The Book of Maxima

[Tornado]

Highest Attack number is modified Attack or what is listed on the card?

[quozl]

Instead of that, why not go for something simpler, like give a bonus to Maxima for attacking anyone within 8 clear sight spaces of her "mate"?

It would also have the side effect of breaking up clusters.

[johnny139]

Originally Posted by Zettian Juggernaut

I like it, here's another stab at the wording:

The only difference that sticks out here is that your version doesn't allow her to change if, say, her Mate loses Super Strength - she should be able to switch if her Mate is destroyed OR depowered, or if someone else becomes permanently stronger.

Originally Posted by Tornado

Highest Attack number is modified Attack or what is listed on the card?

Attack number specifically. For example, Nega-Bands would affect things, Shrink Ray would not. It's a bit finicky, I admit, but the cards specify either way and I think it's interesting new ground to work with.

Originally Posted by quozl

Instead of that, why not go for something simpler, like give a bonus to Maxima for attacking anyone within 8 clear sight spaces of her "mate"?

It would also have the side effect of breaking up clusters.

Most of the time Maxima is punching the hell out of her Mate, and occasionally she's helping him - so any power would have to let her get equal value from choosing an ally or enemy and be focused on them specifically.

[Tornado]

OK, cool. Just wanted to be clear.
So powers that specifically call out Attack number count(that includes Hulk?) but boosts like high ground would not?

I like the idea, theme and mechanics.
Does she stick with one mate for awhile(in the comics) or if a new beefcake shows up is she quick to switch?

[Viegon]

I don't think creating a difference between stat number and dice rolled here is a good idea. We've used the two terms very interchangeably with no intent of them being different mechanically or thematically. Seems like we'd get ourselves into very messy and unintuitive situations.

Instead of calling out Attack number directly, what if we just encouraged players to pick the biggest guy on the board? For example, drop Melee Strength for a power that boosts her attack up to equal with her Mate's?

[johnny139]

Originally Posted by Tornado

OK, cool. Just wanted to be clear.
So powers that specifically call out Attack number count(that includes Hulk?) but boosts like high ground would not?

Exactly. "Rolls additional dice" is a no, "adds X to Attack number" is a yes.

I like the idea, theme and mechanics.
Does she stick with one mate for awhile(in the comics) or if a new beefcake shows up is she quick to switch?

She's generally fixated on Superman, but when she was with the Justice League she went through a few different guys like Captain Atom. She also submits to supervillains with unfortunate regularity.

My favorite is in her Superman the Animated Series episode, where she finally decides to let Superman go at the very end, wistfully remarks on how amazing he is... and then Lobo crashes in out of nowhere and she immediately forgets all about Superman.

Originally Posted by Viegon

I don't think creating a difference between stat number and dice rolled here is a good idea. We've used the two terms very interchangeably with no intent of them being different mechanically or thematically. Seems like we'd get ourselves into very messy and unintuitive situations.

Instead of calling out Attack number directly, what if we just encouraged players to pick the biggest guy on the board? For example, drop Melee Strength for a power that boosts her attack up to equal with her Mate's?

I think the potential messiness is worth the trade, as she's relatively simple otherwise. We could specify written Attack number but that would prevent some fun moments.

[quozl]

Originally Posted by johnny139

Most of the time Maxima is punching the hell out of her Mate, and occasionally she's helping him - so any power would have to let her get equal value from choosing an ally or enemy and be focused on them specifically.

Yeah, I've got a mixture of Knockout's Smitten and Yellowjacket's Unhealthy Obsession and Echo's Mimic going on.

SEEKING A MATE
At the start of each round, if Maxima has no Mate on the battlefield, choose a Unique Hero with the Super Strength special power to be Maxima's Mate. Maxima may use the Attack number of her Mate in place of her own while she is within 8 clear sight spaces of her Mate.

