Casters of Valhalla

[Jexik]

Originally Posted by Matthias Maccabeus

Do you remember any more details of my heavies vs trons match against Spider? I don’t recall all the details but just remember that it was a death trap for him.

No, just remember it being one of the many reckoning/teaching moments of melee being better than he thought. I find it a little interesting that on this latest cast you guys kind of dismiss Raelin with Heavies, when I'm not sure if Heavies win that 'Tron matchup as easily without her.


I could give him a call see if he remembers .

[Matthias Maccabeus]

Originally Posted by Jexik

No, just remember it being one of the many reckoning/teaching moments of melee being better than he thought. I find it a little interesting that on this latest cast you guys kind of dismiss Raelin with Heavies, when I'm not sure if Heavies win that 'Tron matchup as easily without her.


I could give him a call see if he remembers .

Fair enough. Though I do think overall they are better without her but she definitely was key in that match up. Feel free to call him since I forced him into retirement...

[Jexik]

Digging up your discussion from back in April, I'll just chime in and say that Raelin and other supporting cast units were almost always taken into account when it came to making the original power rankings.

Joe and I would basically put Raelin in all of our [ranged] armies unless we were running Valiant 4th. We didn't really play Knights that often. I might even argue that the ranking of units like Airborne Elite cared about the fact that Deathreavers or other screening units exist. I think I assumed that Sharks in general would be played alongside rats, optimally. Braxas with no screen is garbage. Or how often would Krav be taken without Raelin? etc.

[OEAO]

Originally Posted by Jexik

Digging up your discussion from back in April, I'll just chime in and say that Raelin and other supporting cast units were almost always taken into account when it came to making the original power rankings.

Joe and I would basically put Raelin in all of our [ranged] armies unless we were running Valiant 4th. We didn't really play Knights that often. I might even argue that the ranking of units like Airborne Elite cared about the fact that Deathreavers or other screening units exist. I think I assumed that Sharks in general would be played alongside rats, optimally. Braxas with no screen is garbage. Or how often would Krav be taken without Raelin? etc.

Thanks for clarifying that! I think Ken would rather rate units in a vacuum, whereas our ratings attempt to look at the broader meta game as a whole. That’s fine, but I don’t think it’s enough to just look at the game as a bunch of individual units.

[Owlman]

Originally Posted by Jexik

Digging up your discussion from back in April, I'll just chime in and say that Raelin and other supporting cast units were almost always taken into account when it came to making the original power rankings.

Joe and I would basically put Raelin in all of our [ranged] armies unless we were running Valiant 4th. We didn't really play Knights that often. I might even argue that the ranking of units like Airborne Elite cared about the fact that Deathreavers or other screening units exist. I think I assumed that Sharks in general would be played alongside rats, optimally. Braxas with no screen is garbage. Or how often would Krav be taken without Raelin? etc.

I'd be curious to see a list ranking all common squads where players only have 1x to play with, and who hate proxying. That was me for a number of years, but thankfully due to my job I've been able to splurge a lot more on squads, getting 2-3x of each.

[vegietarian18]

Single common power rankings:

A++
Mezzodemon Warmongers

[Chris Perkins]

For 1x commons, basically all bonding mele gets a boost from the presence of their hero (s) and ranged squads (generally, see Vegies Mezzo example) - for example, 1x 4th Mass is terrible.

Also more survivable units like Sentinels get a boost and low defense units are much worse.

Edit: for good uses of 1x & 2x commons, I suggest checking out the pod & toolbox armies that made day 2 of gencon in the past. Some good uses of things like PKs & HSBs.

[Dysole]

1 x 4th isn't that bad. It's 4 attacks at range. 1 x Drones or Goblins or zombies is much worse. Anything that wants to swarm should never be splashed like that. I also think that anything that's high variance will struggle as well. Mezzos might be the best among the splash squads but I think PKs, rats, and HSBs are in contention there. (Including VC, Deathwings, Shieldsmiths, and maybe the Mantises and Civil war squads enter the discussion)

~Dysole, who will rarely play 1 x common but has played 2 x common a lot

[OEAO]

Originally Posted by vegietarian18

Single common power rankings:

A++
Mezzodemon Warmongers

I agree.

[dok]

I was very very close to playing 1x 4th Mass in the Gencon main event in 2015. I think I probably still go 5-0 on day 1 with that (most likely win changing to a loss would actually have been a game against Microcorp Agents), and who knows, maybe I win semis if MBS isn't there to paralyzing stare Kaemon.

It's not exactly good, but if you have them in a situation where they can shoot with impunity, they are better than Marro Warriors in that moment.

[Jexik]

That's a bit outside my experience. I doubt I ever took 1x commons to a tournament. At my very first tournament I pooled resources to get 6x Mass...

All the reverse the whip talk is way over my head. The one time I came in the middle of this (I forget the year), I played Romans with Valguard and thought that was weak enough. I had to use Cleon's Braxas and 2x Rats in the first round, the other army people thought was too strong for RtW.

[dok]

Originally Posted by Jexik

That's a bit outside my experience. I doubt I ever took 1x commons to a tournament. At my very first tournament I pooled resources to get 6x Mass...

All the reverse the whip talk is way over my head. The one time I came in the middle of this (I forget the year), I played Romans with Valguard and thought that was weak enough. I had to use Cleon's Braxas and 2x Rats in the first round, the other army people thought was too strong for RtW.

That was actually the same year. Cleon and I were the two 5-0s that year.

EDIT: results