NM24 - Process

[Griffin]

I updated the changes requested by IamBatman.
#1 Normal Attack is 2
#2 Updated BATLINE so that it reads the same as Batman's card.

[whitestuff]

Nicely done Griff. Just a couple of things...

• The DC logo needs centering above the character's name.
• The text seems grainy when viewed at full resolution.
• What is a Driven Vigilante?
• Would the 'vigilante' in 'Sidekick' need a capital?
• Robin needs a capital R in 'Dynamic Duo'
• typo in 'Knockout Gas' - medium
• 'Robin's' needs a capital R in 'Batline'

Thematically -

• Why does Robin roll more defense than Spiderman? I see the two characters as fairly similar in terms of age and Spiderman has the better acrobatic abilities.
• I think the attack of 2 is a bit low - Robin is a master with his collapsible bow staff.

BTW, this is such a great picture of Robin - nice choice Bats.

[Markb97402]

While not arguing for or against defense 5(i do think it should be lowered) I think using Spider-mans defense to judge other peoples agility doesnt work well, since i think alot of that agilty gets represented in his spidey sense. I just think puttinfg defense four as "agile as spiderman", give you a very short scale. Ive always pictured spidey sense as representing him being able to dodge as well as sense danger, since his spidey sense always works(symbiotes aside)

So thinking about the Blob again for a second, I would like to keep the ability to stick multiple peeps. what option do nm24 peeps prefer?

1) leave as is and just "remember: who's stuck
2) add stuck tokens and wording to explain their use
3) add stuck tokens to the card for people to use to remember who's stuck, but don't actually give rules for the tokens

[Matt Helm]

Robin: I'm with Whitestuff. I suggest knocking the Defense down to 4 and returning the Attack to 3. But I still think that for a sidekick he is too powerful (eventhe ultimate sidekick).
- Flying (Batline)
- Range
- +1 Attack with a certain friendly
- Take a free turn with a friendly
- Ability to render an opponent defenseless

Overall, I'd suggest one of these should probablygo. I know we're not supposed to rewrite the card but I'm suggesting a deletion as an edit.

You must keep Batline
You must keep Range (bat-a-rang)
You must keep some synergy with Batman (Sidekick and or Dynamic Duo)

Since I like both Sidekick and Dynamic Duo, I'd suggest losing the knockout gas. I know it is only a 25% success rate, but if you just used Batman in front of him, then hit the gas, and add a +1 to Attack (never mind if you had height), you could crush almost anyone with Robin.... let me say that again... with Robin.

I think Knockout Gas is not as important thematically.

Nice job by Griffin on the art (see Iam, you got yourself an artist. I told you they were inexpensive.

[Matt Helm]

Blob: I hate to say this but I'd go with option 3. I don't think we need to tell folks how to use the tokens with wording on the card. It could be their choice to place it on the stuck figure or on the stuck card.

[Griffin]

Even though I am the one who brought up the issue of remembering who is STUCK, I think I'm going to side with option 1 leave as is and just "remember: who's stuck. I was able to remember each turn and round, but I could see how it could get messy. Did anyone else find that an issue during playtesting?

Thanks for the +rep and highfives on the card, I really just wanted to get a feel for this process with a card that is not my own. This process can be brutal at times (especially if I am commenting) and I wanted to see what this process is like from the other side of the coin. WhiteStuff already laid pretty hard into my Robin (well, IamBatman's Robin, but it feels like it is mine now), feathers ruffled and all, they are great suggestions and very well received input. NM24 Rocks!

[Griffin]

Originally Posted by Matt Helm

I'd suggest losing the knockout gas. I know it is only a 25% success rate, but if you just used Batman in front of him, then hit the gas, and add a +1 to Attack (never mind if you had height), you could crush almost anyone with Robin.... let me say that again... with Robin.

I think Knockout Gas is not as important thematically.

I agree with you Matt Helm. I also believe that the gas should go for all the reasons that you mentioned.

[Balantai]

Originally Posted by Matt Helm

I'd suggest losing the knockout gas. I know it is only a 25% success rate, but if you just used Batman in front of him, then hit the gas, and add a +1 to Attack (never mind if you had height), you could crush almost anyone with Robin.... let me say that again... with Robin.

I think Knockout Gas is not as important thematically.

I like Knockout Gas. It gives Robin that feel of surprise from his utility belt. What about increasing the difficulty to 19 or 20. If we're not looking for room on the card, I'd like to see it stay. With only a 10% chance of occuring, I don't feel as though it would cost many points to leave on the card.

[IAmBatman]

On Blob: I'm still in the favor of "Stuck" causing one wound so that squaddies die instantly and you only have to remember heroes, and then just sticking with remembering. But that's just me. I think having some squad members stuck and some not likely adds a lot of the confusion since squad members tend to be less memrable and more "anonymous." I'm not a fan of tokens if they can be avoided - one more thing for me to lose!

On Robin: I agree his defense is absolutely too high. His training under Batman and his armor are meant to be reflected in that, but my Batman has a defense of 5 - Robin's should be 4 at highest. The reason I thought about having his attack at 2 instead of three is due to how easy it is to enhance it (+1 for height, +1 for Dynamic Duo, No defense with a proper Knockout Gas roll). But I'm all fine with dropping Knockout gas and keeping the attack at 3 as well. I think it works better in gameplay since plenty of units Robin would be up against (Superman?) wouldn't even be phased by his knockout gas anyway.
Sidekick and Dynamic Duo by themselves are a pretty wicked combination (and make the Batman and Robin team a lot of fun to play).
PS There is, to my knowledge, only one "Driven Vigilante" and that's my TNT'd Batman. So Dynamic Duo is designed specifically to work with that card. I didn't want him getting the Dynamic Duo bonus for Nightwing or anybody else - just Bats.

[IAmBatman]

Sorry for the double post - forgot some things and Balantai snuck in with one when I wasn't looking.
If upping the roll for Knockout Gas works for you guys, it works for me. Even Superman has to have a bad day in these games, so a 19 or 20 for it would seem reasonable.
And I have to say, great work on the art, Griffin! It looks awesome - everything I was hoping for.

[Balantai]

Originally Posted by Markb97402

1) leave as is and just "remember: who's stuck
2) add stuck tokens and wording to explain their use
3) add stuck tokens to the card for people to use to remember who's stuck, but don't actually give rules for the tokens

I think I'd prefer number 3. We shouldn't have to tell them exactly how to use the markers.

[IAmBatman]

Actually, come to think of it, number 3 is kind of a combo between number 1 and number 3. If you just give Stuck tokens and don't tell them how to use them, using them essentially becomes optional. Meaning if you just want to try to remember by yourself you can do that, but if you're getting senile at a young age like me, you can use the help too.