The Book of Etrigan

[IAmBatman]

Yeah, not sure if that test exactly confirms 330 points, but it doesn't do anything to dispute it.

[johnny139]

Test in from ibechief. This one seems to suggest a lot lower... I could definitely see him going down a bit from these results, but the first test (a strong, flying, ranged bonding army against a heavy hitter grab-bag) is naturally going to reflect poorly on Etrigan and the second test his army won by a landslide, even if he wasn't a huge role in that.

I'll wait on the last test to see how that comes out.

Originally Posted by ibechief

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM

NAME OF THE TEST UNIT (Etrigan)

- THEME TEST/ Check to see if there are any powers or stats on the test unit card that does not accurately reflect the theme or likeness of what the character would and could do. Also consider destructible objects, and whether or not this characters powers should affect them.
Pass.

- MIRROR TEST/ Check to see if the unit were played against itself, if there would be any loops that would upset the balance of the Game.
Pass.

- BONDING TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing Bonding abilities to make sure there are no continual Bonding possibilities that do not stop appropriately or do not stop at all. This is to prevent loops in Bonding.
Pass.

- SYNERGIES TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing synergies to make sure there are no factors that could break the game by making any unit to powerful or too weak.
Pass.

- POWER CHECK/ Consider the test unit and all existing units and all glyphs to compare to and check for any powers that could be over amplified and break the game. Each power must define when it takes place, who or what it affects, and What are the stipulations on the power if there are any.
Pass.

- FUN TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play.
Pass. I'm not a big fan of melee only designs that do not feature a special movement power to help them close. Especially at this price level. It is to easy to get taken out before you can close and lose loads of points.

- FUN COMPETITIVE TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play against.
Pass.

- DRAFTING TEST/ Consider whether or not this design is worth drafting.
Fail. For the same points I would rather draft the Lobo design that is also a ground pounder, heck for 20 points less I'd rather grab She-Hulk who features a bigger Leap and has healing. Compare him to Iron Fist that is only 260 and is still a better draft...

- USAGE TEST/ Consider whether or not all of the powers on this card were used or at least usable.
Pass.

- STRATEGY TEST/ Consider whether or not the design offers any real strategy or interesting tactics to the overall game.
Pass.
----------------------------------------------

Army Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes.
- What should be the unit's point value? 290.
- Give a brief overview. Etrigan, Steel and Thanos get annihilated under the heel of the Kree invasion force.
Map: Icy Road Map Snow spaces are played as Heavy Snow, and Ice spaces are played as Slippery Ice.
Units: Etrigan, Steel, Thanos, Skrull Infiltrator x5 (1000) vs Captain Marvel, Ronan, Kree Scout x6 (1000).
Glyphs: Cosmic Control Rod, First Aid Kit

Spoiler Alert!

