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  #3289  
Old March 18th, 2019, 11:12 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

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...Although Deathwalkers really should be running with ZI's at this point...
Agreed. Let Deathwalkers be Deathwalkers. Just because ZI exist doesn't mean we have to try to kill them with every defense-ignoring power.
Completely agreed.
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Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Because of the Deathwalkers, many auto-wound powers are limited to small/medium only. I don't think it would be too rough on the shadows to follow that precedent here.
Or limit it to squad figures only, since squad-killing power is what drove the power in the first place. I could see either way, though small/medium is probably stronger theme-wise.
I should clarify what I said here, because I didn't speak carefully:

As Scytale alluded to, many auto-wound powers are S/M only. I think some of those don't have a great thematic justification, and are really only a carve-out to protect Deathwalkers.

Because the Zettian Infantry exist in the VC canon, I have no issue with thematic auto-wound powers that apply to all sizes. That's not carte blanche to extend every power conceivable to large and huge figures, but I think it is an invitation to avoid unthematic carve-outs.

In this case, I think a small/medium restriction makes sense. Or a squad/common restriction, as Bigga suggested. That's extra thematic.
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  #3290  
Old March 18th, 2019, 11:41 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

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I'd like to see Advanced Tactical Switch take place after moving and before attacking to give it a defined point in the turn (but still let you position him first), and require clear sight from your figure to Creese to activate the switch.
The reason i didnt do it, is that i wanted to give him this tricky flavor. This way i can move an enemy out of the way so can walk there without getting engaged. or i can move the enemy out of range after i attacked him. If i would limit it to after moving some cool interactions wouldn't excist.
Order of operations is important in heroscape, as it is in any turn based game. The SoV does not like abilities that don't make the order of things clear. You could do "Before or after moving" or you could do "Before or after attacking", but if you try to do both, you're going to receive a lot of push back, and they likely wouldn't accept the design. I would recommend "Before or after moving". This allows the traditional switch for height advantage that the Warforged Soldiers have.
Exactly this. The Heroscape ruleset just isn't robust enough to handle an "at any point" power.
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  #3291  
Old March 18th, 2019, 03:33 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Alright, i changed Creese to 2 defense but i increased his life by 1. i also changed his cost to 100. i edited the text so it requires line of sight and "any point during your turn" got replaced with "before or after moving".

the thing that i really dont like right now is, that i searched for a warforgy figure that could fit since he is rare these days. the only ones i found are Doctor Doom minis from Heroclix. not sure if that is something that could be used(maybe even the HS version, tyrian the kyrie warrior is a HS figure as well). if Dr. Doom is ok, he doesnt have a crossbow anymore and he is more like a mage guy but thats fine for me.
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  #3292  
Old March 18th, 2019, 04:08 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I'm far from a D&D expert and others may know more about what can classify as a Warforged, but something along these lines looks like a fine fit for one of them to me:


This sculpt itself seems to be rare/expensive online to me so it shouldn't be used, but I think that it's a good example of something that fits HeroScape without looking too much like Doctor Doom. He isn't as recognizable as Spider-Man or some of the other superheroes, but it could still look a little weird to see something iconic clearly from another franchise being used to represent a normal HeroScape unit. I believe that the Book of the Zettian Infantry talks about this problem a little bit.

HeroClix minis do generally have a good availability, and we already have Heirloom as a magic-using Warforged. I think it'll come down to the judges' and C3V's preferences for whether a Doctor Doom miniature can fit the Warforged aesthetic and isn't too distractingly recognizable as Doctor Doom himself.

As for the HeroScape version itself, I'd love for it to be used personally since it's already based and many of us own it already, but the bright green cloak might clash a little bit and I thought that you could see the skin around his eyes. The availability for HeroScape sets also isn't as high as they were back when Tyrian was approved, which might be another problem.
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  #3293  
Old March 18th, 2019, 04:21 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Eh... Doctor Doom is pretty well-known. I addition to that, we have an official 'Scape Doom.
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  #3294  
Old March 19th, 2019, 09:51 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

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Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Exactly this. The Heroscape ruleset just isn't robust enough to handle an "at any point" power.
Not with that attitude:



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  #3295  
Old March 19th, 2019, 03:23 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

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Originally Posted by NecroBlade View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Exactly this. The Heroscape ruleset just isn't robust enough to handle an "at any point" power.
Not with that attitude:
Spoiler Alert!
Trample Stomp still has text dictating where it belongs during the turn. Specifically "at any point while moving". Advanced Tactical Switch could be given a similar wording of "at any point while moving" and we would know, this action takes place during the movement phase of the turn. It also wouldn't really function any differently than just using "before or after Moving" since it's not an attack, and it doesn't wound anything.
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  #3296  
Old March 19th, 2019, 03:43 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I agree with Leaf_It here. "At any point" in the turn is very different from "at any point while moving," and I suspect that Scytale was referring to the former interpretation's potential to disrupt the normal structure of a turn in HeroScape.

That said, there is some tactical flexibility to be had in doing a power that can be activated at any point during movement, instead of only before or afterwards, since it would let Creese move forward a couple of spaces, activate the switch, and then move elsewhere (a previous version of C3V's Morgan's Riflemen actually did something similar). These cases would be fairly rare and niche, though, so I'd personally prefer to just keep it simple with a "before or after moving" timeframe for the switch.
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  #3297  
Old March 19th, 2019, 04:34 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

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Originally Posted by Astroking112 View Post
I'm far from a D&D expert and others may know more about what can classify as a Warforged, but something along these lines looks like a fine fit for one of them to me:


This sculpt itself seems to be rare/expensive online to me so it shouldn't be used, but I think that it's a good example of something that fits HeroScape without looking too much like Doctor Doom. He isn't as recognizable as Spider-Man or some of the other superheroes, but it could still look a little weird to see something iconic clearly from another franchise being used to represent a normal HeroScape unit. I believe that the Book of the Zettian Infantry talks about this problem a little bit.

HeroClix minis do generally have a good availability, and we already have Heirloom as a magic-using Warforged. I think it'll come down to the judges' and C3V's preferences for whether a Doctor Doom miniature can fit the Warforged aesthetic and isn't too distractingly recognizable as Doctor Doom himself.

As for the HeroScape version itself, I'd love for it to be used personally since it's already based and many of us own it already, but the bright green cloak might clash a little bit and I thought that you could see the skin around his eyes. The availability for HeroScape sets also isn't as high as they were back when Tyrian was approved, which might be another problem.
Doom is pretty iconic, but the sheer ragginess of the robes makes that figure in particular barely look like Doom. Seeing him as a Warforged Wizard wouldn't bother me, personally.


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  #3298  
Old March 19th, 2019, 04:37 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

If you threw that on a regular heroscape base it would probably look quite Warforged. I think.
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  #3299  
Old March 19th, 2019, 04:54 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Yeah, that figure was fairly high on the quick Google image search that I did of HeroClix Doctor Doom miniatures, and I thought that it was a good example of something that looks pretty distinct from Doctor Doom himself. If there's a cheaper and more common sculpt that's similar, then I think that the idea could work quite well.
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  #3300  
Old March 19th, 2019, 05:51 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

That's the Doctor Doom from Marvel's Ultimate Comics line. Goat legs are a giveaway. He doesn't have any other minis. Unlikely to get any anytime soon, since the Ultimate line is retired and Marvel restricts minis for Fantastic Four characters.
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