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  #37  
Old March 19th, 2019, 04:17 AM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

I prefer Deadly Shot off of Merlyn.

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  #38  
Old March 19th, 2019, 08:40 AM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

I like that direction. Might be hard to track if he's inflicted a wound or not this round (maybe use a marker?) but I like the idea.
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  #39  
Old March 19th, 2019, 12:49 PM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spidey'tilIDie View Post
I prefer Deadly Shot off of Merlyn.
I mean obviously the idea was to give him a shared power with Bullseye, but none of the current Dark Avengers draft go out of their way to share something with their villain forms...so Deadly Shot is valid.

Personally I think an archer/sniper with Deadly Aim just feels fresher than one with Deadly Shot. I guess it's one of those things where the group can decide.
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnny139 View Post
I like that direction. Might be hard to track if he's inflicted a wound or not this round (maybe use a marker?) but I like the idea.
A marker sounds good. Maybe adjust it like this, whee you have a choice to remove the marker or not. Really pushing that risk/reward idea.
Quote:

NAME = HAWKEYE
SECRET IDENTITY = LESTER ???

SPECIES = HUMAN
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = CHARLATAN
PERSONALITY = PRECISE

SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 5

MOVE = 5
RANGE = 9
ATTACK = 3
DEFENSE = 5

POINTS = ???


PSYCHOPATHIC DRIVE
Start the game with a purple Bullseye Marker. At the start of each round, place the Bullseye Marker on this card. While the Bullseye Marker is on this card, when Hawkeye attacks, he may attack one additional time. Whenever Hawkeye inflicts one or more wounds, you may remove the Bullseye Marker from this card.

DEADLY AIM
When attacking a non-adjacent figure within 5 clear sight spaces of Hawkeye, add 1 automatic skull to whatever is rolled. If an opponent rolls the 20-sided die for a figure attacked by Hawkeye's Deadly Aim, you may subtract 2 from or add 2 to the roll.

OFF THE HANDLE
Whenever you reveal a numbered Order Marker on any other Army Card you control but before using any other special powers, if the Bullseye Marker is on this card, you must immediately roll the 20-sided die. If you roll 16 or higher, you must take an immediate turn with Hawkeye, and you may not take any additional turns with other figures you control. When using Off The Handle, Hawkeye must attack 2 times with his normal attack, if possible.
@tcglkn I've kind of just been playing in your toybox without actually asking permission. Do you have any interest in ever running this character? If not, would you be okay if I took him and ran with it?
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  #40  
Old March 19th, 2019, 01:00 PM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

I like that a lot. Very Bullseye.
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  #41  
Old March 19th, 2019, 03:27 PM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

I think your reasoning for Deadly Aim over Deadly Shot is solid.

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  #42  
Old March 19th, 2019, 04:52 PM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

I prefer Deadly Aim too. Deadly Shot would retroactively make Merlyn less interesting and distinct.


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  #43  
Old March 19th, 2019, 04:59 PM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazy Orang View Post
I prefer Deadly Aim too. Deadly Shot would retroactively make Merlyn less interesting and distinct.
my worry would be that Hawkeye would make Bullseye feel less interesting and distinct. I'm hoping the class difference (Assassin vs. Charlatan) and the annoyance of a Self-Importance clone will be enough to keep them separate.
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  #44  
Old March 19th, 2019, 10:41 PM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

I'm a little confused about how many times he gets to attack on his 'Self Importance' turns.

I'd also really recommend reusing Self Importance and then having his 'Off the Handle' power do all the heavy lifting as far as 'his Self Importance turns look like this and Self Importance only works under these circumstances', like how Raph has Wrath of Raph modifying Self Importance.

(Self Importance has language to clean up the way it interacts with other instances of Self Importance, so reusing it is mechanically cleaner than doing a knock-off)

Really dig the overall direction, though! Always happy to see more Charlatans, and this definitely feels like "Hawkeye" as I remember him.

EDIT: Oh, and I like keeping Deadly Aim as a Bullseye signature! I think the different synergy web and the Self Importance mechanic definitely differentiate him from OG Bullseye.
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  #45  
Old March 20th, 2019, 12:02 AM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin View Post
I'm a little confused about how many times he gets to attack on his 'Self Importance' turns.

I'd also really recommend reusing Self Importance and then having his 'Off the Handle' power do all the heavy lifting as far as 'his Self Importance turns look like this and Self Importance only works under these circumstances', like how Raph has Wrath of Raph modifying Self Importance.