Ronan uses Honor Bound on Thanos.
Round 1: Initiative- Test team loss.
Turn 1: Kree Scout moves 6 spaces. Kree Hero Bonding -> Ronan moves 4 spaces.
Steel moves 4 spaces to highest ground.
Turn 2: Kree Scout moves 6 spaces onto a road tile. Kree Hero Bonding -> Ronan moves 4 spaces.
Etrigan moves 6 spaces to highest ground.
Turn 3: Kree Scout moves 9 spaces along road tiles to close. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel moves 6 spaces to close on glyph.
Thanos moves 6 spaces to close and attacks Kree Scout 4 skulls vs 2 shields for 2 wounds on Kree Scout. Kree Scout dies. Thanos had height advantage.
End of round with Kree Scout dead.
Round 2: Initiative- Test team won.
Turn 1: Thanos moves 6 spaces to within range of Captain Marvel and attacks 4 skulls vs 2 shields for 2 wounds on Captain Marvel. Thanos had height advantage.
Kree Scout moves 6 spaces and attacks Thanos 1 skull vs 1 shield for 0 wounds on Thanos. Thanos had height advantage. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel moves 3 spaces to engage Thanos and attacks 6 skulls vs 4 shields for 2 wounds on Thanos. Captain Marvel had height advantage.
Turn 2: Thanos moves 2 spaces to equal height and attacks Captain Marvel 2 skulls vs 1 shield for 1 wound on Captain Marvel.
Kree Scout uses Kree Tactical Teleportation -> Ronan is placed adjacent to Kree Scout. Kree Scout attacks Thanos 2 skulls vs 2 shields for 0 wounds on Thanos. Thanos had height advantage. Kree Hero Bonding -> Ronan uses Universal Weapon S/A on Thanos 4 skulls vs 1 shield for 3 wounds on Thanos.
Turn 3: Thanos attacks Captain Marvel 1 skull vs 2 shields for 0 wounds on Captain Marvel and 1 wound on Thanos. Thanos dies.
Kree Scout moves 6 spaces to end on road tile. Kree Hero Bonding -> Ronan moves 4 spaces to height.
End of round with Thanos dead, and 3 wounds on Captain Marvel.
Round 3:Ronan uses Honor Bound on Steel.
Initiative Test team won.
Turn 1: Rejected By Death (FAIL).Etrigan moves 6 spaces to close on glyph.
Kree Scout moves 9 spaces on road tiles to close. Kree Hero Bonding -> Ronan moves 4 spaces to close.
Turn 2: Rejected By Death (FAIL). Etrigan uses Leap 25 to move 3 spaces.
Kree Scout moves 6 spaces to high ground. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel moves 6 spaces to close.
Turn 3: Rejected By Death (FAIL). Etrigan uses Leap 25 to move 3 spaces to higher ground.
Kree Scout moves 4 spaces to higher ground. Kree Hero Bonding -> Ronan moves 2 spaces to reveal unknown glyph of Cosmic Control Rod, and equips it.
End of round with 1 glyph revealed.
Round 4: Initiative-Test team won.
Turn 1: Rejected By Death (FAIL). Etrigan moves 6 spaces to reveal unknown glyph of First Aid Kit.
Kree Scout uses Kree Tactical Teleportation, Captain Marvel and Ronan are moved adjacent. Kree Scout attacks Etrigan 3 skulls vs 1 shield for 2 wounds on Etrigan. Kree Scout had height advantage. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel attacks Etrigan 4 skulls vs 3 shields for 1 wound on Etrigan. Captain Marvel had height advantage.
Turn 2: Rejected By Death (FAIL). Etrigan moves 5 spaces to engage Ronan and uses Hellfire Burst S/A 4 skulls vs Ronan (4 shields), vs Kree Scout (1 shield), vs Captain Marvel (6 shields); for 0 wounds on Ronan, 3 wounds on Kree Scout, 0 wounds on Captain Marvel, and 2 wounds on Etrigan. Kree Scout dies. Kree Scout and Captain Marvel had height advantage.
Kree Scout moves 6 spaces to become adjacent with Ronan and Captain Marvel. Kree Scout attacks Etrigan 1 skull vs 1 shield for 0 wounds on Etrigan. Kree Scout had height advantage. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel attacks Etrigan 2 skulls vs 1 shield for 1 wound on Etrigan. Captain Marvel had height advantage.
Turn 3: Rejected By Death (FAIL). Etrigan moves 3 spaces and attacks Ronan 3 skulls vs 1 shield for 2 wounds on Ronan. Etrigan had height advantage. Cosmic Control Rod placed 4 spaces away behind Large Ruin.
Kree Scout moves 6 spaces to close. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel attacks Etrigan 4 skulls vs 0 shields for 4 wounds on Etrigan. Etrigan dies. Captain Marvel had height advantage.
End of round with Etrigan dead, 1 Kree Scout dead, and 2 wounds on Ronan.
Round 5: Initiative- Test team Loss.
Turn 1: Kree Scout moves 6 spaces to close. Kree Hero Bonding -> Ronan moves 4 spaces to Glyph of Cosmic Control Rod, and equips it.
Rejected By Death (FAIL). Steel moves 5 spaces and uses Bolt Gauntlets S/A on Kree Scout 1st attack 2 skulls vs 2 shields, 2nd attack 2 skulls vs 3 shields, 3rd attack 2 skulls vs 0 shields for 2 wounds on Kree Scout. Kree Scout dies. Skrull Infiltrator replaces Kree Scout.
Turn 2:Kree Scout uses Kree Tactical Teleportation to place Ronan and Captain Marvel adjacent to Kree Scout. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel moves 5 spaces to within range of Steel and attacks 5 skulls vs 2 shields for 3 wounds on Steel. Steel had height advantage.
Rejected By Death (FAIL). Steel moves 3 spaces to engage Captain Marvel and attacks 3 skulls vs 3 shields for 0 wound on Captain Marvel.
Turn 3: Kree Scout moves 6 spaces to close. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel moves 1 space and attacks Steel 4 skulls vs 3 shields for 1 wound on Steel. Steel dies. Skrull Infiltrator replaces Steel.
Rejected By Death (FAIL). Steel is dead.
End of round with Steel dead, 1 Kree Scout dead, and 2 Skrull Infiltrators placed on map.Round 6: Initiative- Test team Loss.
Turn 1:Kree Scout moves 6 spaces to close. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel attacks Skrull Infiltrator 2 skulls vs 1 shield for 1 wound on Skrull Infiltrator. Skrull Infiltrator dies.
Rejected By Death (FAIL). Skrull Infiltrator moves 5 spaces to higher ground.
Turn 2: Kree Scout moves 6 spaces and attacks Skrull Infiltrator 1 skull vs 1 shield for 0 wounds on Skrull Infiltrator. Skrull Infiltrator had height advantage. Kree Hero Bonding -> Captain Marvel attacks Skrull Infiltrator 2 skulls vs 1 shield for 1 wound on Skrull Infiltrator. Skrull Infiltrator dies. Skrull Infiltrator had height advantage.
End of round with 2 Skrull Infiltrators dead.

End of Game with Kree Scout x 3, Ronan (2 wound markers), and Captain Marvel (3 wound markers).

Spoiler Alert!

Because Etrigan lacks bonding and synergy in his design I wanted to play Etrigan against a standard bonding army that features a focus on ranged. Thanos was meant to take out Captain Marvel or at least weaken him and then come back to finish the job before the end of the game, but this did not work. The extra activations and the Kree Teleportation Tactic destroyed any chance of resisting the Kree force. Once the Kree force bonds and Ronin gives synergy to Marvel and the Scouts Etrigan went down in 3 hits. His Hellfire Burst S/A just doesn't do enough damage to be used on 300 + point heroes with any defensive abilities. Even with Superior mobility (mostly flying figures) the lack of helpful abilities doomed this test army from the start against the better bonded and synergized Kree. Steel went down in 2 hits from Captain Marvel.

