reworking flagbearer powers sans "valkyrie dice"

[caravaggio]

i am not going to buy the flagbearers. but if i get them for free by buying some more castles or something i wouldnt mind having them. but i'm convinced that the flagbearer's powers could have easily been written to conform to the existing mechanics that work equally well whether you prefer the red and blue dice or the white ones (and dont want to have to use a special set of dice which are reportedly kinda cheap for one figure). Now, i think these are some pretty cool powers i just dont appreciate the contrived "bolt on" mechanic of the "valkyrie dice".

so here's the original power in bold and my suggestions below...

BLUE GUY:
Jandar's Dispatch: After Sir Gilbert's turn, roll 12 Jandar Valkyrie dice and count the number of Jandar symbols rolled. You may move up to four friendly squad figures who follow Jandar and are within eight clear sight spaces of Sir Gilbert up to the number of Jandar symbols rolled.

some mathematician will have to help with this one but i was thinking something like this... After Sir Gilbert's turn, roll the 20 sided die. 1-4 Nothing happens. 5-10 you may move up to four friendly squad figures who follow Jandar and are within eight clear sight spaces of Sir Gilbert up to 2 spaces. 11-13 they may move up to 4 spaces. 14-16 they may move up to 6 spaces. 17-19 they may move up to 8 spaces. 20 they may move up to 12 spaces.

AFTER DISCUSSION:
After Sir Gilbert's turn, roll the 20 sided die. 1-2 Nothing happens. 3-7 you may move up to four friendly squad figures who follow Jandar and are within eight clear sight spaces of Sir Gilbert 1 space. 8-13 they may move up to 2 spaces. 14-17 they may move up to 3 spaces. 18-19 they may move up to 4 spaces. 20 they may move up to 6 spaces.



RED GUY:
Orc Battle Cry Aura: When a friendly orc warrior within two clear sight spaces of Ornak attacks, use Utgar Valkyrie dice. Each Utgar symbol rolled counts for an additional skull.

this one is effectively saying... When a friendly orc warrior within two clear sight spaces of Ornak attacks, roll an extra attack die.



PURPLE GUY:
Heroic Defense Aura: When a friendly Samurai or Ashigaru figure within eight clear sight spaces of Hatamoto Taro defends against a normal attack, use Einar Valkyrie dice. Each Einar symbol rolled counts as a shield.

this one is a little tricky but similar to... When a friendly Samurai or Ashigaru figure within eight clear sight spaces of Hatamoto Taro defends against a normal attack, roll 2 extra defense dice. (maybe 3 or 4 if the math works out that way.... man, this is one rediculous power).

AFTER DISCUSSION:
When a friendly Samurai or Ashigaru figure within eight clear sight spaces of Hatamoto Taro is attacked by a normal attack by an adjecent figure, roll attack dice as defense. all skulls count as shields.



GREEN GUY:
Leaf of the Home Tree Aura: When any friendly Elf within eight clear sight spaces of Acolarh receives enough damage to be destroyed, roll 10 Ullar Valkyrie dice. If at least three Ullar symbols are rolled, ignore the wounds that figure just received.

i hate these kinds of powers. the microcorp **** me off. how about... When any friendly Elf within eight clear sight spaces of Acolarh receives enough damage to be destroyed, roll the 20 sided die. 1-17 nothing happens. 18-20 ignore the wounds that figure just received.


AFTER DISCUSSION:
When any friendly Elf within eight clear sight spaces of Acolarh receives enough damage to be destroyed, roll the 20 sided die. 1-16 nothing happens. 17-20 ignore the wounds that figure just received.


GREY GUY:
Autoload Special Attack: range 7, attack 3. When using this power, roll Vydar Valkyrie dice. If you roll at least one Vydar symbol, you may attack again.

this is really the most elegantly written power as is. but since we're trying to remove the "valkyrie dice" from the equation how about... after attacking with the Autoload Special Attack roll the 20 sided die. 1-10 nothing happens. 11-20 you may attack again. this could also be accomplished by rolling an attack die and on a skull you get to attack again but you dont want to feel like you wasted a skull if you succeed, right?

