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  #4249  
Old August 29th, 2020, 06:30 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo Ultra View Post
That's a good point. We do have a Unique Squad in the works and this is a concern, although we do not intend to create any Common Squads in the Yokai faction, or at least, no Common Yokai Squads. For fixing the glaring unwanted synergy of moving A, swapping A and B, then moving B, I'm thinking about how we can word something that distinguishes between Army Cards. For example,

"Before moving normally with any Yokai figure you control, you may first switch it with a Yokai you control with a different name. Figures moved by Shapeshift never take any leaving engagement attacks."
Argh, I had missed that my proposed version still allows for squad figures to catapult themselves forward if the initial figures give up their Shapeshifting. That won't do, then.

I know that you're working on an Uncommon Yokai Hero (which you should really get around to posting sometime ). Limiting Shapeshift to cards with different names unfortunately stops any Uncommon Heroes from being able to switch with each other.

Upon further reflection (and considering that all of the furthest progressed drafts right now are heroes anyway), I think that the cleanest solution is to just limit Shapeshift to Yokai Heroes swapping with any Yokai figure. That still gives squads inherent value to be switched with; if a future squad design needs to be able to Shapeshift on their own, then they can include their own ability to do so.
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  #4250  
Old August 30th, 2020, 04:55 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astroking112 View Post
I know that you're working on an Uncommon Yokai Hero (which you should really get around to posting sometime ). Limiting Shapeshift to cards with different names unfortunately stops any Uncommon Heroes from being able to switch with each other.
Oops. That is true.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astroking112 View Post
Upon further reflection (and considering that all of the furthest progressed drafts right now are heroes anyway), I think that the cleanest solution is to just limit Shapeshift to Yokai Heroes swapping with any Yokai figure. That still gives squads inherent value to be switched with; if a future squad design needs to be able to Shapeshift on their own, then they can include their own ability to do so.
Hmmm... I suppose that works, although I'm actually not against preventing switching 2 of the same Uncommon, which just feels a bit awkward to me. Allowing it is better for synergy and gameplay though, I think.

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  #4251  
Old September 9th, 2020, 05:46 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I am working on some Velociraptors that I would like to put through the SoV process. I've never done a design for the project before and finally found a miniature that I believe can be secured in quantity. I'm waiting to hear back from them.


NAME = Velociraptors
GENERAL = Aquilla
SPECIES = Dinosaur
UNIQUENESS = Common Squad (3 figure)
CLASS = Predators
PERSONALITY = Tricky
SIZE/HEIGHT = Small or Medium (depending on which figure but definitely single spaced.

LIFE = 1
MOVE = 5
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 2
DEFENSE = 3
POINTS = 65

PACK TACTICS
When attacking with a Velociraptor, add 1 attack die for each other adjacent Velociraptor up to a maximum of +2 dice, for the Pack Tactics power.

STRATEGIC PREDATOR BONDING
Before taking a turn with Velociraptors, you may first take a turn with any Predator Hero that you control. If you do not take a turn with any Predator Hero that you control, add 2 to the Velociraptor's move number.

Right now my miniature options would require basing but they are painted and seem to be available with a few thousand sales and a not from the shop that it can be restocked. Quite affordable too! Thanks to Captaindude on the discord for finding them.

The Raptors are quite small but still useable here at .625 inches tall: https://www.etsy.com/listing/8153775...active_9&crt=1

Or the T-Rex mini could be substituted and might make a better fit, same price but a little larger at .875 inches tall: https://www.etsy.com/listing/8014882...ctive_81&crt=1

I am leaning towards the second option, I think it looks reasonable next to standard figure.

Last edited by Shiftrex; September 9th, 2020 at 06:10 PM.
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  #4252  
Old September 9th, 2020, 05:58 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

First, making a squad out of a single figure is almost never allowed, though there are exceptions (like the two versions of Ants). These probably wouldn't pass, but maybe, given how small they are. You can get around that by making them pseudo-squad Common Heroes, though there is some weariness in VC for things like that.

Aside from that, it's a good design. In terms of abilities and stats they are nicely restrained. Pack Tactics should have a "you control" on it, but otherwise a good, useful power.

A squad can't be Predators, though. The Spiders' Predator Bonding locked out that possibility (the ODs didn't limit that to Predator Heroes, as you did here). You can make them something else, though. Scouts would be fitting.

I don't think Tricky is the right personality. Nothing about the design suggests they are tricky, or optimally play in a tricky way. Relentless would work.
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  #4253  
Old September 9th, 2020, 06:22 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

My rule of thumb about duplicate figures:

If the figure is mostly two-dimensional (flat to the base), I don't care if it's a duplicate. If it's three-dimensional (a dynamic or upright pose), it shouldn't be a duplicate.

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  #4254  
Old September 9th, 2020, 07:02 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Ok, thanks for the input. The idea of a psuedo squad via common/uncommon hero doesn't interest me so I'll move on to something else. Thanks!
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  #4255  
Old September 15th, 2020, 02:50 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I think I'm ready to get further help with this guy.