Who won and how many wounds did they have? Kree Scout x3, Ronan with 4 life left, and Captain Marvel with 2 life left.

Army Test
- Does it pass, Yes or No? Yes.
- What should be the unit's point value? 280.
- Give a brief overview. Fearful of his demonic transformation Etrigan's allies hole up on high ground while Etrigan battles it out with only Swarms of Fire Ants at his side. Etrigan may have fallen in battle but not before ensuring victory for his army!
Map: Icy Road Map played as heavy snow and slippery ice. Units: Etrigan, Fire Ant Swarm x10, Invisible Woman, Ant-Man, Super-Skrull (Kl'rt), Wasp, Shadowcat (1145) vs Spider-Man (Peter Parker), Deathstroke, Catwoman, Gambit, Iron Fist (1145).
Glyph:

Spoiler Alert!

Round 1: Initiative- Test team loss.
Iron First, Spider-Man move up.
Shadowcat, Invisible Woman, and Wasp move up.
End of round with nothing new.
Round 2: Initiative- Test team loss.
Iron Fist, Catwoman, and Deathstroke move up.
Super-Skrull, Ant-Man, Fire Ant Swarm x2, and Etrigan move up.
End of round with nothing new.
Round 3: Initiative Test team loss.
Turn 1: Iron Fist moved up to close and was engaged and attacked by Etrigan for 2 wounds delt to Iron Fist.
Turn 2: Iron fist retaliated to inflict 2 wounds and healed 1. Etrigan inflicted 3 more wounds on Iron fist.
Turn 3: Deathstroke attacked Etrigan and delt 1 wound. Fire Ant Swarms killed Iron Fist.
End of round with Iron First dead.
Round 4: Initiative-Test team won.
Swarm Tunneling moved Fire Ant Swarm up and surrounded Deathstroke.
Turn 1: Etrigan killed himself attacking Deathstroke. Deathstroke attacked Fire Ants killing 1.
The next two rounds were Fire Ants and Deathstroke fighting it out with Deathstroke healing and Fire Ants doing 1 or 2 wounds per turn.
Round 5: Initiative- Test team loss.
Deathstroke dies in turn 1 and the test opponent loses OM 2 and 3. Fire Ants move around for the rest of the round.
Round 6: Initiative Test team loss.
Turn 1: Gambit moves up, Fire ants move up.
Turn 2: Catwoman moves up, Fire ants move.
Turn 3: Spider-Man moves up, Fire ants move.
Round 7: Initiative- Test team loss.
Turn 1: Gambit moves up to close, Ants miss with Poison Sting.
Turn 2: Catwoman moves up to close, Ants Miss with Poison Sting.
Turn 3: Gambit takes out 2 Fire Ant Swarms, Ants Miss with Poison Sting.
Round 8: Initiative- Test team loss.
Turn 1: Gambit kills 1 Fire Ant Swarm. Fire Ants Move up and Miss with Poison Sting.
Turn 2: Catwoman moves up, Fire ants move up and deal 1 wound to Catwoman.
Turn 3: Gambit moves up and kills 1 Fire Ant Swarm.
Ant-Man uses Radio Insect Control -> Fire Ant Swarm moves 3 spaces and uses Poison Sting on Catwoman (FAIL). Fire Ant Swarm uses Poison Sting on Catwoman (FAIL).
Round 9: Initiative Test team won.
Swarm Tunneling moves 0 Fire Ant Swarms.
Turn 1: Ant-Man uses Radio Insect Control -> Fire Ant Swarm uses Poison Sting on Catwoman (Success)-> (Success)-> (FAIL). Fire Ant Swarm uses Poison Sting on Catwoman (FAIL). For 2 wounds on Catwoman.
Catwoman attacks Fire Ant Swarm 2 skulls vs 0 shields for 2 wounds on Fire Ant Swarm. Fire Ant Swarm dies.
Turn 2: Ant-Man uses Radio Insect Control -> Fire Ant Swarm uses Poison Sting on Catwoman (Success)-> (FAIL). Fire Ant Swarm uses Poison Sting on Catwoman (FAIL). For 1 wound on Catwoman.
Catwoman attacks Fire Ant Swarm 2 skulls vs 0 shields for 2 wounds on Fire Ant Swarm. Fire Ant Swarm had height advantage.
Turn 3: Super-Skrull moves back 1 space.
Gambit moves 1 space. Gambit uses Staff Vault to move 3 spaces to engage Shadowcat. Gambit attacks Shadowcat 4 skulls vs 3 shields for 1 wound on Shadowcat.
End of round with 2 Fire Ant Swarms dead, 3 wounds on Catwoman, and 1 wound on Shadowcat.
Round 10: Initiative-Test team loss.
Turn 1: Gambit moves 3 spaces. Gambit uses Staff Vault to move 3 spaces engaged to Invisible Woman, Super-Skrull, and Wasp. Gambit attacks Wasp 2 skulls vs 3 shields for 0 wounds on Wasp.
Wasp uses Wasp Sting S/A on Gambit, 1st attack 0 skulls vs 0 shields, 2nd attack 0 skulls vs 0 shields for 0 wounds on Gambit. Turn 2: Gambit moves 3 spaces. Gambit uses Staff Vault to move 3 spaces back. Gambit attacks Wasp 3 skulls vs 3 shields for 0 wounds on Wasp.
Wasp uses Wasp Sting S/A on Gambit, 1st attack 1 skull vs 0 shields, 2nd attack 0 skulls vs 0 shields for 1 wound on Gambit.
Turn 3: Spider-Man moves 6 spaces to close.
Super-Skrull attacks Gambit 2 skulls vs 2 shields for 0 wounds on Gambit.
End of round with 1 wound on Gambit.
Round 11: Initiative- Test team loss.
Turn 1: Gambit moves 3 spaces back and uses Staff Vault to move 3 spaces to engage Shadowcat, Wasp, and Ant Man. Gambit Attacks Wasp 2 skulls vs 4 shields for 0 wounds on Wasp.
Super-Skrull moves 1 space to attack Gambit 5 skulls vs 3 shields for 2 wounds on Gambit. Super-Skrull had height advantage.
Turn 2: Gambit moves 2 spaces and Staff Vaults 3 spaces to engage Invisible Woman and Super-Skrull. Gambit attacks Invisible Woman 1 skull vs 4 shields for 0 wounds on Invisible Woman. Invisible Woman had height advantage.
