. Sgt. Drake doesn't care if Charmander is a fire type--it makes no difference in Classic Scape. Also, I don't want to add too many more words to the Status Effect.

Can we make it a Pokescape-only rule and just put it in the rulebook?

Right now Sleep and Freeze are different. For Sleep, you have a 50% chance of waking up before you take a turn. For Freeze, you have a 20% chance to unfreeze--and even then you don't get to move or attack on a turn that you remove the marker.

[White Knight]

Originally Posted by White Knight

4 votes YES for passing Gastly at 50 points with 3 Defense. Any more Yes or No votes?

Per the voting rules, it's been over 24 hours and there are at least 3 more YES votes than NO.

GASTLY passes playtesting at 50 points and a defense of 3!

Gastly moves to Finalization.
Kangaskhan moves to playtesting!

By the way, I'll try to have some Paras playtest results up later tonight.

[Chardar]

Quick question about Kangaskhan. Is it double or single spaced? I'm pretty sure it's single but it's the biggest pokemon we've tested so far and I wanted to make sure.

[mac122]

I envision Kangaskhan being a single spaced figure. Bulbapedia lists the height at 7' 3". Taller than an a typical human but not so big to require a double-space base. IMO.

[Chardar]

Some preliminary Hero tests for Kangaskhan. I'll see if I can talk my sister into helping me finish the test, but right now I think these are pretty interesting.

All tests done on Goblin Canyon, which has become my default playtesting map.

Kangaskhan Hero Test 1

Kangaskhan vs. Fen Hydra

Round 1. Fen Hydra wins initiative and moves forward. Kangaskhan takes height and moves away from the Hydra. The Fen Hydra takes height in the center. Kangaskhan engages and attacks the Fen Hydra, but doesn’t inflict a wound. The Fen Hydra attacks and overwhelms Kangaskhan.

Fen Hydra wins with no wounds. I think the results of this test would have been far different if Kangaskhan had wounded the Fen Hydra first, so this doesn’t surprise me at all.

Kangaskhan Hero Test 2

Kangaskhan vs. Torin

Round 1. Kangaskhan wins initiative and moves forward. Torin moves forward. Kangaskhan takes height and attacks, inflicting three wounds. Torin attacks, inflicting three wounds. Kangaskhan attacks, defeating Torin.

Kangaskhan wins with 3 wounds. This test was much more even than the Fen Hydra one since they’re both support units with a punch.

Hero Test 3

Kangaskhan vs. Krug

Round 1. Krug wins initiative and moves forward. Kangaskhan takes height and moves away from Krug. Krug takes height in the center. Kangaskhan engages and uses Dizzy Punch, inflicting a wound but not confusing Krug. Krug attacks and inflicts two wounds. Krug attacks and defeats Kangaskhan.

Kurg wins with 3 wounds. Given that we have a lot of small Pokemon I think Kangaskhan will be a good unit in Pokescape, but he doesn’t seem to hold his own in classic.

I didn't think Dizzy Punch would get much use, but with a big hitter like Krug coming at you removing an OM looks pretty sweet. I definitely like Kangaskhan right now and am pretty excited to use him in an army test with the wrymlings. I think they'll benefit a lot from his extra defense die and can represent our pokescape special attackers quite nicely.

[White Knight]

PARAS PLAYTESTS -- HEROES

All tests done on my Unofficial Pallet Town Training Field:



2x Paras vs Drow Chainfighter (25 points)

Battle #1
Drow Chainfighter wins

Spoiler Alert!

- Drow Chainfighter moves foward
- Paras #1 moves to height
- Drow moves to the river
- Paras #2 moves toward plateau
- Drow engages and takes out Paras #2
- Paras #1 attack from on height but misses

Round 2
- Drow attacks--> Paras #1 out

Battle #2
Drow Chainfighter wins

Spoiler Alert!

- Drow forward
- Paras #1 to height
- Drow to river
- Paras #2 moves along the border
- Drow forward towards plateau
- Paras #1 attacks from on height but is blocked

Round2
- Paras #1 misses
- Drow attacks --> Paras #1 out
- Paras #2 moves to height on the sand dune
- Drow attacks and takes out Paras #2

2x Paras vs Air Elemental (30 points)

Battle #1
Paras win (2/2 Paras left)

Spoiler Alert!

