Heroscapers
Go Back   Heroscapers > Off-Topic > General
General Random thoughts and ideas. "General" does not mean random drivel, nonsense or inane silliness.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #25  
Old September 23rd, 2017, 07:50 PM
chas's Avatar
chas chas is offline
 
Join Date: June 23, 2008
Location: USA- NY - New York City
Posts: 4,607
Blog Entries: 64
chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Exactly.

I have just seen Episode 6, using my DVD set to move beyond the broadcast schedule. Oddly enough, Dean Acheson, who I just mentioned above, shows up along with an unidentified Omar Bradley, one of our most famous WWII generals, as two of the older 'Wise Men' called in to advise LBJ! Nineteen Sixty Eight was perhaps the most apocalyptic year of the entire period, both in Vietnam and here in the USA, and people watching who do not know the history of this time will be much more shocked than ever before.

A friend told me a story about being a white man up in Harlem when riots broke out that year. He knew he'd better get off the street, so he ducked into a nearby movie theater. He was as far as he could tell, the only white man in the audience. The movie that was playing was Zulu. Since the crowd was not cheering the white British soldiers, but the black African warriors fighting them, he pulled his overcoat as far up as he could to hide his head! Luckily, he was not harmed that day.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old September 25th, 2017, 08:06 PM
Hahma's Avatar
Hahma Hahma is online now
Prickly Cactus
 
Join Date: June 26, 2006
Location: IN - Lowell
Posts: 23,077
Images: 3
Blog Entries: 3
Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Just finished the 6th episode, "Things Fall Apart"

Yeah, 1968 sucked big time. I was born in June '67 and my sister was born in October '68. A couple bad years otherwise.

Hand of fate is moving and the finger points to you
...Iron Maiden - The Wicker Man

TUTORIAL FOR RE-BASING FIGURES


3hrs 43mins 32secs = 1242nd of 8808 overall - 1988 Honolulu Marathon
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old September 26th, 2017, 11:40 PM
Grungebob's Avatar
Grungebob Grungebob is offline
Mighty Mouse!
 
Join Date: May 3, 2006
Location: TX - Dallas
Posts: 10,425
Images: 31
Blog Entries: 5
Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer Grungebob is a wielder of the Ban Hammer
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hahma View Post
Just finished the 6th episode, "Things Fall Apart"

Yeah, 1968 sucked big time. I was born in June '67 and my sister was born in October '68. A couple bad years otherwise.
I too was born in 67. The summer of love. The hippy movement was in full swing.

This documentary is crazy good. I'm on episode 3.


"Hahahah! You losers! I told you so!!"
~Clancampbell
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old September 27th, 2017, 12:16 AM
Grishnakh's Avatar
Grishnakh Grishnakh is offline
Titleless
 
Join Date: May 18, 2006
Location: NY - Long Island
Posts: 2,889
Images: 1174
Blog Entries: 2
Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death! Grishnakh is hot lava death!
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

I was born in 58. Boy do I remember a lot of this, especially Kent State. My brother is 9 years older than me, was in college, and was exactly the right age to be called up. I'm glad it never happened. My father was a veteran of WW2. Even he did not want his son to fight in such a senseless conflict.

My Custom Terrain Thread: http://www.heroscapers.com/community...read.php?t=448
My tribute site to TFT/Melee & Wizards: http://www.meleewizards.com/
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old September 27th, 2017, 03:18 AM
chas's Avatar
chas chas is offline
 
Join Date: June 23, 2008
Location: USA- NY - New York City
Posts: 4,607
Blog Entries: 64
chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Being a good patriotic American of Liberal bent, it broke my heart to decide against the war and our government. I was particularly cautious about it because nearly everyone around me in college was against the war, so it was too easy a stance to take. Yet eventually I felt I had no choice.

But where President Johnson, who had done so much for civil rights and other domestic programs, seemed at the time like a good man gone wrong, we lefties just hated Nixon. Now the other night I felt betrayed all over again, and was devastated by seeing Nixon's traitorous behavior in sabotaging LBJ's peace negotiations with the North Vietnamese, so that Republican candidate could win the election, when this was laid bare in Episode 7. Then he calls LBJ and lies about his actions, and Johnson knows that he is lying, due to US intelligence gathering!

I expected it to be emotionally difficult to watch this series, but I didn't expect to be stunned by the facts. Its narrated that this behavior would come home to Nixon later in his eventual downfall. I'm waiting to see that connection in the show. Not that I don't know how it comes out.

I remember driving home from a summer factory job I had with my father, who also was working in that place, to hear Ford pardoning Nixon over the car radio. After Watergate it was pretty obvious that he was guilty of illegal acts. Pardoning Nixon--who did they think they were kidding with that? Our democracy was in peril even more than before!

Imagine a US presidential candidate colluding with a foreign power to win an election...

Inconceivable?

Last edited by chas; September 29th, 2017 at 01:04 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old September 27th, 2017, 09:17 AM
Hahma's Avatar
Hahma Hahma is online now
Prickly Cactus
 
Join Date: June 26, 2006
Location: IN - Lowell
Posts: 23,077
Images: 3
Blog Entries: 3
Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grungebob View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hahma View Post
Just finished the 6th episode, "Things Fall Apart"

Yeah, 1968 sucked big time. I was born in June '67 and my sister was born in October '68. A couple bad years otherwise.
I too was born in 67. The summer of love. The hippy movement was in full swing.