Super-Skrull attacks Gambit 3 skulls vs 2 shields for 1 wound on Gambit. Gambit dies. Super-Skrull had height advantage.
Turn 3: Spider-Man uses Web Swing 2 (2,2) spaces to engage Shadowcat. Spider-Man attacks Shadowcat 3 skulls vs 5 shields for 0 wounds on Shadowcat. Shadowcat had height advantage.
Wasp uses Wasp Sting S/A on Spider-Man, Wasp moves 1 space, 1st attack 1 skull vs Spidey Senses 9 (Success) -> Spider-Man moves 2 spaces back. Wasp moves 1 space back to height.
End of round with Gambit dead.
Round 12: Initiative- Test team won.
Fire Ant Swarm uses Swarm Tunneling to move 0 spaces.
Turn 1: Wasp does nothing.
Catwoman moves 3 spaces and attacks Fire Ant Swarm 2 skulls vs 1 shield for 1 wounds on Fire Ant Swarm. Fire Ant Swarm dies.
Turn 2: Super-Skrull moves back 1 space.
Spider-Man moves 3 spaces to engage Shadowcat 1 skull vs 0 shields for 1 wound on Shadowcat. Shadowcat had height advantage.
Turn 3:Wasp uses Wasp Sting S/A on Spider-Man, Wasp moves 1 space, 1st attack 1 skull vs Spidey Senses 9 (Success) -> Spider-Man moves 2 spaces back. Wasp moves 1 space back to height.
Spider-Man moves 2 spaces and attacks Shadowcat 2 skulls vs 2 shields for 0 wounds on Shadowcat. Shadowcat had height advantage.
End of round with 1 wound on Shadowcat, and Fire Ant Swarm dead.
Round 13: Initiative- Test team won.
Turn 1: Wasp uses Wasp Sting S/A on Spider-Man, Wasp moves 1 space, 1st attack 0 skulls vs 0 shields, 2nd attack 0 skulls vs 2 shields for 0 wounds on Spider-Man; Wasp moves 1 space back to height.
Spider-Man attacks Shadowcat 2 skulls vs 1 shield for 1 wound on Shadowcat. Shadowcat had height advantage.
Turn 2: Wasp uses Wasp Sting S/A on Spider-Man, Wasp moves 1 space, 1st attack 1 skull vs Spidey Senses 9 (Success) -> Spider-Man moves 2 spaces into Wasp's original placement. Wasp moves 3 space back to height, 2nd attack 1 skull vs Spidey Senses 9 (FAIL) vs 0 shields for 1 wound on Spider-Man.
Catwoman moves 5 spaces to attack Shadowcat 1 skull vs 5 shields for 0 wounds on Shadowcat. Shadowcat had height advantage.
Turn 3: Invisible Woman attacks Spider-Man 2 skulls vs Spidey Senses 9 (FAIL) vs 2 shields for 0 wounds on Spider-Man.
Spider-Man attacks Wasp 0 skulls vs 3 shields for 0 wounds on Wasp.
End of round with 1 wound on Shadowcat, and 1 wound on Spider-Man.
Round 14: Initiative- Test team loss.
Turn 1: Spider-Man attacks Wasp 1 skull vs 3 shields for 0 wounds on Wasp.
Super-Skrull attacks Spider-Man 2 skulls vsSpidey Senses 9 (Success) -> Spider-Man moves (2,2) spaces away.
Turn 2: Spider-Man moves 3 spaces to engage Ant-Man and Shadowcat. Spider-Man attacks Shadowcat 2 skulls vs 5 shields for 0 wounds on Shadowcat. Shadowcat had height advantage.
Wasp uses Wasp Sting S/A on Spider-Man, Wasp moves 1 space, 1st attack 1 skull vs Spidey Senses 9 (Success) -> Spider-Man moves 2 spaces into Wasp's original placement. 2nd attack 1 skull vs Spidey Senses 9 (Success).
Turn 3: Spider-Man attacks Wasp 1 skull vs 2 shields for 0 wounds on Wasp.
Invisible Woman attacks Spider-Man 3 skulls vs Spidey Senses 9 (FAIL) vs 1 shield for 2 wounds on Spider-Man.
End of round with 2 wounds on Spider-Man.
Round 15: Initiative Test team loss.
Turn 1: Spider-Man attacks Wasp 1 skull vs 5 shields for 0 wounds on Wasp.
Super-Skrull attacks Spider-Man 3 skulls vs
Spidey Senses 9 (Success).
Turn 2: Spider-Man attacks Wasp 3 skulls vs 3 shields for 0 wounds on Wasp.
Wasp uses Wasp Sting S/A on Spider-Man, 1st attack 0 skull vs 0 shields, 2nd attack 1 skull vs Spidey Senses 9 (FAIL) vs 0 shields for 1 wound on Spider-Man.
Turn 3: Catwoman moves 1 space to engage Wasp and attacks2 skulls vs 1 shield for 1 wound on Wasp. Wasp had height advantage. Wasp dies.
Invisible Woman attacks Spider-Man 2 skulls vs Spidey Senses 9 (FAIL) vs 1 shield for 1 wound on Spider-Man. Spider-Man dies. Invisible Woman had height advantage.
End of round with Wasp dead, and Spider-Man dead.
Round 16: Initiative- Test team loss.
Turn 1: Catwoman moves 1 space to engage Ant-Man and Invisible Woman. Catwoman attacks Invisible Woman 2 skulls vs 2 shields for 0 wounds on Invisible Woman. Invisible Woman had height advantage.Super-Skrull moves 1 space to engage Catwoman and attacks 4 skulls vs Stray 13 (FAIL) vs 0 shields for 4 wounds on Catwoman.
Turn 2: Catwoman attacks Invisible Woman 1 skull vs 3 shields for 0 wounds on Invisible Woman. Invisible Woman had height advantage.
Super-Skrull attacks Catwoman 4 skulls vs Stray 13 (Success)-> Catwoman moves 1 space.
Turn 3: Catwoman moves 1 space to engage Invisible Woman, Super-Skrull, and Ant-Man. Catwoman attacks Invisible Woman 2 skulls vs 3 shields for 0 wounds on Invisible Woman. Invisible Woman had height advantage.
Super-Skrull attacks Catwoman 3 skulls vs Stray 13 (FAIL) vs 1 shield for 2 wounds on Catwoman. Catwoman dies.
End of round with Catwoman dead.