- Paras #1 moves onto the hill
- Air Elemental moves forward
- Paras #2 moves toward the hill
- AE forward
- Paras #2 moves onto the hill (unable to engage)
- Air Elemental flies adjacent and attacks --> Sleep Status Marker

Round 2
- Paras #2 attacks --> Air Elemental out

Battle #2
Air Elemental wins

Spoiler Alert!

- Paras #1 and #2 move to height
- Air Elemental attacks but is blocked --> Paralyzed

Round2
- Air Elemental attacks --> Paras #2 out
- Paras #1 misses
- Air Elemental attacks and takes out Paras #1

2x Paras vs Sahuagin Raider (25 points)

Battle #1
Paras win (2/2 Paras left)

Spoiler Alert!

- Paras #1 moves to height
- Sahuagin moves forward
- Paras #2 moves forward
- Sahuagin moves onto land
- Paras #2 engages but misses
- Sahuagin attacks but is blocked --> Paralyzed

Round 2
- Sahuagin attacks --> Paralyzed again
- Paras #2 attacks --> Sahuagin out

Battle #2
Paras win (2/2 Paras left)

Spoiler Alert!

- Sahuagin moves to the water and stays there
- both Paras move to height

Round2
- Paras #2 engages the Sahuagin raider from the shore but misses
- Sahuagin attacks but is blocked --> Paralyzed
- Paras #2 attacks --> Sahuagin Raider out

Battle #1
Paras win (2/2 Paras left)

Spoiler Alert!

- Paras #1 moves onto the hill
- Air Elemental moves forward
- Paras #2 moves toward the hill
- AE forward
- Paras #2 moves onto the hill (unable to engage)
- Air Elemental flies adjacent and attacks --> Sleep Status Marker

Round 2
- Paras #2 attacks --> Air Elemental out

Battle #2
Air Elemental wins

Spoiler Alert!

- Paras #1 and #2 move to height
- Air Elemental attacks but is blocked --> Paralyzed

Round2
- Air Elemental attacks --> Paras #2 out
- Paras #1 misses
- Air Elemental attacks and takes out Paras #1

2x Paras vs Black Wyrmling (30 points)

Battle #1
Paras win (1/2 Paras left)

Spoiler Alert!

- both Paras move to onto the nearby hill
- the Black Wyrmling flies over and attacks --> Asleep

Round 2
- Black Wyrmling wakes up and attacks --> Paralyzed
- Paras #2 misses
- Black Wyrmling attacks --> Paras #2 out
- Paras #1 blocked
- Black Wyrmling is Paralyzed and cannot move or attack
- Paras #1 misses

Round 3
- Black Wyrmling shakes off the Paralysis but is blocked --> Paralyzed again
- Paras #1 attacks --> Black Wyrmling out

Summary
Paras is terrible against the Drow Chainfighter. I'd played some matches against the Drow earlier and the Drow won probably 6 or more times before the Paras beat him.

On the other hand, Paras is pretty good against the Sahuagin Raider.

Against the Black Wyrmling and the Air Elemental it was more even (at 2 Paras to 1 of the Wyrmling or Elemental).

I'm thinking that Paras is about 15 points.

I'll do a few squad tests to verify.

Note: I changed Sleep Status Markers so that Sleeping figures don't get leaving engagement attacks, but it didn't come into play with heroes. I think it will be more usefull against squads.

[Chardar]

After reviewing all of the tests I would feel comfortable passing Paras at 15. And to be fair, everything is good against the Sahuagin Raider.

[White Knight]

PARAS PLAYTESTS -- SQUADS
All tests done on my Unofficial Pallet Town Training Field:



3x Paras vs Deathreavers (40 points)

Deathreavers win (2/4 Deathreaves left)

Note: This was a long, drawn-out battle, with the Paras missing and the Deathreavers being Paralyzed and falling Asleep many times...

Spoiler Alert!

- Deathreavers rush to the river
- 2 Paras go for height
- Paras #2 attacks but misses

Round 2
- Paras #3 hides near the base of the hill on the left side of the battlefield
- Deathreavers attack --> 1 Asleep, 1 Paralyzed, Paras #2 out
- Paras #1 blocked
- Deathreavers attack (1 asleep) --> 1 Paralyzed, another Asleep
- Paras #1 misses
- Deathreavers attack (2 wake up) --> 2 Sleep, 1 Paralyzed

