Delta/Delta+ People's Play Thread (title under construction)

[The_X_Marker]

At the whim of the people, we have decided to keep the research and development thread seperate from the people's play testing thread.

If you want to put some input into the Delta System, all are welcome, just add it in here: DELTA/+ R&D Department

Now, the essential pieces of this thread:

DELTA/+ ARMY BUILDER

The Spreadsheets

Delta:


Delta+


This is not a thread to post proposed changes, keep that to the linked thread. This is a thread to post play tests and general thoughts about the matches played. We will be looking at these play tests and the general tournament reports that will be coming out to propose changes to the point costs.

*******This thread can be freely necro'd as long as there is a good reason. Please do not make more Delta Battle Reports Threads*******

[The_X_Marker]

To break the ice, I'll start.

The armies were:

Me:
Venoc Warlord 125
3x Fyorlag Spiders 105
2x Wyvern 190
Estivara 75

495 Delta/15 spaces
(520 regular)

Ms. X Marker:
Sir Gilbert 125
2x Knights of Weston 170
2x 4th Mass 200

495 Delta/17 spaces
(385 regular)

I decided to put my favorite Delta army against a championship level army to see how I stood up. Even with my boosts for the spiders, it was just about a massacre. They did get a +1 attack and a +1 defense glyph, but they were still too weak to hold either.

At one point, Estivara got a venom ray on Gilbert for one damage, and then got three more damage in effect rolls. The next turn, she got shredded by WTFing 4th.

A wyvren got into engagement with three knights and three 4th, and managed to kill a few knights and two 4th before dying a brutal death. Through the ruckus, some spiders attacked and killed just one of the two 4th that they engaged. Two knights managed to get the two glyphs in the following turn.

I managed to talon grab Gilbert too, dragging him to his death, but by then I was down to a few spiders, Mittens, and the other wyvern, who had 2 wounds from leaving engagements with some knights. With their movement boost, the spiders that were left managed to tie up and kill three of the remaining 4th before being fired into oblivion by the remaining three.

Mittens managed to do about no damage before dying to the effort of boosted WTF shots from height.

The end result was 3 4th and 5 knights. Even so, I am happy with how it worked out, although a lot of that might be due to the real point difference.

After game thoughts: Squishy spiders are still just as squishy, even in Delta. Tough knights and tough armies are still tough. It just shows that many top tier armies are still pretty top tier in Delta, even with the price changes.

[kolakoski]

Well met!

Originally Posted by The_X_Marker

Me:
Venoc Warlord 125
3x Fyorlag Spiders 105
2x Wyvern 190
Estivara 75

495 Delta/15 spaces
(520 regular)

Ms. X Marker:
Sir Gilbert 125
2x Knights of Weston 170
2x 4th Mass 200

495 Delta/17 spaces
(385 regular)

If you played the Krav instead of the Venoc Warlord, the outcome might have been different. Delta/Delta+ allows a cheaper Spider/Wyvern core (good thing), but you still need the Krav, assuming you're keeping Estivara, to be truly competitive, especially against the "top tier."

P.S.: Should I move my previous Delta+ Battle Reports to this thread? I created some threads a while back that might be relevant sites for portions of this discussion: Metagame Evolution in ∆ and Heroscape - Δ (formerly Legacy) Competitive Armies.

[The_X_Marker]

Yes, move them on over! Let's populate this thread a bit!

[kolakoski]

Well met!

Below are the three Delta+ Battle Reports I've issued thus far:

Three Gates Battle Report

It is 11:20 A.M. on a dreary day of rain, perfect for a day of Heroscape, and the long-awaited and highly anticipated (at least by me ) Battle of the Three Gates is set to begin.

kolakoski's view (initial game)

The following pictures depict various moments (including special deaths) in the three games we played (some may be out of order) - all of which I won. In the first two games, in spite my forgetting to add 6 to the Drow's 20-sider in defense on Shadow through half the first game, and despite going against the results of my poll in the first game - What would you play? - (except for Sock's support) - they were virtually unkillable, and I won handily.


In the first game, I played

220 Einar Imperium x 2
150 Racheim
130 Krav
500, 11 spaces, and

195 Drow x 3
130 DW9000
110 Raelin SotM
65 Elaria
500, 12 spaces.

Elaria moved into the center of the Shadow Passage to cheerlead the Drow, and was never attacked.

