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  #7333  
Old November 19th, 2018, 12:49 PM
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Re: Sports: NFL

Old man. 77 here. The rules changes came in before the '78 season.

You actually have to go back to 1950 to find a game where a QB rushed 27+ times. He was also their kicker; I'm gonna go ahead and say it's not really comparable to the modern game.

I was just looking for games where the leading passer rushed more than he passed, and only found those two Tebow games in the last 40 years.
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  #7334  
Old November 19th, 2018, 12:57 PM
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Re: Sports: NFL

Right on. That is a good starting point.
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  #7335  
Old November 19th, 2018, 03:45 PM
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Re: Sports: NFL

Go Bears!

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  #7336  
Old November 19th, 2018, 03:50 PM
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Re: Sports: NFL

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Originally Posted by dok View Post
Old man. 77 here. The rules changes came in before the '78 season.

You actually have to go back to 1950 to find a game where a QB rushed 27+ times. He was also their kicker; I'm gonna go ahead and say it's not really comparable to the modern game.

I was just looking for games where the leading passer rushed more than he passed, and only found those two Tebow games in the last 40 years.
Tebow was the guy I thought of, watching the game. Good enough to beat the Steelers in the postseason, right?

I remain skeptical that Jackson was a a prudent use of draft resources, but there is no doubt that he made for an exciting afternoon yesterday.

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  #7337  
Old November 19th, 2018, 04:26 PM
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Re: Sports: NFL

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Originally Posted by Dad_Scaper View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post
Old man. 77 here. The rules changes came in before the '78 season.

You actually have to go back to 1950 to find a game where a QB rushed 27+ times. He was also their kicker; I'm gonna go ahead and say it's not really comparable to the modern game.

I was just looking for games where the leading passer rushed more than he passed, and only found those two Tebow games in the last 40 years.
Tebow was the guy I thought of, watching the game. Good enough to beat the Steelers in the postseason, right?
I just watched a condensed video of every throw & run of Jackson, and I would definitely not compare him to Tebow. He reminds me a lot more of Vick, and to a lesser extent pre-inury RG3, or even Alex Smith if I squint a bit, than Tebow.

Tebow was built like an H back and ran like one, barreling through contact. Jackson is lithe and elusive, using speed to avoid defenders.

Tebow's throwing motion was loooooong and slow and ugly. Jackson has a nice tight release and throws a pretty spiral. He does sometimes slip into a bit of a sidearm when he probably shouldn't (resulted in 1 pass batted down and a couple more difficult catches for receivers), but overall I like his motion.

Tebow was pretty useless throwing short routes; it was pretty much either run the ball or throw a long pass, usually to the outside. Jackson seems quite comfortable throwing short checkdowns or passes over the middle. I'll also note that the interception was actually on-target, he just didn't see the defender lurking. Not that that's necessarily better or worse, but he can make throws.

All-in-all he seemed like he's going to need more time to learn to go through progressions and get comfortable with fitting the ball in to receivers at the NFL level, but the style he plays is the read option that we have seen run successfully by Wilson and Smith and others for years. He just, for now, uses the run side of the option a lot more than the other guys. As Tornado says, he's probably getting hurt if he stays with that run/pass ratio, but the kid looks like he can play to me.

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I remain skeptical that Jackson was a a prudent use of draft resources, but there is no doubt that he made for an exciting afternoon yesterday.
He was a very clear value pick in that spot, and having a succession plan in place is prudent for any organization. There's no such thing as a sure QB prospect but I'm surprised he dropped as far as he did. He compares reasonably well to the guys who went 3, 7, and 10.

Last edited by dok; November 19th, 2018 at 04:41 PM.
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  #7338  
Old November 19th, 2018, 05:00 PM
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Re: Sports: NFL

Quote:
Originally Posted by dok View Post
All-in-all he seemed like he's going to need more time to learn to go through progressions and get comfortable with fitting the ball in to receivers at the NFL level, but the style he plays is the read option that we have seen run successfully by Wilson and Smith and others for years. He just, for now, uses the run side of the option a lot more than the other guys. As Tornado says, he's probably getting hurt if he stays with that run/pass ratio, but the kid looks like he can play to me.