AFTER DISCUSSION:
after attacking with the Autoload Special Attack roll the 20 sided die. if your attack yielded:

0 skulls: if you roll a 7 or higher on d20 then attack again
1 skull: if you roll a 10 or higher on d20 then attack again
2 skulls: if you roll a 14 or higher on d20 then attack again
3 skulls: you may never attack again with 3 skulls



anyway, i'm sure a lot of you are offended by this idea as much as i'm offended by the "valkyrie dice" but if those of you who like this idea have any suggestions let me know. i probably wouldnt have suggested re-writing these powers but my list of errata and preferences for minor tweaks is growing to the point that it might justify reworking a few cards and reprinting them (and then i can laminate them and not worry about my originals getting spilled on).

you guys who work out all the statistics may have some really good suggestions.

[netherspirit]

Originally Posted by caravaggio

i am not going to buy the flagbearers. but if i get them for free by buying some more castles or something i wouldnt mind having them.

[netherspirit]

The only problem with changing the Valk dice to a d20 is that now it can receive a bonus from the glyph.

Also, with Jandar's flag bearer the chances are so slim that you will be moving 4 figures 12 spaces that it really can't be incorporated on a d20.

1/6^12 = almost never.

1/20 = much more often.

[caravaggio]

Originally Posted by netherspirit

oh, jeez, you're killing me, nether. very funny. but its true. if they are free and we can work the silly dice out of the equation i would actually use them (or at least provide them for others to use at my house).

[caravaggio]

Originally Posted by netherspirit

The only problem with changing the Valk dice to a d20 is that now it can receive a bonus from the glyph.

Also, with Jandar's flag bearer the chances are so slim that you will be moving 4 figures 12 spaces that it really can't be incorporated on a d20.

1/6^12 = almost never.

1/20 = much more often.

i see your point about the glyph but i dont mind that as much as i mind having to keep those silly dice around. we dont use that glyph (or many at all for that matter) very often.

for the jandar thing. some statistician could work it out on a D20 much better than i and if that means the best you can get is a +10 movement then so be it.

[CornPuff]

Heres some math help:

Acolarh has a 22% chance to save elves, so that's 17-20 on the D20, or 16-20 if you round up

Laglor has a 40% chance to keep firing. Ironically, he cannot keep firing if he rolls all skulls. So, change it to "If Laglor does not roll 3 skulls, he may roll the D20. If he rolls a 13 or higher, he may fire again.

I'll do gilbert soon. The Ornak and Hatamoto are a bit trickier, as it varies with their stat and their combatants stats (atk or def).

[CornPuff]

ok, here are the chances of Gilbert making your troops move x spaces:

0 : 11%
1 : 27%
2 : 30%
3 : 20%
4 : 9%
5 or more: 3.635%

of course it goes exponenentially down, so rolling 6 is a .7% chance, rolling 7 is a one in a thousand chance.

So, lets do this
0 : 1 or 2
1 : 3 through 7
2 : 8 -13
3 : 14 - 17
4 : 18 or 19
5 : 20

[netherspirit]

Originally Posted by CornPuff

of course it goes exponenentially down, so rolling 6 is a .7% chance, rolling 7 is a one in a thousand chance.

So, lets do this
0 : 1 or 2
1 : 3 through 7
2 : 8 -13
3 : 14 - 17
4 : 18 or 19
5 : 20

While slim it can still happen to get to move 6-12, with the d20 set up that way it can NEVER happen.

[LilNewbie]

Just mark the blank side of 12 HS dice with a dot from a sharpie and use those 12 dice for the Flag Bearer powers.

Newb.

[netherspirit]

Originally Posted by LilNewbie

Just mark a blank side of 12 HS dice with a dot from a sharpie and use those 12 dice for the Flag Bearer powers.

Newb.

Caravaggio is a baby and doesn't want to use anything but his blue and dice. :P

[LilNewbie]

My plan works for either the white dice or the blue and red dice...



Newb.

[CornPuff]

Originally Posted by netherspirit

While slim it can still happen to get to move 6-12, with the d20 set up that way it can NEVER happen.

rolling 12 Jandar symbols in 12 dice has a probability of
.00000000046
Set up that way, it can never happen.
In the D20 system, you are much more likely to see someone move 4 squaddies 5 hexes.

People treat Ne-Gok-Sa like his ability (5%) will never happen. I think treating a pretending that a 0.8% likelihood as never happening is acceptable, especially given the dramatic increase in likelihood to move 4 squaddies 5 spaces.

Basically, the D20 system is more generous the vast majority of the time. The Valkyrie dice system is more generous in desperation cases, such as "I must roll 6 valkyrie symbols or I instantly lose the game"