My Racheim looked great, but was not needed.

Sherman's Dreadgul army was even more helpless against the Drow, having no ranged attack. Two of my Krav were killed early on, one by Jotun with Throw and bludgeon, and one by my moving in such a way that another unit (I forget what kind ) could just reach the Gallery (moving adjacent to the Krav).

The lone remaining Krav.

DW9000 moved once and did nothing for the rest of the game. The Drow and the EI were all I really needed. That Sherman continued running the Dreadguls out there for three games, even with Braxas and Quahon in Games 2 and 3, contributed mightily to my managing to win all three games.

In the second game, I played

220 EI x 2
140 Mimring
140 Eltahale
500, 9 spaces, and

220 Q9
195 Drow x 3
85 Warden 816
500, 12 spaces.

chas was running Eradicators and, aside from a moment of glory when they took down Mimring in one turn, they were no match for the Drow, who rolled magnificently when Hiding in Darkness and even managed to inflict a Poison Weapon wound on a hapless hero (I forget which one ). Sherman's Microcorp Troopers also fared badly, as their normal attacks mostly missed the Drow, and they were Firelined by Mimring (just before his aforementioned untimely demise).

Fireline!






Q9 was intimidating, but did little in the second game.

In the third game, I played

220 EI x 2
150 Othkurik
130 DW9000
500, 9 spaces, and

195 Drow x 3
120 Kee-Mo-Shi
110 Raelin SotM
65 Elaria
490, 12 spaces.

Sherman had Quihon (Braxas as proxy), and tore up my army - the major moment when she took out two Einar Imperium and a Drow in one shot! - while chas' Vampire army was wiped out though a combination of my audacity and his bad luck. As both chas and Sherman eschewed the Shadow Passage this time, Kee-Mo-Shi did nothing per se, although her mere approach scared Sherman into retreating Quahon from my Gallery, before she could do any further multi-unit Lightening damage.

In the end, neither of us had enough units to cover five Glyphs and the game seemed in the bag for me, as I had Elaria, Kee-Mo-Shi, [one Drow?] and Deathwalker 9000, against Sherman's Valguard and two Dreadguls. Rather than retreat and guarantee a win on points, I attacked with Elaria and Kee-Mo-Shi on the ground. Sherman managed to brilliantly bounce between them with Valguard in such a way as to kill them both, at the cost of one Dreadgul, whereupon he, being up in points [?!] (Valguard (95) + Dreadgul (65, Sherman somehow giving himself full value for this squad) = 150, versus Deathwalker 9000 = 130), did retreat, hoping to hold out for the final two Rounds. His Dreadgul was safely away, and his Valguard, with, by then, two lives remaining out of his original seven, fled through the Shadow Passage, giving me but one shot to stop him before he was permanently out of range, as depicted below. (You can just see Valguard's base, and feet, below the battlements, under the far Gallery.)

Deathwalker 9000 fires the fatal,
final shot of the game!

As usual, chas and Sherman will fill in the details that I left out, or got wrong, in their comments.

The Lost City in the Sky! - Battle Report

The Gang of Four (Minus One) played The Lost City in the Sky! yesterday (1/11/12).

I played 2 armies simultaneously in both games, opposing chas and Sherman Davies. As my new Racheim was not yet re-based and wing-lifted, I played Othkurik in his stead. In the both of the 2 games we managed to get in, chas fielded his Custom Army:

AMAZING ADVENTURERS

by Chas

Lara Croft 170
Indiana Jones 80
Shadow Cat 80
Lockheed the Baby Dragon 60
Iron Golem x2 200
Otonoshi 10
Total: 600 Delta +/9 spaces,

and Sherman played:

230 Tor-Kul-Na
130 Deathwalker 9000
95 Wyvern
75 Kelda
70 Nagrubs x 2
600, 12 spaces

In the first game, I played

160 Shurrak
150 Othkurik
150 Morgoloth
140 WoB x 2
600, 12 spaces

and

150 Sonlen
140 Anubians x 2
115 Drake RotV
110 Brunak
95 Wyvern
600, 12 spaces.

We all made the mistake of going up on the Lava Field to attack Migol with our big guns, only to find that he was nearly invulnerable, while we were stuck in engagement with him, and each other. [Unfortunately, the pics of the map as a whole, and those most illustrative of the Lava Field cluster&*%# were to blurry to fix.]

