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C3G Library This area collects all the released designs. Feel free to post any figure specific questions in their individual books.


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  #25  
Old May 29th, 2020, 04:12 PM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies(Vote for Initial Casting)

yea
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  #26  
Old May 29th, 2020, 04:14 PM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

This passes.
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  #27  
Old May 29th, 2020, 04:14 PM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

Yea
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  #28  
Old May 29th, 2020, 04:19 PM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

Should it also effect the range on SAs? Abilities? Maybe just reduce those by 1 since they are more likely to be an effect. That might bring the range reduction effect up to match the wound option.

Actually since his is a Unique Spell and thus you only get one shot at using it, I'd be pretty comfortable with the W to squads/common heroes (Wasp I isn't effected at all) being close to automatic for him.
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  #29  
Old May 29th, 2020, 04:23 PM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

Could just say they can only attack or choose adjacent figures if we want no range.
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  #30  
Old May 30th, 2020, 03:02 AM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

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Originally Posted by Yodaking View Post
Actually since his is a Unique Spell and thus you only get one shot at using it, I'd be pretty comfortable with the W to squads/common heroes (Wasp I isn't effected at all) being close to automatic for him.
If it's too close to automatic this will be an auto-draft against more than a few units. There might be a couple mistakes in this list but here is what I came across at 40+ points per model:

Common Heroes and Squads...
Arthrian Invaders 90 points per model
Dalek Drones 75 points per model
Lex Corp Security 65 points per model
Thunderers of Qward 65 points per model
Skull Warriors 55 points per model
Blood Demons 53 points per model
Hawkmen of Thanagar 50 points per model
Walkers 50 points per model
Hulkbuster Soldiers 42 points per model
Gorilla City Warriors 42 points per model
Kree Scout 40 points per model
Intergang Agents 40 points per model
Parademon Shock Troopers 40 points per model

Unique Squads...
Fire Demons 63 points per model
Triplicate Girl 63 points per model
Elite League Assassins 50 points per model
Man-Bat Assassins 50 points per model
Scarlet Spiders 50 points per model
Atlantean Palace Guards 48 points per model
Hand Mystics 48 points per model
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  #31  
Old May 30th, 2020, 03:33 PM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

Yup, that's why we added in the d20 roll. Now we're just discussing what number is a good balance between the squad killing potential and the unique hero range reduction.

So in order to kill that one Atlantean Palace Guard, you have to draft the spell (20-25 points?), then you have to draft someone to cast it. Nemesis is the only Warlock (it's his spell), so if you want to get the +6 to your d20 roll you'll have to draft him at 245 points. Then once he's in range to use the spell, you give up your move, roll the d20, (currently) get a 7+, add 6 to that roll, destroy Guard, if you roll 1-6, don't destroy guard, the spell is done with either way. If you didn't want to play Nemesis, say you wanted to play an X-men build, you could draft the new Magik to cast the spell. Shes going to be one of the cheapest MD options so she'd be a good way to gain access to this spell in any army build. While that leaves you more creative control over the rest of your army, she does not get the +6 to the d20 roll. So now when she gives up her move to cast the spell (which she could do when Cyclopes II gives her a free move action to use), she rolls the d20 and is (currently) looking for a 13+ to kill that guard. A 1-12 results in no wound, either way the spell is done with.

Now say all the Atlantean Palace Guards get killed off before Majik/Nemesis gets to cast this spell. Or say Majik/Nemesis ends up getting targeted early and finds themselves with just 1 life left. Now, even though you drafted the spell thinking you could use it to kill a Atlantean Palace Guard, you are instead finding you need to cast it on a ranged unique hero or not cast it at all. So you cast the spell on a unique hero, at what point should the effect and d20 roll be such that you are satisfied it was a decent use of 20-25 points to cast the spell?

So when I said I'd be comfortable with it being near automatic, I was talking for Nemesis specifically. What I was thinking at the time was lowering the roll to 10+ for everyone else. That makes it a 50/50 chance for regular MD figures, Nemesis would get the +6 to that roll though so for him it would be a 80% chance of success (4+).

I also like Tickle's idea of only allowing the Unique Hero impacted to target adjacent figures for any attacks or special powers. For me that would communicate the idea the figure is surrounded by a huge swarm of biting flies and they can only lash out at the swarm in an attempt to drive them away. Or they can jump into the water to get rid of the flies and attack or use a special power normally.
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  #32  
Old May 30th, 2020, 05:34 PM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

Sounds good.
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  #33  
Old May 31st, 2020, 01:10 AM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

I understand where you guys are going with this. I believe there is some precedent for this sort of split, but as written the option to possibly wound a common/squad figure vs the certainty of reducing range on a unique figure feel like fairly disparate uses and outcomes.

For what it's worth...

I prefer the range reduction aspect of the spell. I like the idea of chasing a ranged figure into the water to avoid the flies. It has a cool synergy with the Lightning Bolt spell and I would definitely be inclined to take one or two of those along with Lord of the Flies. I think it's fine to reduce the target's range to 1 rather than reduce it by X, and I wouldn't mind the spell being limited to this effect and costed appropriately.

If the wounding effect is kept in, I think it would be better to make it more of a choice, rather than different effects for different types of figures. The flies are sent either to attack or harass. I'm not sure why they would be more capable of hurting alien soldiers or demons than they would be J. Jonah Jameson or even a non-SS superhero. As it stands the wounding aspect of the spell is kind of polar based on matchup. You might be able to kill 90 points worth of Arthrian Invader with a 20-25 point spell...or your opponent might just have civilians or no commons/squads at all. I think opening it up to more figures would reduce the power variance and make it easier to balance the two effects regardless of matchup.

So here is my thought:

LORD OF THE FLIES
Unique Spell
Cost ?

Instead of moving, this figure may cast this spell. Choose a figure that is not occupying a water space and is within clear sight of this figure. Choose one of the following effects:
- Until the end of the round, if a figure from this army card is not occupying a water space that figure has a range of 1. (maybe include Special Attacks and powers in this effect?)
- Roll a twenty-sided die. If this figure is a Warlock, add 6 to the roll. If the targeted figure has Super Strength, subtract 10(?) from the roll. If you roll X or higher, the targeted figure takes a wound.
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  #34  
Old May 31st, 2020, 01:11 AM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

You can't track range reduction easily on a single squad figure for an entire round.
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  #35  
Old May 31st, 2020, 01:16 AM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tcglkn View Post
You can't track range reduction easily on a single squad figure for an entire round.
I understand that is why the effects are currently split as they are. My suggestion is to affect all figures from that figure's army card so long as they are not on a water space. So the caster says to the flies, "See that Hulkbuster Soldier? Go harass anyone that looks like him." Limiting a single squad figure's range wouldn't be as effective/worthwhile as limiting a hero's range most of the time, anyway.

Edit: I may not have been clear the way I wrote it. "This figure's army card" is meant to be the targeted figure's army card.

Edit again: Not correctly quoting myself, but you get the idea.
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  #36  
Old May 31st, 2020, 01:56 AM
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Re: Spellbook of Lord of the Flies (Initial Casting)

Yeah, I could see that where the range reduction is automatic while the the wound option is not. Extending the 1 wound option to unique heroes gives you a reason to cast it when only facing melee heroes (ranged units were killed off before being able to cast it).
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