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Custom Units & Army Cards Fan-created HS army cards for units, glyphs, and equipment |
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#205
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
The prospect of C3V taking over a public design doesn't sit well with me (even if it is led by a C3V member, there are plenty of us who don't have access to those discussions and still like to contribute to Clayton). I'm glad that this seems to be the consensus.
I do think that the argument about Order Marker management being a little wooden has merit. There aren't many turns where you'd like to place your first Order Marker on someone besides Clayton, and typically you want to place all of your other ones on different Lawmen to maximize Shootout. There's definitely an efficient way of placing your OMs here. That said, this design still gives you the freedom to do otherwise. Plenty of other leaders involve a much more rigid OM-placement (generally just requiring everything to be placed on them), so I'd actually argue that Posse/Shootout are the standouts in terms of OM freedom here. Fixing the heavy reliance on using OM1 for positioning and the other two for attacking would require major changes to the design itself, and I'm not sure that scrapping a lot of what makes Clayton unique is worth that. I also feel like a big part of why it currently feels stiff is because we currently don't have that many Lawmen. There are only three options for Clayton right now (two of which are extremely similar), so each of the turns are going to feel pretty similar. Once more Unique Lawmen like Guilty McCreech or the shotgunners are added, with their own unique powers and Special Attacks, the choice of which ones to move (and which order to take their turns) becomes far more interesting. Proud Member of Platyfly!
Custom Units — Maps & Scenarios Battle Reports The Case for a VC Master Set |
#206
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
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#207
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
Quote:
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Anyway, since you guys keep referencing a discord, where is this? Is it a public server? I'm on one Heroscape discord channel but I don't believe it's the one you're referencing. I don't keep track of everyone's individual custom threads, so I'm honestly not sure how I would have known to find this. Quote:
To be clear, I am a big fan of the fact that this design incentivizes spreading OMs instead of just dumping them. However, it then works against its own mechanic by enforcing a fairly rigid order. I also find the interaction between the two powers, which will almost always both be in play on OM1, to be both excessively complex and not terribly thematic. (And when the wording is inevitably changed to prevent turn stacking, it will get even more complex.) Quote:
I can give some specifics here that are more in line with what you've done so far, if you like. I continue to believe things can be streamlined significantly from what you have here - not necessarily in terms of total word count on the card, but in terms of how intuitively the powers interact and in how rigid the OM placement is. I'll admit I don't really care much one way or another on this either, but I don't see how it complicates the wording very much at all. It's actually very easy to change, and saves you about as many words as it costs you. |
#208
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
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If I missed heavy support for the mini, I apologize. I posted them in one place, in Ollie's thread and, checking it now, there wasn't a huge outpouring of support. Yes, I did take it to the discord from there. Speaking of, there's a link in my signature. And absolutely, if you have any ideas for how to make the OMs feel less wooden in your opinion, feel free. I would encourage you to play a gamewith Clayton as he is. You might find he feels better than you'd think. |
#209
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
This is what I get for using discreet and fast-loading.
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#210
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
OOOF, well, that explains it!
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#211
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
In cases like this, I think it's useful to step back and draw a distinction between what theme we're trying to implement, what gameplay effects we are going for (either to implement that theme or otherwise), and what specific mechanics we are using to implement it.
Is that a fair characterization? Did I miss important theme/gameplay elements? |
#212
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
Yes, those seem to be the major ones. Can't think of much else. Besides perhaps, as a smaller point, we were trying to avoid "move/attack with 3 lawmen", as in a printed number of lawmen. That's something we could possibly change if we did come up with something better.
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#213
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
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#214
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
IF anyone wants to help Clayton, we're playtesting this version!
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#215
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
Also, a tweak we’re thinking about to help concerns about him being an OM dump - allowing him to participate in Shootout but not start one. Please test that tweak if you can!
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#216
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Re: PK's customs MK. III - 12/11 - LEAD VENGEANCE 2
New version of Clayton. Completely new version of Posse and a slightly edited Shootout. |
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