(Self Importance has language to clean up the way it interacts with other instances of Self Importance, so reusing it is mechanically cleaner than doing a knock-off)

Really dig the overall direction, though! Always happy to see more Charlatans, and this definitely feels like "Hawkeye" as I remember him.

EDIT: Oh, and I like keeping Deadly Aim as a Bullseye signature! I think the different synergy web and the Self Importance mechanic definitely differentiate him from OG Bullseye.
So the intention was that he attacks 2 times during his turn where he goes rogue. As a side note, looking at the text again, I think there's some points that needs clarifying.

If he inflicts a wound on his first attack and removes the marker, would he get the double attack? I don't like that it's open ended. (I made an attempt at changing this, see the red text)

Both Self-Importance characters before this had a movement power that S-I referenced. How flexible are we willing to go with that? Could we edit it to reference something else or remove it entirely? (See the blue text)
Quote:

NAME = HAWKEYE
SECRET IDENTITY = LESTER ???

SPECIES = HUMAN
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = CHARLATAN
PERSONALITY = PRECISE

SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 5

MOVE = 5
RANGE = 9
ATTACK = 3
DEFENSE = 5

POINTS = ???


PSYCHOPATHIC DRIVE
Start the game with a purple Bullseye Marker. At the start of each round, place the Bullseye Marker on this card. While the Bullseye Marker is on this card, when Hawkeye attacks, he may attack one additional time. At the end of your turn, if Hawkeye inflicts one or more wounds, you may remove the Bullseye Marker from this card.

DEADLY AIM
When attacking a non-adjacent figure within 5 clear sight spaces of Hawkeye, add 1 automatic skull to whatever is rolled. If an opponent rolls the 20-sided die for a figure attacked by Hawkeye's Deadly Aim, you may subtract 2 from or add 2 to the roll.

OFF THE HANDLE
If the Bullseye Marker is not on this card, you may not use Hawkeye's Self Importance special power. When Hawkeye takes a turn with Self Importance, he must attack as many times as possible, up to a maximum of 2 times.

SELF IMPORTANCE 16
Whenever you reveal a numbered Order Marker on any other Army Card you control, before using any other special powers, you must immediately roll the 20-sided die. If you roll 16 or higher, you must take an immediate turn with Hawkeye, and you may not take any additional turns with other figures you control. When using Self Importance 16, add 2 spaces to Penguin's Umbrella-Copter movement for that turn. You may only roll for Self Importance once per Order Marker.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Really not digging hitting 4 powers and max text length on "crazy guy who shoots arrows really well" so I'm going to throw out an alternate workaround suggestion.
Quote:
OFF THE HANDLE
Immediately before you reveal a numbered Order Marker on an Army Card you control and taking a turn with that figure, if the Bullseye Marker is on this card, you must roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 16 or higher you must immediately move that Order Marker to this Army Card and take a turn with Hawkeye instead. During this turn, Hawkeye must attack as many times as possible, to a maximum of 2 times.
A bit janky but it should do about the same thing, and I guess a future Victoria Hand or whatever could stop OMs from moving card to card, which would help both Hawkeye and Iron Patriot.
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  #46  
Old March 20th, 2019, 12:31 AM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

I was thinking something like this:

Quote:
OFF THE HANDLE
Start each round with the purple Bullseye Marker on this card. Hawkeye can only use his Self Importance special power while the Bullseye Marker is on this card. When Hawkeye attacks, if the Bullseye Marker is on this card, he must attack one additional time, if possible. After taking a turn with Hawkeye, if he inflicted one or more wounds with his normal attack, remove the Bullseye Marker from this card.

DEADLY AIM

SELF IMPORTANCE 16
That makes a slight mechanical change by making it so that he always must attack twice when he's got the Bullseye Marker, but it feels a little cleaner to me that way. I wouldn't mind changing the Self Importance text to modify his normal movement or maybe his range. Superspeed has flexed more than that (see the original version on one of the Flashes vs Kid Flash's version vs Jesse Quick's version).

I'm very into the 'steal an OM' direction, though!
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  #47  
Old March 20th, 2019, 12:35 AM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

How will Self Importance work without a movement power?

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  #48  
Old March 20th, 2019, 01:00 AM
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Re: Dark Avengers/Cabal/H.A.M.M.E.R. Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by quozl View Post
How will Self Importance work without a movement power?
1) Fudge the text a little bit, like has been done with some versions of Speed Dodge, so it boosts some other aspect of his card.
2) Remove that clause entirely (I don’t like this option)
3) Give him a movement power like Grapple Arrow (I don’t like this option either)
3) Don’t use Self Importance, find a new way to get the same effect. (See the power I posted underneath the dotted line)
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