chas and Sherman managed to at last kill Migol, and hold me off 'til time ran out.

chas' Lara Croft

In the second game, we replaced the Molten lava with Rock, and all of us pretty much ignored Migol. I fielded

160 Shurrak
160 PKs x 2
150 Othkurik
130 Deathwalker 9000
600, 12 spaces

and

190 10th x 2
190 Drake SotM
115 Marcus
110 Brunak
600, 12 spaces,

and managed to win in the more traditional manner, i.e., by killing off enough enemies in a short enough time, in spite of loosing Marcus to a Wyvern swoop early on, and allowing Tor-Kul-Na to Stomp out a goodly portion of my 10th when I could have thrown Othkurik in his way.

In general, there wasn't much reliance by any of us on the swingy powers (Mindflayer, Werewolf Lord), and the Wyverns found themselves without much in the way of juicy targets, as, with the exception of chas' army, there were few medium/small heroes for them to take. Shurrak's Knockback power rarely came into play for the same reason. (It didn't help that I completely forgot about Swinging Sword for the entire first game!)

As a test of ∆ 'Scape, in spite of claustrophobic map issues, this was an unmitigated success. Sherman found Tor-Kul-Na and the Nagrubs (sleightly cheaper in Classic) well worth their points here, while my second game 10th army, as alluded to in posts by dok and others elsewhere, even with Marcus' early demise, and their later being stomped out of existence, easily took out their points' worth.

My next Sky Mat map/scenario will have a lot less Sky, and a lot better pathing.

Green Maze (∆) Battle Report

In the wake of Hurricane Sandy, the November Gang of Four gathering for this month has been cancelled. We were to play, using ∆ (previously Legacy) in The Green Maze!

In lieu of a "real" Battle Report, and to feed my Heroscape "jones," I'm solo simulating a battle between the following armies:

Death Drow Walking

195 Drow x 3
120 Kee-Mo-Shi
110 Deathwalker 9000
60 Elaria
15 Isamu
500, 13 spaces





Wolf Walkers

210 WoB x 3
130 Werewolf Lord
100 Deathwalker 8000
60 Khosumet
500, 13 spaces

Round 1: Wolves win initiative.

OM 1: Wolves move into Maze. As does Elaria.

OM 2: Wolves continue into Maze.

As does Kee-Mo-Shi.

OM 3: Wolves continue into Maze. The Werewolf Lord attacks Elaria!

! Elaria rolls: , takes 2 wounds, and is Hybridized! More Wolves move up.Drow move up.

Maze at the end of Round 1:

Round 2: Wolves win initiative.

OM 1: Werewolf Lord attacks Elaria. Elaria rolls: no s, and dies! Wolves move, and one Pounces on a Drow. vs - success! With the unfortunate Elaria's demise, Kee-Mo-Shi can now move directly adjacent to the Werewolf Lord. Mindshackle roll: 16 (failed). Attack: vs (failed). Toxic Skin: 4 (fails).

OM 2: Werewolf Lord attacks Kee-Mo-Shi. Whiffs! Wolves move up. Another Pounce - vs - success! Kee-Mo-Shi again attacks the Werewolf Lord. Mindshackle: 2 (failed). Attacks: vs (Werewolf Lord takes a wound). Toxic Skin: 6 (fails).

OM 3: Werewolf Lord attacks Kee-Mo-Shi. vs (fails). Wolves move. Wolves attack! Near the Ruin against the Drow on Grass. vs . Near the Deathwalker. vs . Drow rolls for HiD: 2 - fails and dies! Third Wolf Pounces. vs - success!

Maze after Round 2:

Things are looking grim for the Drow.

Round 3: Drow win initiative.

OM 1: Drow attack. Near the Maze 1 attacks. vs (succeeds). Near the Deathwalker. vs (succeeds). Near the Palm. vs (fails). Werewolf Lord attacks Kee-Mo-Shi. vs - 2 wounds and Hybridization! Wolves move up. One Pounces. vs .

