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  #277  
Old December 14th, 2018, 01:48 PM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

Good updates on the latest 2 cards. One tidbit to improve flavor would be to also exclude undead along with soulborgs on sustained by blood. I know its in there mechanically for deathreavers but thematically it makes sense to also exclude undead.

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  #278  
Old December 14th, 2018, 01:52 PM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

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Originally Posted by TREX View Post
Good updates on the latest 2 cards. One tidbit to improve flavor would be to also exclude undead along with soulborgs on sustained by blood. I know its in there mechanically for deathreavers but thematically it makes sense to also exclude undead.
Good catch. I agree.

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  #279  
Old December 15th, 2018, 11:02 AM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

Hmmm... fairly sure a good number of undead would still bleed... you could go either way there, IMO.


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  #280  
Old December 15th, 2018, 11:43 AM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazy Orang View Post
Hmmm... fairly sure a good number of undead would still bleed... you could go either way there, IMO.
Do vampires bleed? I don’t think I’ve ever seen a vampire attempt the loophole of sucking their own blood.
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  #281  
Old December 17th, 2018, 04:32 PM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

I like Seth a lot. Very thematic, simple, and adds nice punch to his faction.

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  #282  
Old December 19th, 2018, 01:24 AM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrNobody View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazy Orang View Post
Hmmm... fairly sure a good number of undead would still bleed... you could go either way there, IMO.
Do vampires bleed? I don’t think I’ve ever seen a vampire attempt the loophole of sucking their own blood.
Yeah, I think not allowing undead is the way to go, and makes thematic sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by capsocrates View Post
I like Seth a lot. Very thematic, simple, and adds nice punch to his faction.
Thank you, that builds my confidence a bit...I've been mulling him over a lot recently.

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  #283  
Old December 21st, 2018, 02:41 AM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

Looking for some help. I'm not convinced that the Shadow faction is there yet now that I've gotten some feedback after submitting them. Seems like people wanna keep nerfing their abilities but they continue to lose just about every playtest even as-is, and while I love the design and minis...I can't bring myself to submit something that just can't win games. I'm not sure what I'm missing...but here are a couple thoughts. (for reference the current versions are in the OP)

1) They're missing range. Xundar's special isn't enough to be a range threat. Their designed to work together to bring people down, but unfortunately that means they're extremely depending on podding while Raelin covers their back.

2) Price point. The minis' size and ominous-ness suggest a little higher priced, stronger common hero but that means less of them, which with their design means losing a few of them in a battle can really ruin the momentum quick. I wanna drop the price point, but then their stats wouldn't be in line with the size and power of the minis.

3) Attacks. Because they depend a lot on each other, a lot of their attacks are focused on 1 or 2 figures rather than maximizing on 3. This hurts them when they're not able to punch back.

SO....that's my assessment. Now for some ideas...

I think the key is the Shadow Fiend. I think he needs a little work...either a Multi-attack or a range attack...or a mix of the two. The Hound I feel is spot on and thematic and the Binder as well, but I feel like I could use the Fiend to be a little bit more of a mid-game shark unit that comes it as a shock unit.

Quote:
Shadow Bend Special Attack
Range Special. Attack 3.
When attacking with a Shadow Fiend using Shadow Bend Special Attack, add 1 to its range for every other friendly Shadow figure adjacent to the defending figure.
Quote:
Dissipate
After attacking with a Shadow Fiend you control, you may roll the 20-sided die. If you roll a 1-8 you may attack 1 additional time and then immediately destroy that Shadow Fiend. If you roll a 9 or higher you may attack 1 additional time.
Quote:
Shadow Bolt Special Attack
Range 3 + Special. Attack 3.
The first target of Shadow Bolt Special Attack must be within a Range of 3. Subtract 1 from the defending figures defense for every other Shadow figure it is engaged with that you control, up to minus 2 defense. After attacking with Shadow Bolt Special Attack, if the defending figure receives at least 1 wound, you may choose 1 additional figure to target that was adjacent to the defending figure at the beginning of that attack and attack that chosen figure with Shadow Bolt Special Attack.
These are just some initial ideas/thoughts...would love for any other input?