End of Game with Invisible Woman (unwounded), Shadowcat (3 wound markers), Ant-Man (unwounded), and Super-Skrull (unwounded).

Spoiler Alert!

This army was built to provide only support for Etrigan. While maintaining longevity on the battlefield. The counter draft was all mid range heroes with a variety of abilities ranging from Dodge bonuses, Multi attacks, healing, and Counter strikes. With no healing, auto wounding, or defensive abilities Etrigan went down to much lesser point heroes, but not before he did some damage. His leap was under utilized even on a map with lots of terrain effects, because of the small range. Etrigan's defensive group maintained hieght the whole game and dominated the opposition. Ant-Man's Fire Ant Swarms earned far more than their points even though they did eat up loads of activations. But ultimately Invisible Woman was the star of this show; her defensive boost ensured the win for Etrigan's team. Surrounding her with allies that all had some version of Invisibility or Tiny Stealth, forced the opponents to come to melee range to engage.

As a whole I'm not impressed with Etrigan, he seems like he is not really draftable unless you use him as a second heavy hitter who comes in after most of the opponents are engaged already. His stats are not higher than most 280-300 point heroes and his abilities are not very useful. Except in specific situations. I would rather see him with flying, and a triple attack with a range of 3 at 5 attack for hellfire that permits him to ignore engagements. As presented he is resticted to a medium/heavy ground pounder and his points are just to high to support his stats/powers.

It was fun though to watch the Batman episode on HUB while we were playtesting him. I even looked up some of your old designs for him in the public design thread. I liked some of that stuff you had there more.

Hope this info helps!

Who won and how many wounds did they have? Invisible Woman with full life, Shadowcat with 1 life left, Ant-Man with full life, and Super-Skrull with full life.

[Hahma]

Well, Chief used the same map that he uses in every test (hard way to get many impressions of units when only ever using one map) but then he added heavy snow and slippery ice. Well of course you aren't going to get much mobility from a ground-pounding melee unit when they play on heavy snow and slippery ice. Most people don't play on those maps, so it's not very reflective of how Etrigan would get around most of the time. His leaping also allows him access to just about any height that will be used in most games. So he could leap onto the walls of Hydra base Gehenna or on the roof of the buildings on X-Marks the Spot for example, which is a smaller map that his move of 6 would really get him around plenty well with. Also, Chief used to be fond of toting around non-flyers with GL John, so he could do the same for Etrigan and carry the party to the opponent's.

Etrigan's special attack seems best suited to help against mid-levels and squads. So don't use it against 300 plus units unless it's your best option. Though I'd prefer to take advantage of his huge normal attack, especially with height from leaping.

At the cost he was tested, Etrigan's army got beat by a synergized multi-activational army, while Etrigan's didn't have that and Thanos didn't come back.

Second test got a huge victory for Etrigan's army, so I'm not seeing the problem.

There are also several HH melee units that are single attack only and can get trounced by squads. Etrigan has a power to help eliminate that issue that others have.

[johnny139]

Yeah. He said he would take Lobo over Etrigan but, frankly, looking at the two one-on-one, I think Etrigan looks better overall.

[Hahma]

Lobo gets to heal, sure. But Etrigan has 1 better life to help a little there and 1 better attack vs. everyone, while Lobo will have 1 better attack against his bounty.