[Viegon]

Originally Posted by johnny139

I think the potential messiness is worth the trade, as she's relatively simple otherwise. We could specify written Attack number but that would prevent some fun moments.

The problem is not that it'll make her too complex of a design, but that it will create a mess of odd rulings and unthematic situations.

For example, "add # to this figure's Attack number" counts and "roll # additional attack dice" doesn't, but what about the "add 1 extra die to this figure's attack" wording used in Tactician? What about "add one die to this figure's normal attack" used in powers such as Genis-Vell's and Creeper's Insanity powers? What about Darkseid who hits both with "subtract 1 die from their normal Attack number"?

Thematically, why does the C3G Hulk's Rage have an effect but the Hasbro Hulk's doesn't? Why does a Green Lantern's batteries have an effect but Groot's Cut Down to Size doesn't? Why does Apocalypse's boost count but not Allen the Alien's? Why do Dazzler's markers count for subtraction but not Atom's Molecular Irritant?

It forces players to have to analyze the power text of other units to figure out what does and doesn't count, and leads to lots of unthematic and unintuitive situations.

SEEKING A MATE
At the start of each round, if Maxima has no Mate on the battlefield, choose a Unique Hero with the Super Strength special power to be Maxima's Mate. Maxima may use the Attack number of her Mate in place of her own while she is within 8 clear sight spaces of her Mate.

I like something more like this, but to avoid the above issue it should use Echo's wording for specifically referencing the stat number on the Mate's card.

[johnny139]

I find the difference between "Attack number" and "attack" very intuitive - it's something I've always been aware of in Heroscape. I'll admit I'm likely a minority there, and the barrier for understanding may be higher than I assume.

Not a big fan of the Attack mimicking if only because, well, she's not mimicking or copying or even matching her object of affection. She'll be at 100% whether Superman is hanging around or not. I get the idea of the power but I don't think the mechanics match it.

[japes]

Originally Posted by johnny139

Not a big fan of the Attack mimicking if only because, well, she's not mimicking or copying or even matching her object of affection. She'll be at 100% whether Superman is hanging around or not. I get the idea of the power but I don't think the mechanics match it.

I agree here. It's not thematic for her to be stronger or weaker depending on her crush at the time.

[Viegon]

Originally Posted by johnny139

I find the difference between "Attack number" and "attack" very intuitive - it's something I've always been aware of in Heroscape. I'll admit I'm likely a minority there, and the barrier for understanding may be higher than I assume.

If it had been something C3G was conscious of from the beginning and that we had carefully worded each power with this intent in mind, then I'd totally be behind it because I do think it's interesting territory to explore. But as-is, with 6+ different ways of saying "add or subtract from this stat", it's just not clear and would lead to being a design that's not playable without a bunch of FAQs, and would lead to tons of unthematic situations (and considering that it's a theme-focused power, that seems to defeat the purpose to me).

Originally Posted by johnny139

Not a big fan of the Attack mimicking if only because, well, she's not mimicking or copying or even matching her object of affection. She'll be at 100% whether Superman is hanging around or not. I get the idea of the power but I don't think the mechanics match it.

Fair enough, I don't want to mess-up the theme. In that case, I support the current version but with the Echo clarification added in (specifically triggering on the stat listed on the card).

[johnny139]

Okay, here's a new attempt at wording Seeking a Mate to specify that it's the number on the card and consolidate things a bit. Does it work? Too confusing?

Also, do we need to specify that she takes LEAs? I had it, ZJ cut it, I put it back here because my gut says we usually specify but I honestly don't know.

SEEKING A MATE
At the start of the round, if Maxima does not have a Mate, you must choose a figure with the Super Strength special power that has the highest Attack number on its card among Unique Heroes on the battlefield. After a player takes a turn with Maxima's Mate, you must immediately move Maxima as close to that figure as possible, moving up to 7 spaces. When moving with Seeking a Mate, Maxima will take any leaving engagement attacks.