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  #284  
Old December 21st, 2018, 04:44 PM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

I think you're overly concerned about their combat ability, though I agree it's no fun if they don't win. The simplest solution is lower their prices of the Shades across the board, keeping in mind comparisons to similar units.

I like the new ideas, though. They all have value, though Shadow Bolt is rather wordy. There is also a certain Search and Destroy Special Attack power that you know of that may be a great fit.
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  #285  
Old December 21st, 2018, 09:07 PM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
I think you're overly concerned about their combat ability, though I agree it's no fun if they don't win. The simplest solution is lower their prices of the Shades across the board, keeping in mind comparisons to similar units.

I like the new ideas, though. They all have value, though Shadow Bolt is rather wordy. There is also a certain Search and Destroy Special Attack power that you know of that may be a great fit.
Thanks for the feedback. I know it's a big concern of mine, but I think it's a very important part of a design. A unit should have the ability and opportunity to be successful, and these guys - against many different opponents - have simply failed to be very successful. No matter the "cool factor", or even if it's thematic...few will want to play something that can't perform. That's how I feel about these. They need some help..and I think that will come in the form of the Fiend getting a little bit of a rework.

It's funny you mention wordy for Shadow Bolt SA. Aside from the minus defense clause...it's word for word taken from Sharwin's Arcane Bolt (which is actually longer because I took out the last 2 sentences).

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  #286  
Old December 21st, 2018, 10:07 PM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

Another idea I thought of...

Quote:
SHADOW WARP SPECIAL ATTACK
Range Special. Attack 2 + Special.
Choose a Shadow figure you control that is within 3 clear sight spaces of this Shadow Fiend and roll 2 attack die. Add 1 attack die if there is another Shadow figure you control adjacent to the chosen figure. One at a time for each skull rolled, you may inflict 1 wound on any small or medium figure that is within 2 clear sight spaces of the chosen Shadow figure. Figures affected by Shadow Warp Special Attack cannot roll any defense dice.
It's the Fiend warping the power of the Shadows to harm multiple figures...and the more together your shadows are, the more powerful the attack.

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Last edited by Sir Heroscape; December 21st, 2018 at 10:27 PM.
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  #287  
Old December 21st, 2018, 10:17 PM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
A unit should have the ability and opportunity to be successful, and these guys - against many different opponents - have simply failed to be very successful.
Defining "successful" only in terms of 500pt 1v1 games is a mistake.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
It's funny you mention wordy for Shadow Bolt SA. Aside from the minus defense clause...it's word for word taken from Sharwin's Arcane Bolt (which is actually longer because I took out the last 2 sentences).
Yes, I recognized that. But you are designing for a place in a pseudo-squad, not a lone hero. It's sort of a squad with a ton of powers. You should strive to make the individual pieces simpler and easier to quickly grasp than normal units.
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  #288  
Old December 21st, 2018, 10:23 PM
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Re: Sir Heroscape's customs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
A unit should have the ability and opportunity to be successful, and these guys - against many different opponents - have simply failed to be very successful.
Defining "successful" only in terms of 500pt 1v1 games is a mistake.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
It's funny you mention wordy for Shadow Bolt SA. Aside from the minus defense clause...it's word for word taken from Sharwin's Arcane Bolt (which is actually longer because I took out the last 2 sentences).
Yes, I recognized that. But you are designing for a place in a pseudo-squad, not a lone hero. It's sort of a squad with a ton of powers. You should strive to make the individual pieces simpler and easier to quickly grasp than normal units.
Some good points there. Thanks!

EDIT: Also curious what you think of my most recent idea to give the Fiend a special attack like unto Pelloth's?

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