Lobo's move is only 5 vs. 6 for Etrigan.

Etrigan is Lava Resistant that will help him on lava maps but also against certain special attacks.

Etrigan can Leap, whereas Lobo can't and is stuck on the ground.

Lobo can bring an opponent to him which is nice, but needs 9+ on a d20 roll.

Lobo is a single attacking melee unit and can get swarmed by squads easier than Etrigan that can use his special to get more then one squaddie. This would be pretty useful vs. the Gorilla City Warriors that need to swarm a figure to be most effective.

[johnny139]

Another one in from cwidje. Again, he recommends going lower... but I don't really see it to any great extent. His army won the second match, against a more synergistic group, by a hair, and lost the first with a grabbag vs. synergy (with a lot of those figures tailor-made to run circles in head-to-head competition). I'm feeling lower for sure... but not as low as they're suggesting.

I'm thinking 320, maybe a bit less. How does that feel to everyone else?

Originally Posted by cwidje

- THEME TEST/ Pass. Leap 25 is useful but not thematically necessary. I think that some sort of healing factor or immortality power would more aptly suit him. I also believe that “Lava Resistant” could be replaced with “Enhanced Durability” or “Invulnerable”.

- MIRROR TEST/ Pass

- BONDING TEST/ Pass

- SYNERGIES TEST/ Pass

- POWER CHECK/ Pass

- FUN TEST/ Pass

- FUN COMPETITIVE TEST/ Pass

- DRAFTING TEST/ Pass

- USAGE TEST/ Pass

- STRATEGY TEST/ Pass

- pass? Yes
- point value? 200
- overview. Etrigan did not earn his point cost. His very high attack rolls were ignored by defensive abilities and his poor defensive rolls got him killed fairly quickly.
Map: Sewer Labyrinth
Units: Army 1: Etrigan[330], Magma[170], Invisible Woman[215], Human Torch[150], Pyro[120]. 985 Points
Army 2: Luke Cage[190], Dagger[105], Spider-Man[250], Speedball[150], Wolverine[280], Skrull Infiltrator[10]. 985 Points
Spoiler Alert!
Speedball moves via I've Got Your Back. Luke Cage moves. Magma places lava. Spider-Man moves via I've Got Your Back. Luke Cage moves. Magma places lava. Speedball attacks Magma via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage moves. Magma places lava. Speedball attacks Magma (with height) via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks Magma (with height), 2 wounds. Magma special attacks Luke Cage, 0 wounds. Speedball attacks Magma (with height) via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks Magma (with height), 0 wounds. Magma special attacks Luke Cage, 0 wounds. Speedball attacks Magma (with height) via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks Magma (with height), 0 wounds. Invisible Woman moves. Speedball attacks Magma (with height) via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks Magma (with height), 1 wound. Invisible Woman attacks Luke Cage, 0 wounds. Speedball attacks Magma (with height) via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks Magma (with height), 0 wounds. Invisible Woman attacks Luke Cage, 0 wounds. Speedball attacks Invisible Woman (with height) via I've Got Your Back, 1 wound on Speedball, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks Magma (with height), 0 wounds. Etrigan moves. Invisible Woman (with height) attacks Speedball, 0 wounds. Speedball attacks Invisible Woman via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks Magma (with height), 0 wounds. Etrigan special attacks Speedball, 0 wounds. Speedball attacks Invisible Woman via I've Got Your Back, 1 wound. Luke Cage attacks Magma (with height), 1 wound, Magma dead. Etrigan special attacks Speedball (with height), 4 wounds. Spider-Man attacks Etrigan via I've Got Your Back, 2 wounds. Spider-Man attacks Etrigan via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks. Etrigan special attacks Luke Cage & Spider-Man, 1 wound on Etrigan, 1 wound, Spider-Man Web Swings. Spider-Man attacks Etrigan via I've Got Your Back, 1 wound. Luke Cage (with height) attacks Etrigan, 3 wounds, Etrigan dead. Speedball attacks Invisible Woman via I've Got Your Back, 1 wound, 1 wound, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks Invisible Woman (with height), 0 wounds. Spider-Man attacks Invisible Woman via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage attacks Invisible Woman (with height), 0 wounds. Invisible Woman moves. Speedball attacks Invisible Woman via I've Got Your Back, 0 wounds. Luke Cage moves. Human Torch special attacks Luke Cage, 6 wounds, Luke Cage dead. Wolverine moves. Human Torch special attacks Speedball, 0 wounds. Spider-Man (with height), attacks Pyro, 1 wound. Pyro special attacks Spider-Man, 0 wounds. Spider-Man Web Slings Pyro into lava, dead (order marker 2 on Pyro). Wolverine moves. Human Torch special attacks Spider-Man, 0 wounds. Spider-Man attacks Invisible Woman, 1 wound. Human Torch special attacks Spider-Man, 2 wounds. Spider-Man attacks Invisible Woman, 1 wound, Invisible Woman dead. Human Torch special attacks Spider-Man, 0 wounds. Wolverine moves. Human Torch special attacks Wolverine, 1 wound. Human Torch special attacks Wolverine, 0 wounds. Spider-Man attacks Human Torch, 0 wounds. Human Torch special attacks Spider-Man, 0 wounds. Spider-Man attacks Human Torch, 1 wound. Human Torch (with height) attacks Wolverine, 1 wound. Wolverine attacks Human Torch (with height), 0 wounds, 2 wounds, 0 wounds. Human Torch (with height) attacks Wolverine, 3 wounds. Wolverine attacks Human Torch (with height), 1 wound, 2 wounds, Human Torch dead.
results Army 2 won with 4 life on Dagger, 3 life on Spider-Man, 1 life on Speedball, 2 life on Wolverine, and 1 life on Skrull Infiltrator.