Quote:
Spoiler Alert!

Ebol
Valkrill

Outsider
Unique Hero
Brain
Systematic
SMALL 4

Life 4
Move 5
Range 5
Attack 2
Defense 2
Points 80

CENTRAL HUB
While you control Ebol, you must place all Order Markers on this card.

NEURAL TRANSMISSION
Before revealing a numbered Order Marker on this Army Card, you may choose one Army Card with at least one figure you control. Move that Order Marker to the chosen Army Card and reveal it on that Army Card instead. You may also move the “X” order marker to the chosen Army Card if it is still on this card.

SENSORY OVERLOAD
When a figure you control other than Ebol receives at least one wound, roll the 20-sided die. Subtract one from your roll for each wound that figure received. If you roll a 5 or lower, you must either place one wound marker on this card or remove one unrevealed order marker from this card.

LEVITATION
Ebol does not take falling damage and may ignore all effects from terrain tiles he moves onto or occupies.
My biggest concern for Ebol is if he overshadows Rygarn. I've mostly dismissed this because Rygarn provides less OM flexibility for less risk. Ebol can be put in danger mid-late game if your opponent can find a way to assassinate him Turn 1 once your front line has thinned out.

Other than that, I have loved the way he helps control different armies and how each of his powers play different based on the army he is controlling.

Would love to just hear of any potential concerns others have. @Chris Perkins has helped a ton in playing games and giving constructive feedback, and I've played one game each with @Vydar is the man and @kevindola who both gave great feedback as well. Big thanks to each of them!

There has also been some discussion on how to better word the X OM portion of Neural Transmission and the post-d20 roll part of Overload.

Thanks to each of you for your help!

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  #4256  
Old September 15th, 2020, 03:09 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Just as an FYI that Contemplative miniature was announced as going to be used in C3V in June.

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  #4257  
Old September 15th, 2020, 03:13 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by robbdaman View Post
Just as an FYI that Contemplative miniature was announced as going to be used in C3V in June.
Guess you gotta follow the news more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by superfrog View Post
By the way, the brain with the gun does not currently have a C3V design in process. If anybody would like to come up with their own card and submit to the SoV a la Executioner 616 we would be glad to see the whole box used!

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  #4258  
Old September 15th, 2020, 03:20 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Within C3V's forum space it's impossible to follow it all, particularly the Starfinder development as it's way too much at one time. If they aren't using that one it's not the most common knowledge since it wasn't posted when announced.

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  #4259  
Old September 15th, 2020, 03:24 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I don't think a unit of this immensely useful order marker freedom will ever be passed by VC. I don't think it should, either; it changes the metagame too severely. At 80 points, it's straight-up broken, allowing for all sorts of army builds that struggle with order marker usage.

Order marker freedom is deceptively powerful, and should only be used in limited ways. Most notably for factions, but also in limited ways like Rygarn does.
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  #4260  
Old September 15th, 2020, 04:46 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I like the direction of the design for evoking a neural network (and it feels extremely thematic!), although I am also concerned about just how much OM freedom it gives. Sensory Overload poses a significant risk (I'd imagine that this is the most likely way that Ebol will die in many games, since it'll often be difficult to breach the SZ), but I'm not sure if the threat of losing most of a round is enough to fully make up for the carte blanche before that. It's a difficult thing to balance, and like Scytale noted, even if it's balanced, it might not even pass VC for that reason.

In terms of suggestions, I think that emphasizing this risk aspect a bit more (and potentially limiting the OM freedom like Rygarn) could help address those concerns a bit. If Sensory Overload was a significantly higher risk (either from having a lower life or a greater chance of wounding), then many builds that struggle with OMs might not want to take that plunge. As another example, if the OMs could only be moved to figures within 6 clear sight spaces a la Rygarn, then he has to stay on the frontlines and is no longer always useful. Building off of this, I think that Ebol shouldn't be able to sacrifice an unrevealed OM to save himself from a wound--it essentially gives him a free pass each round, and I think that the risk from Overload becomes much more pronounced without it.

For more minor nitpicks, I think that moving the X OM from his card with a numbered OM isn't useful enough to be worth the text. Unless I'm forgetting something major off the top of my head, the only real uses that it serves is to make powers like Crag of Steel still activatable with Ebol (many other ones using the X, like Public Playtesting's recent Ranjit Singh, occur before initiative, so they're still prohibited by Central Hub anyway). Effectively taking away the player's ability to bluff and cutting some figures like Heracles or Siege out of the network feels like a healthier change to me, and it makes for a simpler card.

I'm not sure if I like or dislike how strong Ebol is with the Children of the Dark Star. They do a lot to remove the risks of Sensory Overload, and they can effectively just be spammed without any other big Outsiders since they get to activate 6, 5, and then 4 figures. It's definitely a concerning synergy, but it also gels quite nicely with their card.
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