Justice League Design Thread (Heroes)

[Arkham]

Originally Posted by Karat

I actually think I prefer the personality direction...I find it refreshing

But would you support the all class versions? As Bats as helped point out some issues with certain personalities.

[SirGalahad]

Originally Posted by Aggressive Sock

@TrollBrute @johnny139 @Viegon @Karat @SirGalahad

Hopefully this is the last one Heroes, as we finally found something we are all excited about, and we need your vote on whether you would support this direction:

Changes:
-Streamlined text and wording, dropped elements that made it cluttered or confusing, overall 3-5 lines less on each card.
-Features open synergy, with Marker Burns eligible for any Unique Hero.
-Markers are only placed on the "hub" figures, rather than other figure's cards.
-You receive 1 marker per Unique Hero with one of the listed classes, thus strongly encouraging thematic armies.
-Martian Manhunter's d20 boost has a class restricted +3 instead of the normal +1 offered to anyone, in order to avoid trouble builds.

Martian Manhunter:

Spoiler Alert!

JUSTICE LEAGUE UNLIMITED
At the start of the game, place 1 Justice League marker on this card for each Unique Hero you control with the class of Archer, King, Magician, or Vigilante.

TELEPATHIC MIND LINK
An opponent may never take control of Martian Manhunter or any figure you control within X spaces of Martian Manhunter, where X equals the number of Justice League markers on army cards you control. All figures you control are considered within clear sight of each other. Once per turn, after a Unique Hero you control rolls the 20-sided die, you may remove 1 Justice League marker from this card to add 1 to that roll, or 3 to that roll if the figure has the Determined, Precise, Tricky, or Valiant personality.

DENSITY CONTROL
Martian Manhunter can move through all figures and obstacles such as ruins, and is never attacked when leaving an engagement. Martian Manhunter cannot be targeted by opponents' non-adjacent figures for any attacks or for any opponents' special powers that require clear sight. Martian Manhunter may not be moved by any special power on an opponent's Army Card.

Batman:

Spoiler Alert!

THE BRAVE AND THE BOLD
At the start of the game, place 1 Justice League marker on this card for each Unique Hero you control with the class of Archer, Officer, Scientist, or Warrior.

TACTICAL STRATEGIST
When a figure you control is destroyed, you may immediately remove any unrevealed Order Markers and place them on any other card you control, and place any Justice League markers from the destroyed figures card, and place them on any other Army Card you control that has a Justice League marker. Once per turn, before a figure you control rolls attack dice, you may remove 1 Justice League marker from this card, and the defending figure must subtract 2 from its defense.

MASTER MARTIAL ARTIST
When attacking an opponent's adjacent figure with a normal attack, add one automatic skull to whatever is rolled. When defending against a normal attack from an adjacent figure, add one automatic shield to whatever is rolled, and all excess shields count as unblockable hits on the attacking figure.

Cyborg:

Spoiler Alert!

TECHNO-SCIENCE DIVISION
At the start of the game, place 1 Justice League marker on this card for each Unique Hero you control with the class of Protector or Scientist.

BOOM TUBE TRANSPORT
At the start of the round, if Cyborg is in your start zone, you may choose to place a Glyph of Boom Tube power-side up on an empty space in your start zone. At the end of the round, you may move up to X figures in your start zone, where X equals the number of Justice League markers on this card, up to 3 spaces each. Remove the Glyph of Boom Tube from the battlefield.

CYBERNETIC ENGINEERING
At the end of a round, Cyborg and all Android Protector Heroes you control may remove 1 Wound Marker from that figure's card. Once per round, after using Cybernetic Engineering, you may remove 1 Justice League marker from this card to remove 1 additional Wound Marker from this card, and the card of all Android Protector Heroes you control.

Superman:

Spoiler Alert!

JLA TRINITY
At the start of the game, place 1 Justice League marker on this card for each Unique Hero with the class of Champion, Warrior, or Vigilante.

SYMBOL OF JUSTICE
Add 1 to your initiative roll for each Justice League marker on army cards you control. Once per turn, before a figure you control rolls defense dice against a normal attack, you may choose a figure you control that is adjacent to the defending figure, remove 1 Justice League marker from this card, and roll defense and take any resulting wounds from that attack with the chosen figure.

HEROIC RESCUE
If Superman passes over a friendly figure while moving, after moving Superman you may place that figure on any empty space adjacent to Superman. A friendly figure moved by Heroic Carry will not take any leaving engagement attacks.

MAN OF STEEL
When rolling defense against a normal attack from a figure that is not a Kryptonian, all blanks rolled count as extra shields.

A possible alternative for Martian Manhunter would see him take on Personalities as his means of adding markers to his card, as Martian Manhunter is entrenched and fascinated by the study of the different personalities and emotions of people on Earth. So to play up on that, he could call out to Personalities instead, and those could include:

JUSTICE LEAGUE UNLIMITED
At the start of the game, place 1 Justice League marker on this card for each Unique Hero you control with the personality of Precise, Tricky, or Valiant.

The question would be, would 1 person in the synergy playing off of personalities in order to add markers to their card, make or break this overall synergy/direction for you? What would you prefer, and would you support either?

Thank you for your time.

As this is a completely new direction from what we've done in the past, I would prefer to keep it as internally consistent as possible. Leave it with classes.

There are several minor issues and edits that will need to be addressed (color of the markers, for example)--but we'll get to those in due time.

I'm glad you've come down to more streamlined versions. Some of those first drafts were more than a mouthful.

[Arkham]

I'll take that as our 3rd Hero supporting this direction, with possibly Karat as well. So we can close this down and finally move forward with a direction. Thanks for chiming in everyone.

[Karat]

I can live with it.

[Arkham]

Originally Posted by Karat

I can live with it.

Well, living with it is better than hating it I suppose. Hopefully once everything is fleshed out in design it becomes a "I like it".

[Karat]

Originally Posted by Aggressive Sock

Well, living with it is better than hating it I suppose. Hopefully once everything is fleshed out in design it becomes a "I like it".

Well I don't not like it I just think the personality approach was more ingenuitive which is something I appreciate

[Arkham]

Originally Posted by Karat

Well I don't not like it I just think the personality approach was more ingenuitive which is something I appreciate

I'd agree with you, if there wasn't so many darn shared personalities with so many unthematic figures, or figures with better bonuses to gain from the powers that'll potentially receive more play because of them. Tricky, Disciplined, Fearless, and Determined being the worst offenders for having some dangerous options to open up to that +3. So it's unfortunately just not feasible.

[IAmBatman]

Personalities would've been fun, but would've made the default armies problematic thematically and competitively both.

[Dysole]

Originally Posted by IAmBatman

Personalities would've been fun, but would've made the default armies problematic thematically and competitively both.

I have my doubts it would have been broken (on an initial run through I found only two I was concerned about but not in the "OH NOES IT'S BROKEN" type of concern) but I can definitely make an argument that the thematic options were mostly inferior to other options (although Blue Beetle would've loved that boost)

~Dysole, balanced

[IAmBatman]

Sure, I definitely didn't mean "broken" for a competitive concern, just that it brought in a lot of figures we'd have to watch carefully on the competitive spectrum that didn't have the added benefit of being good thematic matches. I'd hate for the ultimate price of Martian Manhunter to be highly governed by non-thematic builds.

But ... we're headed in a direction I like, so no reason for me to blather on.