- pass? pass
- point value? 300
- overview. Etrigan is effective against high-powered squads and low-level heroes.
Map: Sewer Labyrinth
Units: Army 1: Etrigan[330], Angel[90], Beast Boy[40], Vulture[90], Captain America[240], Creeper[125]. 915 Points
Army 2: Kingpin[220], Hired Guns[130], Elite League Assassins[150], The Hood[180], Man-Bat Assassins[150], Hand Ninja[85]. 915 Points
Spoiler Alert!
Beast Boy carries Creeper. Hired Guns move via Organized Crime. Kingpin moves. Vulture grabs Captain America. The Hood activates Cloak of Dormammu via Organized Crime. Kingpin moves. Angel carries Etrigan. Hired Gun 1 attacks Vulture twice via Organized Crime, 1 wound, 0 wounds. Hired Gun 2 (with height) attacks Creeper twice, 1 wound, 0 wounds. Hired Gun 3 attacks Creeper twice via Organized Crime, 2 wounds, 1 wound. Hired Gun 4 (with height on Creeper) attacks Creeper & Beast Boy via Organized Crime, 3 wounds, Creeper dead, 0 wounds. The Hood (with height) activates Cloak of Dormammu & attacks Vulture via Organized Crime, 1 wound, 1 wound. Kingpin attacks Beast Boy (with height), 0 wounds. Etrigan special attacks 2 Hired Guns (with height) & Kingpin, 2 Hired Guns dead, 2 wounds on Kingpin. Hired Gun 1 (with height) attacks Etrigan twice via Organized Crime, 1 wound, 0 wounds. Hired Gun 2 (with height) attacks Etrigan twice via Organized Crime, 0 wounds, 0 wounds. Kingpin attacks Etrigan, 0 wounds. Captain America special attacks Kingpin & Hired Gun, 2 wounds, 1 wound, Hired Gun dead. The Hood (with height) attacks Vulture twice via Organized Crime, 0 wounds, 2 wounds, Vulture dead, The Hood is now Demon. Kingpin attacks Etrigan, 1 wound. Etrigan (with height) attacks Kingpin, 6 wounds, Kingpin dead. Hired Gun attacks Angel twice, 1 wound, 0 wounds. Captain America special attacks Hired Gun & The Hood, 1 wound, Hired Gun dead, 1 wound. The Hood attacks Captain America, 0 wounds. Etrigan special attacks The Hood, 3 wounds. Man Bat Assassins move via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Hand Ninja move. Etrigan special attacks Man-Bat Assassin & 2 Hand Ninja, 0 wounds, 0 wounds, 1 wound, Hand Ninja dead. Man-Bat Assassin 1 moves via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Man-Bat Assassin 2 attacks Etrigan via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 3 wounds. Man-Bat Assassin 3 attacks Etrigan via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 0 wounds. Hand Ninja 1 attacks Etrigan, 1 wound. Hand Ninja 2 attacks Etrigan, 0 wounds. Captain America special attacks The Hood & 2 Hand Ninja, 1 wound, 1 Hand Ninja dead. Man-Bat Assassin 1 grabs Etrigan via Ninja Assassin Bonding, Etrigan dead (Order Marker 3 on Etrigan). Man-Bat Assassin 2 moves via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Man-Bat Assassin 3 grabs & attacks Beast Boy via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 1 wound. Hand Ninja moves. Angel attacks The Hood (with height), 0 wounds. Man-Bat Assassin 1 moves via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Man-Bat Assassin 2 moves via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Man-Bat Assassin 3 (with height) attacks Angel via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 1 wound. Man-Bat Assassin 1 grabs & attacks Beast Boy via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 1 wound, Beast Boy dead (Order Marker 2 on Beast Boy). Man-Bat Assassin 2 moves via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Man-Bat Assassin 3 moves via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Hand Ninja moves. Captain America attacks Man-Bat Assassin, 0 wounds. Man-Bat Assassin 1 moves via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Man-Bat Assassin 2 grabs & attacks Angel, 0 wounds. Man-Bat 3 attacks Captain America, 0 wounds. Hand Ninja moves. Angel attacks Man-Bat Assassin, 3 wounds, Man-Bat Assassin dead. Man-Bat Assassin 1 attacks Angel via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 1 wound. Man-Bat Assassin 2 moves via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Captain America attacks Man-Bat Assassin, 1 wound, Man-Bat Assassin dead. Man-Bat Assassin grabs & attacks Captain America via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 0 wounds. Captain America (with height) attacks Man-Bat Assassin, 4 wounds, Man-Bat Assassin dead. Elite League Assassins move via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Captain America special attacks The Hood & 1 Elite League Assassin, 2 wounds, 0 wounds. Elite League Assassin 1 attacks Angel via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 0 wounds. Elite League Assassin 1 attacks Angel via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 0 wounds. Elite League Assassin 2 attacks Angel via Ninja Assassin Bonding, 0 wounds. Elite League Assassin 3 moves via Ninja Assassin Bonding. Hand Ninja attacks Angel, 2 wounds, Angel dead. Captain America attacks Hand Ninja, 2 wounds, Hand Ninja dead (Order Markers 2&3 on Hand Ninjas). Captain America attacks Elite League Assassin, 0 wounds. Captain America attacks Elite League Assassin, 1 wound, Elite League Assassin dead. Captain America special attacks The Hood & 2 Elite League Assassins, 0 wounds, 1 Elite League Assassin dead. Elite League Assassin attacks Captain America, 0 wounds. Captain America special attacks The Hood & Elite League Assassin, 0 wounds, 0 wounds. Elite League Assassin attacks Captain America, 0 wounds. Captain America special attacks The Hood & Elite League Assassin, 2 wounds, The Hood dead, 0 wounds. Elite League Assassin attacks Captain America, 2 wounds. Captain America attacks Elite League Assassin, 3 wounds, Elite League Assassin dead.
results Army 1 won with 2 life on Captain America.

