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C3G Legacy Archive of all the original discussions and workshops from the first stage of C3G.

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  #169  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:22 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

Okay. I'll try to put it up later today then. I just like to try to make everyone happy if possible.
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  #170  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:25 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

I mean are we or are we not updating cards? Sounded like our ruling was no updates and telling people to figure out if there was additional context which is not a good ruling. I think any edits should be included in the proposal here.
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  #171  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:25 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

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Originally Posted by Lord Pyre View Post
Okay. I'll try to put it up later today then. I just like to try to make everyone happy if possible.
I think it's well-documented that Tickle lives in a post-happiness state.

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #172  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:29 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

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Originally Posted by tcglkn View Post
I mean are we or are we not updating cards? Sounded like our ruling was no updates and telling people to figure out if there was additional context which is not a good ruling. I think any edits should be included in the proposal here.
Edits should be included in a proposal to Heroes. Based on our primary researcher's comments (MrNobody) sounds like they would be needed.

I didn't include them here and that wasn't the stated basis of your vote.

I also didn't say no updates within the proposal itself, which is what we were voting on. I certainly never said anything about telling people to figure it out in the proposal. That was your interpretation, which I responded to with an explanation more than once. You've chosen to ignore that explanation, which is your right. I'm not seeing that as any reason to hold up progress.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #173  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:36 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

I said the proposal was unclear what the goal was, it's not the most clear ruling and without any suggested edits included it makes it seem like you were saying to figure it out. I just think that especially when we are discussing something that has been a point of confusion (which is most of what we will be discussing here), then we should be extra clear in our proposals what the impacts and changes need to be. The way you proposed it definitely made it seem like it was a no change type of proposal. What we propose here should match what goes before the Heroes. Cause it definitely seems like quozl was only voting in favor of no changes and may have thought that was what you were suggesting with your most recent proposal.

LP's previous proposal was a good example of this, it was very clear which cards were going to be impacted and which ones needed changing.
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  #174  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:42 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

If you ever have questions about what a proposal means, definitely feel free to ask, and I'm sure folks will be happy to answer. You went straight to voting nay instead of asking anything, which is fine. I clarified anyway. I certainly worded the proposal as clearly as I could.

When I proposed it, I went off of my understanding of the research that Nobody compiled, which everyone else here has access to. I chose not to dig into it super closely when making the proposal, but read the summary instead. You chose not to dig into it super closely either, which is your right. Nobody specified later that he felt that this would result in the need for some updates, which is fine. It doesn't change the proposal any and it doesn't change my vote any.

If this revelation makes @quozl want to change his vote, then he should probably make a new proposal changing this one. As it is, this proposal passed.

If you want needed updates to be a requirement for us to make proposals for rulings in this thread, that's fine. You can propose that.

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DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #175  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:54 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

Ok I probably should have asked for clarification instead of voting nay, but you don't see a problem with the fact that two people could think different things about your proposal than you intended? That's the real issue here. I don't think your proposal clearly communicated your intent and I think we should be extra explicit here in the future when making proposals since the purpose of this team is to eliminate confusion.
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  #176  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:54 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

fwiw if it's important for folks to specify here which cards we want to suggest should be updated based on this ruling (which is just a suggested ruling, after all) I'm happy to vote on it. Seems like a pretty cut and dry thing to research, though, which I feel the Heroes can do without our direct involvement.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #177  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:57 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

What is the point of this team if the Heroes have to do the research anyways? Might as well just let the Heroes manage things. I thought the point here was to make it easier for the Heroes to digest the choices that needed to happen because there's already a lot on the plate for Heroes to keep up with?
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  #178  
Old January 28th, 2022, 09:59 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

Quote:
Originally Posted by tcglkn View Post
Ok I probably should have asked for clarification instead of voting nay, but you don't see a problem with the fact that two people could think different things about your proposal than you intended? That's the real issue here. I don't think your proposal clearly communicated your intent and I think we should be extra explicit here in the future when making proposals since the purpose of this team is to eliminate confusion.
It's completely clear to me. The intent is to clarify what start of the round means and that's what the proposal does.

I'm not a mind reader. I do see it as a problem that if folks don't feel it's clear they don't communicate that effectively, yes.

What you expressed in your vote was a misreading of what I wrote. I did my best to reply with a clarification. I'm unclear what other actions you wanted me to take to eliminate confusion.

I never used the words "figure it out" for the end user.

The proposal specifically says that the cards will clarify timing within the start of the round or if they don't then it means before Order Markers are placed.

We all know what clarified timing looks like and what unclear timing looks like.

Obviously some current cards will read as contradictory under this ruling. I didn't initially think that was the case when I made the proposal, that's true. My understanding changed. My focus in the proposal wasn't what updates would be needed or not, though, and nothing in the proposal says no updates or says yes updates. That's not what we were directly voting on. Anyone who was voting had the same access to the same research as I did to make up their own minds about updating fallout.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #179  
Old January 28th, 2022, 10:01 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

Quote:
Originally Posted by tcglkn View Post
What is the point of this team if the Heroes have to do the research anyways? Might as well just let the Heroes manage things. I thought the point here was to make it easier for the Heroes to digest the choices that needed to happen because there's already a lot on the plate for Heroes to keep up with?
MrNobody did the research. I suggested that the research should be part of the proposal to the Heroes. Three Heroes are part of this group and clearly feel up for the research component. I'm not saying the research needs to be done after the proposal to the Heroes or on the back end. I'm saying I don't personally feel the need for this group to vote on the research and the decisions should be fairly cut and dry based upon the agreed upon definition of start of round.

To me the point of this group is to get things done that weren't being done by the Heroes.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

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  #180  
Old January 28th, 2022, 10:04 AM
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Re: Rules Team HQ

I think adding the updates needed to our proposals here just so we're on the same page is a good practice. This is still new and we're all still getting used to things. Not a big deal. The main point is, we're making some awesome progress on lingering issues. If we want to revote here so we're on the same page, totally fine by me, easy option. Might want to wait for Quozl either way to make sure there was no misunderstanding!
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