This documentary is crazy good. I'm on episode 3.
Welcome to 50 GB

Just wait, this series gets better and more disturbing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grishnakh View Post
I was born in 58. Boy do I remember a lot of this, especially Kent State. My brother is 9 years older than me, was in college, and was exactly the right age to be called up. I'm glad it never happened. My father was a veteran of WW2. Even he did not want his son to fight in such a senseless conflict.
Yeah Grish, I can see how your father wouldn't want his son to be part of that war.

I had enlisted in the Marines a week after my junior year of high school in 1984, on the delayed entry program. I was going to enlist as a basic infantryman because I thought that would be where it was at. But a guy my mom was dating at the time talked me out of infantry. He was a Vietnam vet that was a door gunner in a huey. He'd done and seen a lot of stuff and had gotten shot. He said it wasn't all glorious like in the movies and such. So I signed up for the Mechanal/Electrical field.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chas View Post
Being a good patriotic American of Liberal bent, it broke my heart to decide against the war and our government. I was particularly cautious about it because nearly everyone around me in college was against the war, so it was too easy a stance to take. Yet eventually I felt I had no choice.

But where President Johnson, who had done so much for civil rights and other domestic programs, seemed at the time like a good man gone wrong, we lefties just hated Nixon. Now the other night I felt betrayed all over again, and was devastated by seeing Nixon's traitorous behavior in sabotaging LBJ's peace negotiations with the North Vietnamese, so that Republican candidate could win the election, when this was laid bare in Episode 7. Then he calls LBJ and lies about his actions, and Johnson knows that he is lying, due to US intelligence gathering!

I expected it to be emotionally difficult to watch this series, but I didn't expect to be stunned by the facts. Its narrated that this behavior would come home to Nixon later in his eventual downfall. I'm waiting to see that connection in the show. Not that I don't know how it comes out.

I remember driving home from a summer factory job I had with my father, who also was working in that place, to hear Ford pardoning Nixon over the car radio. After Watergate it was pretty obvious that he was guilty of illegal acts. Pardoning Nixon--who did they think they were kidding with that? Our democracy was in peril even more than before!

Imagine a US presidential candidate colluding with an enemy foreign power to win an election...

Inconceivable?
Yeah Chas, I can see a lot of similarities in the past and present. Heck, I just saw a video of Bob Kerry back in the day, ripping the Republicans (Bush Sr) for strategically using the American flag for political gain. Imagine that!

Hand of fate is moving and the finger points to you
...Iron Maiden - The Wicker Man

TUTORIAL FOR RE-BASING FIGURES


3hrs 43mins 32secs = 1242nd of 8808 overall - 1988 Honolulu Marathon

Last edited by Hahma; September 27th, 2017 at 02:56 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old September 27th, 2017, 09:36 AM
chas's Avatar
chas chas is offline
 
Join Date: June 23, 2008
Location: USA- NY - New York City
Posts: 4,607
Blog Entries: 64
chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Is he a different guy than John Kerry, the veteran swift boat ('Brown Water Navy') Captain in Vietnam, whose service was ridiculed by his opponents during a political campaign?

Boy, its hard not to get political on this thread. Maybe that's why we have almost 200 viewers here but so few posters. Well, I rarely post here in the General section, where as I understand it controversy is allowed, so I went for it.

By the way, the TV series specifically about the medical rehab area in Vietnam was China Beach (1988-91), which introduced Dana Delany, Marge Helgenberger and Robert Picardo. It was a great series, although pretty harrowing, and is available on DVD (and possibly more advanced platforms, of which I know nothing).
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old September 27th, 2017, 10:19 AM
Hahma's Avatar
Hahma Hahma is online now
Prickly Cactus
 
Join Date: June 26, 2006
Location: IN - Lowell
Posts: 23,077
Images: 3
Blog Entries: 3
Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Quote:
Originally Posted by chas View Post
Is he a different guy than John Kerry, the veteran swift boat ('Brown Water Navy') Captain in Vietnam, whose service was ridiculed by his opponents during a political campaign?

Boy, its hard not to get political on this thread. Maybe that's why we have almost 200 viewers here but so few posters. Well, I rarely post here in the General section, where as I understand it controversy is allowed, so I went for it.

By the way, the TV series specifically about the medical rehab area in Vietnam was China Beach (1988-91), which introduced Dana Delany, Marge Helgenberger and Robert Picardo. It was a great series, although pretty harrowing, and is available on DVD (and possibly more advanced platforms, of which I know nothing).
Actually, it was Joseph Robert "Bob" Kerry I was referring to. Navy SEAL in Vietnam. Governor and then Senator.

As far as getting political, it's kind of hard not to, considering how much of the Vietnam era was a political mess, and how the division we have now reminds me of how it was back then. While not as bad....yet, it's getting more divisive on a daily basis it seems. So there's tie in with the subject of this thread.