[IAmBatman]

Hmm, well he's a squad and mid-level hero killer, it seems. How's he compare to others in the 300-320 set (since I'm guessing that's his cost point).

[johnny139]

I think he's probably most comparable to the official Abomination, who's at 320. They're both 7/6 Attack/Defense. Both have a multi-hit Special Attack and Leap, but Etrigan's is stronger and has range, while Abomination has a better Leap. Etrigan has Lava Resistant while Abomination has one extra Life.

They're about even. He's not super amazing at that price but certainly draftable, depending on the opponents' army makeup. And I figure Jason Blood will probably help give him some maneuverability (and since Blood will have Magical Defense, that'll protect against big hits from Range while he moves in).

[Hahma]

I could see 320.

I guess when it gets in the 290-360 point range, a lot depends on what you need that figure for.

Hercules at 360 is great vs. HH's, but has nothing for squads. No special attack.

Annihilus at 360 can be pretty nasty, but is dependent on the glyph or he can take auto-wounds. No special attack.

Wendigo at 350 is comparable to Etrigan with 7 life, 6 move, 1 range, 7 attack and 6 defense. He's got super leap, but is -3 to attack afterward. He can get extra turns by destroying UH's and remove wounds from killing figures, so when he's going against squaddies or mid-levels, he will be nastier than against nasty HH's or figures with special defenses. No special attack to counter special defenses.

Super Skrull Kl'RT at 340 has 1 less life and attack, but has a range of 2 and can fly. He's got Lava Resistant like Etrigan but also has partial invisibility which is better than Etrigan and Rock Wall Bounce Back is a nice auto-wound giver vs. normal adjacent attacks. He doesn't have offensive ability vs. multiple figures though, but can kill adjacent squaddies with his RWBB3. He doesn't have a special attack to counter special defenses.

Juggernaut at 340 has same life, 1 less move, 1 less attack but 1 better defense. No leap and has a special attack. His special can be better than Etrigan's given the right circumstances, but is less flexible and opponent needs to have figures lined up. Mental Shield is nice, as is Large to avoid certain powers like throw. But then that works against him sometimes too in not climbing ladders or being thrown by some of his own figures. He can't be lassoed though. He's better defensively, but Etrigan is more mobile and has better attack.

She-Hulk at 310 has 1 less life but can heal. Her normal move is 1 better and her attack is the same. Her defense can be higher than Etrigan's based on the attacker's roll. She has further leap, but is -3 to attack afterward. She has nothing vs. multiple opponent's and no special attack.

Red Tornado at 300 is nice to move your figures and can move opponent's figures too. He fly's and has a nice move, so he's a bit more mobile than Etrigan and can help teammates. He's got 1 less life and 1 less attack and isn't Lava Resistant. He's got a ranges special attack that is nice in that it's straight up ranged, but is 4 vs. Etrigan's 5.

Martian Manhunter at 300 is nice in that Intangibility keeps him safe from range. He's got 1 less life and attack, but can fly and has a range of 3, but no special attack to go against special defenses or ability to attack multiple figures. Telepathic Directive is great in getting free movement for teammates.

Overall, draftability is dependent on what you really need at this price range. Some of the figures are more specialists in some ways than others. Some can fly, some have further leaps, some have special defensive abilities, some do better vs. squads/mid-levels, some are better 1v1 against other like pointed HH's.

Etrigan seems like he has a nice mix of a lot of things. Lava Resistant is a defensive power that will work on Lava maps and vs. Magma and fire type figures where Lava Resistant figures are immune. Attack of 7 is good 1v1 vs. 300 point figures. Special attack can bypass special defenses and can also affect multiple figures. Leap will get him to height, and while not as far as super leap horizontally, he also doesn't suffer a penalty to his attack when using it. No healing, but life of 7 is nice to go along with defense of 6. If he takes advantage of his Leap, he can get height to help defensively.

[SirGalahad]

320 works for me.

[johnny139]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Hahma again.

Very impressive analysis there Hahma. It really helps me see the overall picture... I mean, I'd probably take Etrigan over Wendigo, who's 30 points more, but in most situations would sooner pick Martian Manhunter. But I think against the right builds he can earn back his points easily; he's a situational draft but not a bad one.

With that, I PROPOSE WE MOVE TO FINAL EDITING AT 320!

[SirGalahad]

yea to editing