Round 3
- Paras #3 blocked
- Deathreavers attack (1 Sleeping, 1 Paralyzed, 1 wakes up) --> 1 Paralyzed
- Paras #3 misses
- Deathreavers attack (1 wakes, 1 Paralyzed) --> 2 Sleep
- Paras #1 attacks --> 1 Deathreaver out
- Deathreavers attack --> 1 Paralyzed, 2 Sleep

Round 4
- Paras #1 misses
- Deathreavers (1 asleep, 1 wakes) --> 1 Paralyzed, 1 Asleep
- Paras #3 misses
- Deathreavers (1 asleep, 1 wakes) --> Paras #1 out
- Paras #3 blocked
- Deathreavers (only 1 can attack --> but it's Paralyzed)

Round 5
- Deathreavers (only 1 can attack --> but it's Paralyzed)
- Paras #3 takes out 1 Deathreaver
- Deathreaver attacks and takes out Paras #3

3x Paras vs Marrden Nagrubs (30 points)

Battle #1
Nagrubs win (2/3 Nagrubs left)

Spoiler Alert!

- Nagrubs cross the river
- Paras #2 attacks but misses

Round 2
- Paras #3 forward --> 1 Nagrub out
- Nagrubs attack --> 1 Asleep, Paras #2 out
- Paras #3 misses
- Nagrub wakes up --> 1 Nagrub paralyzed, Paras #3 out
- Paras #1 misses
- Nagrub #1 still paralyzed

Round 3
- Paras #1 misses
- Nagrub takes out Paras #1

Battle #2
Paras win (2/3 Paras left)

Spoiler Alert!

- Paras #3 to the sand dune
- Paras #1 to height
- Nagrub attack Paras #3 --> Paralyzed

Round 2
- Nagrubs attack --> Paras #3 out, 1 Asleep, 1 Paralyzed
- Paras #1 comes down the hill and attacks from height --> blocked
- Nagrubs attack (1 Paralyzed, 1 Asleep) --> 1 misses
- Paras #1 takes out the sleeping Nagrub
- Nagrubs attack --> 1 falls asleep, 1 Paralyzed
- Paras #1 attacks from height --> Sleeping Nagrub out

Round 3
- Paras #2 attacks --> last Nagrub out

3x Paras vs Venoc Vipers (40 points)

Battle #1
Paras win (2/3 Paras left)

(Note: I forgot to roll for Frenzy. The Vipers had 3 chances to Frenzy--Battle #1 has them missing all Frenzy rolls.)

Spoiler Alert!

- Vipers to the river
- Paras #1 climbs onto the hill
- Vipers close in
- Paras #2 attacks --> 1 Viper out
- Vipers atack --> 1 Paralyzed, Paras #2 out
- Paras #3 attacks --> 2nd Viper out

Round 2
- Paras #1 attacks --> last Viper out

Battle #2
Vipers win (2/3 Vipers left)

(Note: This is the same battle as #1 except that I went back and rolled all the Frenzy rolls.)

Spoiler Alert!

- Vipers to the river
- Paras #1 climbs onto the hill
- Vipers close in
- Paras #2 attacks --> 1 Viper out
- Vipers atack --> 1 Paralyzed, Paras #2 out
FRENZY!
- Vipers attack --> Paras #1 and Paras #3 out

Battle #3
Vipers win (2/3 Vipers left)

Spoiler Alert!

- Vipers cross the river, FRENZY! They wait on the sand dunes.
- Paras #2 climbs onto the hill
- Vipers attack --> Paras #1 out, Paras #3 out
- Paras #2 attacks --> 1 Viper out
- Vipers attack --> 1 Paralyzed, 1 shrugs off Sleep
FRENZY!
- Vipers attack --> 1 blocked, Paras #2 out

Summary
Paras are worth maybe 10 points versus squads. Not worth 15 points versus any of the squads. Against the Vipers, they won because the Vipers rolled poorly for Frenzy but more importantly because the Vipers choose to let the Paras attack first. With their 7 move (to the Paras' 4 move) they should always be able to choose first attack.

Paras is a 10 to 15 point figure. I'd vote YES to pass Paras at either 10 or 15 points.

[White Knight]

Added Parasect to the first page of this thread.

Originally Posted by Chardar

After reviewing all of the tests I would feel comfortable passing Paras at 15. And to be fair, everything is good against the Sahuagin Raider.

Any more discussion on Paras?

I vote YES to passing Paras at 10 or 15 points.

[Kroz]

Looking at the tests I think he is a ten point figure.

[NightSwipe]

I vote YES to passing Paras at 10 or 15 points.