I never watched China Beach, so I may have to check it out sometime.

Hand of fate is moving and the finger points to you
...Iron Maiden - The Wicker Man

TUTORIAL FOR RE-BASING FIGURES


3hrs 43mins 32secs = 1242nd of 8808 overall - 1988 Honolulu Marathon

Last edited by Hahma; September 27th, 2017 at 10:59 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old September 27th, 2017, 01:42 PM
Tornado's Avatar
Tornado Tornado is offline
Fan Fiction Prompt Master
 
Join Date: August 11, 2010
Location: USA - MI - Kalamazoo (Climax)
Posts: 18,115
Images: 113
Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth Tornado is a man of the cloth
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Dana Delaney

Yeah China Beach is no MASH. I struggled with that one when younger. Probably worth a second look.

Tour of Duty has been on recently. I think it holds up fairly good, not sure on its authenticity though.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old September 27th, 2017, 02:09 PM
chas's Avatar
chas chas is offline
 
Join Date: June 23, 2008
Location: USA- NY - New York City
Posts: 4,607
Blog Entries: 64
chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun chas is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Tin soldiers and Nixon's coming
We're finally on our own.
This summer I hear the drumming;
Four dead in Ohio!

Gotta get down to it,
Soldiers are cutting us down.
Should'a been gone long ago.
What if you knew her and
Found her dead on the ground?
How could you run when you know?

--"Ohio" by Neil Young
End Title Song, Episode 8


The series says that an integral part of the era was "some of the best rock and roll music ever written." Woodstock by Joni Mitchell was the young people's anthem. Far out, man. Love and peace. That's how it started. Later on the I Feel Like I'm Fixing To Die Rag, aka The Fish Cheer by Country Joe MacDonald was performed to the outrage of a future college pal's high school principle, as a number in his high school senior talent show in San Francisco. But after Kent State in Ohio, the grim ballad above became the war chant! Yes, there was a lot to write songs about.

The sound track to this series must be amazing. Most of the music used just fades out quickly under the narration, and I have to complete the lyrics for most of the great songs to myself. Which I can still do, after all this time.

***

In Digi's pizzeria in Beloit, Wisconsin hostile townies glaring at us college kids waiting for pies at other tables, put on Okie From Muskogie by country star Merle Haggard on the juke box, and waited for our reaction. They were surprised when we happily sang along, obviously knowing the lyrics to this hymn to conservative, small town values.

I was at a small liberal arts college in a tiny town. But my angry roommate returned from Madison, the state capital, missing a front tooth that had been knocked out in a protest there by the police. He became much quieter and nicer after that.

A girl friend took me to a local church where a friend of her father's was the pastor. She was hoping for a gentle sermon, as her father would have given in his own church in nearby Milwaukee. But he supported the government and the war all the way down the line, and she walked away shocked and disappointed.

The TV series said that after Kent State 68% of the American people approved of the killings of four college students there by young, poorly lead soldiers of the Ohio National Guard. Maybe most of those polled were both loyal and scared.

Last edited by chas; September 27th, 2017 at 02:25 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old September 27th, 2017, 02:32 PM
Hahma's Avatar
Hahma Hahma is online now
Prickly Cactus
 
Join Date: June 26, 2006
Location: IN - Lowell
Posts: 23,077
Images: 3
Blog Entries: 3
Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth Hahma is a man of the cloth
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Crazy times!

Hand of fate is moving and the finger points to you
...Iron Maiden - The Wicker Man

TUTORIAL FOR RE-BASING FIGURES


3hrs 43mins 32secs = 1242nd of 8808 overall - 1988 Honolulu Marathon
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old September 27th, 2017, 02:49 PM
japes's Avatar
japes japes is offline
A Man of Taste
 
Join Date: August 3, 2011
Location: USA - TX - Austin (SW)
Posts: 13,051
Images: 15
japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer japes is a wielder of the Ban Hammer
Re: Ken Burns' Vietnam

Quote:
Originally Posted by chas View Post
Maybe that's why we have almost 200 viewers here but so few posters. Well, I rarely post here in the General section, where as I understand it controversy is allowed, so I went for it.
I've been following along but as someone in their 40's that hasn't seen the program yet I don't have anything to add but I am a huge fan of history and Ken Burns' work in general.


I am the first person in my extended family to go to college (thanks to baseball) with nearly every male going into the military prior to me including both my younger brothers. Most of my uncles are Vietnam Vets but they have never spoken of their experiences, and until my brother came back from Afghanistan messed up, they had never acknowledged it. Therefore I've been following along on this conversation getting perspective.


Anyway...that's my reason for viewing and not posting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmBatman View Post
It was a great idea that really brought this concept to the next level and now I just have to convince you of your own brilliance.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Heroscapers > Off-Topic > General
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Book of Garrett Burns Just_a_Bill C3V and SoV Customs 3 July 9th, 2017 09:31 PM
Vietnam War buffs? The Deadliest Warrior General 11 April 30th, 2011 02:55 PM
Vietnam/Landmines Roufus HeroScape General Discussion 10 December 3rd, 2007 12:42 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:56 PM.

Heroscape background footer

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.