OM 2: Kee-Mo-Shi attacks Werewolf Lord. Mindshackle: 6 (fails). Attack: vs (3 wounds!). Toxic Skin: 15 (fails). Werewolf Lord counterattacks: vs (Kee-Mo-Shi now has 3 wounds/4 life).

OM 3: Drow move and attack.


Near the Palm. vs . Against the Wolf near the Ruin. vs . Werewolf Lord attacks Kee-Mo-Shi. vs - Kee-Mo-Shi dies!

Maze after Round 3:




Things look very grim for the Drow!

Round 4: Wolves win Initiative.

OM 1: Werewolf Lord attacks. vs . Wolves move. One Pounces.

vs .

Deathwalker 9000 moves and attacks. Explosion Attack: ! Werewolf Lord: - 2 wounds, dies! WoB: - dies.



OM 2: Khosumet & Wolves move to interior of maze. Deathwalker 9000 moves to edge of Maze.

[More pics to come][various others in gallery]

OM 3: Wolves retreat to their end of Maze. Deathwalker 9000 advances into the Maze, and attacks Khosumet. Normal attack. vs .

At the end of Round 4, the Wolf Walkers have Khosumet (unwounded), 4 WoB, and DW 8000 remaining, while the Drow have 1 Drow, Isamu, and DW 9000.

In retrospect, moving Elaria where I did at the beginning screwed the pooch for the whole game. Or the Wolves are just baaaaad!

[P.S.: The process of taking pics on phone, sending to my computer via email, editing in Picasa, and uploading into Gallery, not so smooth, resulting in missing and out of order pics, and took all day!]

[kolakoski]

Wrong thread!

[kolakoski]

Well met!

chas and I played a couple of games yesterday on the Molten Valley map.

I put together my 1,000 point (Delta+) Varkaanan army during breakfast, after the new heroes were released. Along with all the new unique squads and heroes (735 points), I drafted Mimring (140 points) and Master of the Hunt (125), the latter because I was under the misapprehension that the Spirits could only be applied to unique Hunter army cards.

chas, knowing (along with everyone else) that I'd be playing the new Varkaanans,

Spoiler Alert!

chose to play 3 squads of Deathreavers (), three Dragons (Moltenclaw, Nilfeim, and Quahon) and the Krav.

After mucking the opening (OM 1 on the Greyspears instead of the Swiftfangs), I eventually was able to set up a ranged pod of Greypears/Arktos on the center raised area nearest me, while chas moved Nilfeim and Moltenclaw onto the corrosponding area on his side.

Mimring moved up early, made one Fireline attack, and then waited until the field was clear to . . .



. . . move below the Tower the Krav had taken, and proceed to devour them one by one, pursuing the last one to the top of the Tower.

In the center, I managed to Vault two of my Quickblades adjacent to Moltenclaw and Nilfeim, and subsequently take them out with enhanced Greyspears.

Finally, Quahon was forced off his perch

(sometime after the Krav's demise) by the threat of longer range, and torn apart by various Varkaanan. chas did gain a measure of satisfaction out of later killing Bahadur with a squad of Warforged (filler that he included, forgetting that Tactival Switch does not work on Large units ) towards the end.

In our second game, chas played the Varkaanans, DW9000, DW8000, and Otonashi, while I fielded two squads of Tagawa Samurai Archers, Kaemon Awa, Morgoloth, the Werewolf Lord, and, much bigger , four squads of the Wolves of Badru, whose Pounce was useless against Large/Huge units.

chas executed the first OM with the Swiftfangs/Greyspears. Then, as he moved up the Deathwalkers, I put a squad of Archers on my hill and shot up a few flanking Varkaanans. When DW8000 finally arrived, he had some scary success with his Rapid Fire Special Attack, but wiffed on his first or second defense roll. Then Morgoloth (the Demon ) tore through the remainder of the flanking Varkanaans, and got height on DW9000,

finally pounding him into scrap, while Kaemon Quick Released his way through the units in chas' center

All dead!

and charged into engagement with the Darkclaws and a couple of Quickblades decimating them on offense and defense (with Counterstrike). Truly Awasome!

End of game.

The new Varkanaans are great fun to play, and the new heroes are powerful and creative additions to the canon. Congratulations to the VC team for a great job!

[ZBeeblebrox]

Looking at the list, I noticed it has no been updated for C3V Waves 16 & 17.