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Originally Posted by Dad_Scaper View Post
I remain skeptical that Jackson was a a prudent use of draft resources, but there is no doubt that he made for an exciting afternoon yesterday.
He was a very clear value pick in that spot, and having a succession plan in place is prudent for any organization. There's no such thing as a sure QB prospect but I'm surprised he dropped as far as he did. He compares reasonably well to the guys who went 3, 7, and 10.
He does have a nice, compact delivery, and I think the distinction from Tebow in running style is fair.

The problem with the comparison to the great dual threats at quarterback, though - Vick, chief but not alone among them - is the run/pass balance. You would remember better than I, but as I recall, when the Broncos had Tebow under center it was a heavy dose of running plays. Which is why I thought of Tebow. Vick's game involved a higher percentage of passing. I could be misremembering; I surely didn't look that up.

If you watched all Jackson's plays then you know, of his relatively few completed passes, several were off-target, and he was bailed out by receivers.

There is no question that he is a talent, as raw as it is rare. I hope he can do, or can learn to do, the things we have not yet seen.

As for the wisdom of giving up a bunch of picks to move up to get him at the end of the first round, I hope he can blossom into a more complete player. If he can't, then that was a steep price to pay for someone who should not be a starter at his position. My hopes are high, my expectations, however, are not.

I don't care to revisit isolated draft picks, though. I believe that's almost always a fool's errand. Suffice it to say that I have a lengthy presentation on the Ravens front office and personnel over the last several years, and it's not something that would interest most watching this thread.

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  #7339  
Old November 19th, 2018, 06:38 PM
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Re: Sports: NFL

Just upload the powerpoint and I'll review it.

(You're correct that his run/pass balance is more reminischent of Tebow than anyone else. Stylistically he has more in common with other, more successful mobile QBs.)
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  #7340  
Old November 20th, 2018, 12:00 AM
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Re: Sports: NFL

What a game tonight!
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  #7341  
Old November 21st, 2018, 09:42 AM
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Re: Sports: NFL

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Originally Posted by Dad_Scaper View Post
Tebow was the guy I thought of, watching the game. Good enough to beat the Steelers in the postseason, right?
You just had to go there, didn't you?

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  #7342  
Old November 21st, 2018, 11:27 AM
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Re: Sports: NFL

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Quote:
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Tebow was the guy I thought of, watching the game. Good enough to beat the Steelers in the postseason, right?
You just had to go there, didn't you?
Let's not get into a whole Steelers-are-institutionally-dirty-and-they-sign-and-protect-dirty-players thing here. Let's just all agree that the Bengals are currently the filthiest team in the division, and we can all hate them, right?


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  #7343  
Old November 21st, 2018, 11:28 AM
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Re: Sports: NFL

Hard to hate the Bungles. They just Bungle. I like to point and laugh, personally.*

Last edited by superfrog; November 21st, 2018 at 11:29 AM. Reason: *although if and when they're not Bungling, I definitely hate them
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  #7344  
Old November 21st, 2018, 11:34 AM
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Re: Sports: NFL

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Quote:
Originally Posted by happyjosiah View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dad_Scaper View Post
Tebow was the guy I thought of, watching the game. Good enough to beat the Steelers in the postseason, right?
You just had to go there, didn't you?
Let's not get into a whole Steelers-are-institutionally-dirty-and-they-sign-and-protect-dirty-players thing here. Let's just all agree that the Bengals are currently the filthiest team in the division, and we can all hate them, right?

Quote:
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Hard to hate the Bungles. They just Bungle. I like to point and laugh, personally.*
Sometimes I wonder if you're really a Steelers fan, SF.

@Spidey'tilIDie , would you please explain the Bengals-are-dirty situation to Superfrog? Thank you.

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