Soldiers of Valhalla - nominations and discussion

[nyys]

Seeking permission I think is the most important thing to do first. If you don't hear back (and I would give it a bit of time) at least you did your due diligence. And as caps said, always give proper credit.

[greygnarl]

Alright thanks. Proposal sent.

[nyys]

Dashi Tokainto by qt.bangerang

Game Play
The obvious builds for Dashi involve several, if not all, of the other Ninja units in the game. Units that were once 'filler' or scenario fodder can now be reasonably pulled into a competative army. I like that a lot.

In trying to maximize Dashi and also have as competitive and thematic army as possible I tried run all sorts of mixes. All Ninjas, Ninjas and Ashigaru, Ninjas and a Heavy Hitter, the list goes on. The common theme in all the builds were that, with smart choices, this group could hold their own against 'B' level armies and below. Against the juggernauts, well, lets just say 'Dead Ninja' was called out repeatedly. Not a bad thing though. I think a nice mix of fun and competitiveness was pulled off here.

Initially I had reservations with Dashi having Counterstrike. It just seemed odd. But then I read qt's bio for him and it all made sense. As long as it wasn't overpowered it wasn't going to be an issue for me.

It (counterstrike) proved not to be an issue in my games. In fact Dashi presented a nice little brain burn in how to use him. With his 'bonding' power allowing him to go first and then up to two ninja's (or a squad) as long as he isn't engaged really caused me to pause and decide if going after something like a Minion is a good idea (or a hero at all) with Dashi. If he's engaged then he can't 'bond' with those other ninjas.

Fine, just make sure you can destroy your target. Well, as nice as Phantom Walk and Counterstrike are, they don't help with an attack of 2. Even with height your not brimming with confidence that you can pull it off. So what do you do? Go for broke and hope you get your three attacks (using two other ninjas), or hold him back so you guarantee yourself at least 2 attacks? This is a great decision making unit.

Add in the 5 defense and Counterstrike and he has plenty of staying power to keep you making those decisions for a good portion of the game.

The only issue at this point I have with Dashi is his allegiance to Valkrill. Not sure that works for me.

Cost
120 points works well for Dashi, no complaints in building an army with the Ninjas and still having the ability to bulk up the army where needed. I also wouldn't have complained at 110.

Model
I don't have this model so I can't comment on aesthetics. I'm trusting my fellow Scapers that he fits. From the few solo pics I've seen of Dashi, it looks great.

Conclusion
Dashi is a fun, thematic unit that fits in quite well with one exception, his allegiance to Valkrill. Considering all the units that currently make up Valkrill's masses, Dashi seems like an odd fit to me. When I think Valkrill, I think monstrosities, pure evil, chaos. When I think Dashi, I think Ninja who went rogue. Evil, sure, just not super evil. Utgar is my first thought to place Dashi. Evil, perhaps traitorous, which fits well for Utgar IMO. I could even see him in the ranks of Vydar potentially, but not Valkrill.

Unfortunately, as good as the unit is, Valkrill is too much of a theme break for me. Everything works IMO except for what may seem like something little to those who don't care for 'fluff,' but I think is a big deal for others, and I have to look at this from all angles.

I vote No to induct Dashi into the SoV.

[The CEE]

Originally Posted by nyys

I vote No to induct Dashi into the SoV.

That came as a surprise to me. It looks like Dashi will not be inducted into the SoV after all.

[Gurei-Ornery]

Originally Posted by The CEE

That came as a surprise to me. It looks like Dashi will not be inducted into the SoV after all.

This seems like an instance where a simple General change could be suggested or a Yes vote with a stipulation of if it is changed to x or y. I understand that's not how this works for those that would like to remind me.

[ZBeeblebrox]

Originally Posted by Gurei-Ornery

This seems like an instance where a simple General change could be suggested or a Yes vote with a stipulation of if it is changed to x or y. I understand that's not how this works for those that would like to remind me.

If qt makes some changes he's always free to re-submit Dashi later...with all the tests he went through already, I'm sure he'd be one of the fastest SoV units to be voted to be reviewed.

[nyys]

[greygnarl]

Too lazy to check the wording, but make sure that he can't double bond through Ornak and you're set. If he's not put on the fast track through as Utgar I don't know what will happen.

One thing that has bothered me about scpae is that Aquilla and Valkrill seemed tacked on. I'd be fine with a new general with it's own style but A and V are like Ullar and Utgar on steroids. Nothing that couldn't have fit. (Besides dwarves, but those don't fit Aquilla anyway.)

[qt.bangerang]

Changes are already underway and he will be resubmitted soon with the most of the suggested changes.

[Dad_Scaper]

Originally Posted by greygnarl

Too lazy to check the wording, but make sure that he can't double bond through Ornak and you're set. If he's not put on the fast track through as Utgar I don't know what will happen.

One thing that has bothered me about scpae is that Aquilla and Valkrill seemed tacked on. I'd be fine with a new general with it's own style but A and V are like Ullar and Utgar on steroids. Nothing that couldn't have fit. (Besides dwarves, but those don't fit Aquilla anyway.)

My main complaint about Valkrill is I wish we'd gotten him earlier.

I understand him to be a force for *chaos*, not just evil. So the Vulcanmech Incendiborgs work for him thematically, because they just stomp around setting things on fire, and the Death Chasers work for him mechanically, because they rush in so fast you don't have a chance to get organized.

Also I really like being able to split up the villains some. It makes it possible, as a tournament director, to fool with different formats. Or it would have, if we'd gotten him earlier.

So I'm a big fan of Valkrill. Now that we have him, I'm glad to use him with the C3V and I am thrilled to see him getting some love in the SoV, too.

It's not my place to say (it used to be, but...), but I'm inclined to agree with nyys. Ninja says to me discipline and focus and organization, and Dashi also had the whole command structure thing going, which is not the madness and chaos I associate with Valkrill. So I'm inclined to agree with nyys.

Not that I vote any more.

[UtahScott]

Originally Posted by qt.bangerang

Changes are already underway and he will be resubmitted soon with the most of the suggested changes.

My $.02 for Dashi...haven't done any testing, but I've got the figure.

Wish his Attack was 3.
General: Utgar (for the conniving, secretive goals), Einar (Imperial Japan era, easy fit).
Grey coloration could be Vydar (mechanical planning, individual goals indepent of the other generals) or Aquilla (both colors, a disparate "tribe" of ninja) at a stretch. Valkrill doesn't fit.

Name: What's the source? Granted, my Japanese was 20 years ago--I'm no linguist--but Tokainto especially is very awkward to voice.

[superfrog]

Originally Posted by UtahScott

My $.02 for Dashi...haven't done any testing, but I've got the figure.

Wish his Attack was 3.
General: Utgar (for the conniving, secretive goals), Einar (Imperial Japan era, easy fit).
Grey coloration could be Vydar (mechanical planning, individual goals indepent of the other generals) or Aquilla (both colors, a disparate "tribe" of ninja) at a stretch. Valkrill doesn't fit.

Name: What's the source? Granted, my Japanese was 20 years ago--I'm no linguist--but Tokainto especially is very awkward to voice.

Many of these things are being worked on.