Designs needing a boost (Listing phase)

[japes]

Originally Posted by japes

I'd love to see someone start up those threads.

Originally Posted by Ronin

I like that idea. I've been thinking a little bit in those terms lately. Mainly on ways to lift up some of the lower-tier units. Particularly some of the basement-tier Crime Lords and also Helmut Zemo (who isn't quite as bad off as them, but it'd be nice if I felt like I could play him somewhere other than the ironic Cap build).

Since no one decided to take up the call I figured I might as well make my self useful.

Step 1 would be to come up with a list of units that under perform or could use a boost and the reason why.

Step 2 would be to discuss possible strategies

Not really looking for future powers and their wording just ideas.

For instance...

Figure: Judge Dredd
Weakness: Very niche and priced high based on criminal tie-ins which makes him not as useful in general builds
Strategy: develop a synergy web to give him an army build
Option: [list][*]Uncommon rookie judges can turn opponents figures into criminals[*]Future Judges provide a synergy/bonding (Judge Hersey, Anderson)

Just used Dredd as he's been discussed recently.

It's perfectly acceptable to admit that you think the current card is not salvageable...in which the entry would look something like this...

Figure: Penguin
Weakness: Not Useful
Strategy: Create a new version

However not acceptable is the following...

Penguin
He Sucks
You guys suck for creating him

One last thing...this doesn't have to be limited to individual figures. You could say Crime Lords need a boost or something like that.

You also don't need to have a solution to list a figure needs help. If you just don't think a figures is performing well but can't decide why don't let that be a reason to not post the figure... Shall we begin...

[japes]

DC
Penguin

Marvel


Indy
Judge Dredd
Werewolf - Uncommon : a strong heavy hitter leader that gives them a defense boost.

[japes]

reserved2

[Ronin]

Ah, cool. I'd say looking at the bottom rungs of the power rankings would be a good place to start.

My big one would probably be:

Figure(s): Crime Lords with d20 powers (Penguin, Ventriloquist, Two-Face)
Weakness: Very unreliable, tend to harm themselves and/or disrupt your plans
Strategy: Develop d20-based synergy for Crime Lords to help manage risk and/or provide potential high-end outcomes to offset the low-end ones

[japes]

That gets up these...

D

Beast Boy (Gar Logan) (Bear) (20 points) DC
Black Mask (Roman Sionis) (100 points) DC
Creeper (Jack Ryder) (125 points) DC
Roamer (20 points) IMAGE
Two-Face (Harvey Dent) (130 points) DC
Vampire Minions (90 points) MARVEL
Werewolf (130 points) DARK HORSE


F


Penguin (Oswald Cobblepot) (120 points) DC
Ventriloquist (Arnold Wesker) (90 points) DC

I've never actually fielded Ventriloquist.

Vampire Minions is that pre or post Dracula. Seems like they'd be a little better with him.
EDIT: just realized his bonding was an instead of taking a turn. I guess his unique squad of brides at just 20 points more makes them look worse.

Interested to hear the werewolf ideas...a Vampire vs werewolf game could be cool.

[Ronin]

I think Wolverine, Lord of the Vampires (1) and Capwolf (2) would be great leadership solutions for vampires and werewolves.

[Lazy Orang]

I've never played Ventriloquist or Roamer, so no comment there, though Ventriloquist I kind of think almost qualifies as a fun joke character at this stage - and let's face it, given his theme, that's fitting.
The Vampire Minions and Werewolf I've played, and they're good - not great, but fun and decent, so I wouldn't change them. That said, they'd probably appreciate some synergy.
Black Mask and Two-Face I actually really like - Black Mask can be an effective bonding hero if played well (top tip - keep him away from his men most of the time, only use his aura sparingly - he's mostly a cheap, reliable source of bonding, ranged 4/4 stats) and Two-Face, while as erratic as all hell, can still be really effective when on a roll and is still tonnes of fun because of it.
Creeper and the Bear form... yeah, those guys need help.
I'll see if I can think of anyone.

[japes]

Originally Posted by Ronin

I think Wolverine, Lord of the Vampires (1) and Capwolf (2) would be great leadership solutions for vampires and werewolves.

How'd they manage to mess that up...surely Wolverine is more wolf like than cappy...

[Ronin]

Right, but that's why Werewolf-erine doesn't work as a concept. It's just slightly hairier Wolverine. Most redundant set of extra super-powers ever.

Though they did kind of do that when he got Hulked and turned into this.

[Ronin]

Originally Posted by Lazy Orang

The Vampire Minions and Werewolf I've played, and they're good - not great, but fun and decent, so I wouldn't change them. That said, they'd probably appreciate some synergy.

You probably know this, but I wanted to point out for anyone else browsing that that's very much the intent here. We're not looking at things to reevaluate or retcon so much as we're looking at ways we can get neglected and under-performing designs working a little more smoothly by introducing new units and new synergies.

[Spidey'tilIDie]

I don't see that the Werewolves are really bad at all. They are well costed for what you get, IMO. Could they use a Leader? Sure. But they don't need it.
As far as the Minions, I think a Vampire (Henchman? just a placeholder name, possibly using this figure,) that lowered their roll for attacking again could definitely help them. Or maybe it could have a power that let you destroy a squad figure to "resurrect" the Unique Hero Vampire. Just a couple of thoughts.
As far as Ventriloquist and Penguin, I think that a second version that captured different aspects might be in order. Unfortunately, Ventriloquist only has one Heroclix I think, but Penguin has several options.

[Tornado]

Werewolf love.


NAME = WHITE WEREWOLF

SPECIES = LYCANTHROPE
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = CREATURE/LEADER
PERSONALITY = TERRITORIAL
SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 5
MOVE = 6
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 4
DEFENSE = 4
POINTS = 170?

CRY OF THE WEREWOLF
After taking a turn with White Werewolf or at the end of the round, you may remove an unrevealed order marker from this card and move all other Werewolf(Lycanthrope) figures you control up to six spaces. Figures moved by this special power may not be placed farther away from White Werewolf.

STEALTH LEAP 12
Instead of his normal move, Werewolf may Stealth Leap. Stealth Leap has a move of 3. When counting spaces for Werewolf's Stealth Leap movement, ignore elevations. Werewolf may leap over water without stopping, leap over figures without becoming engaged, and leap over obstacles such as ruins. Werewolf may not leap more than 12 levels up or down in a single leap. When moving with Stealth Leap, Werewolf will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

HEALING FACTOR
After taking a turn with Werewolf, remove 1 Wound Marker from this card.