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Old June 15th, 2009, 03:08 PM
Just_a_Bill's Avatar
Just_a_Bill Just_a_Bill is offline
 
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Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs (army card p2)

Since the wave 9 previews I've been thinking about what kind of custom would be good to help the poor beleaguered Deathwalkers & Zettians, and when I saw the new Terminator Salvation slurpee-straw-toys in my local 7-11 I spotted one that I thought looked just perfect for an Utgar Soulborg theme:



This is the "mototerminator" and it's basically a self-driving motorcycle with a cyborg brain. Perfect for a transport unit in Heroscape, since all units require some kind of sentience. They are $1.89 apiece at 7-11, made of semiflexible Heroscapesque plastic, and fit almost perfectly on a Mimring or Grimnak double base. (They are not even mounted to the base shown in these pictures, and thus make a trivially easy mod.)

So I'd like to collect some gameplay feedback on my mod. I'm looking for help with costing and game balance; I do not need any wordsmithing at this stage. I would consider it a great personal kindness if you would read the proposal and the design notes before responding.

Objectives:
  • Help the Deathwalkers, Zettians, and Warden 816.
  • Avoid making a unit that is really good without at least some of the above.
  • Avoid helping the Deathreavers.
  • Use a relatively cheap source sculpt.
  • Make a cool unit.
Abandoned objectives:
  • Help the Deathstalkers if thematically appropriate (it wasn't).
So here's the work in progress:
DEATHCYCLE
UTGAR

SOULBORG
UNIQUE SQUAD [3]
TRANSPORTS
RELENTLESS
MEDIUM 3
"Relentless" is not a perfect theme fit, but perhaps may slightly help Khosumet.
LIFE 1
MOVE 8
RANGE 1
ATTACK 1
DEFENSE 4
POINTS ???
I intentionally want this thing to have a sucky normal adjacent attack (it's just a sideswipe, after all). The special attack below is the real powerhouse (and even that is deliberately limited). Not really sure on the Defense. Haven't done any kind of analysis on the point cost yet, but I want them to be as affordable as possible, since this is a "magic bullet" intended to help several other units. I'm trying to think Isamuish thoughts: cheap but chancy as an offensive unit.
UTGAR UNIQUE SOULBORG TRANSPORT
Before or during a Deathcycle’s movement, choose
an adjacent, friendly, unique Soulborg who follows
Utgar. After you move that Deathcycle, place the
chosen figure adjacent to that Deathcycle. Instead
of attacking normally with that Deathcycle, you may
choose to move or attack with the chosen figure.
Yeah, I'm saying "Deathcycle" too many times. Yeah, that's how Heroscape cards are written. I'll be re-vetting the wording conventions after the functions are locked in.

Instead of (or in addition to) "unique", I'm tempted to say "two-legged". This would make sure that future animal-shaped Utgar Soulborgs can't ride motorbikes, but it just seems clumsy. I'm hoping "unique" will be good enough.

Inspired by wave 9, I was also trying to implement "bonding that isn't bonding". Granted, both the bike and the rider can never attack in the same turn, but they can both move (and the rider can essentially move twice).

I'm torn between making this a unique squad and a common hero. Unique squad provides control over the maximum number of Deathcycles that a player can bring to bear (and I like my customs to be unique due to the cost/difficulty in producing them) — but common hero limits the number of moves you get from a single order marker. Moving all three of my Deathwalkers on the same order marker is pretty scary ... but then again I am trying to make them scary in my house again.
FIXED GUN SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 8. Attack 5.
Choose a figure to attack that is on a space in a
straight line from Deathcycle’s front or rear.
Deathcycle can attack up to 2 times with Fixed Gun
Special Attack as long as one targeted figure is in
front of Deathcycle and the other is behind.
The idea here is that the guns are mounted to the frame; so you have to point your entire cyborg-cycle self at the target. There are guns front and back, so this unit is similar to Mimring's Fire Line SA, but can only fire along one axis. I want this attack to be scary to the opponent, but tricky to set up; so he can hide from it with some work on his part, but when I outmaneuver him (or he forgets) then it could be a painful lesson. The built-in limited Double Shot was more for theme and fun than any real gameplay need.
DISENGAGE
Deathcycle and any figure it is transporting are
never attacked when leaving an engagement.
This unit has too many specials; no question about that. Sonya is the only unit with four, and this monstrosity currently has five. You'd think Disengage would be a good one to cut, but doing so would actually lengthen the card because the other specials would then need clarification one way or the other. (Its was surprising how much other game text I was able to cut when I finally gave in and added Disengage.)

I think I need an adjective here, like DOUBLE DISENGAGE or CONFERRED DISENGAGE, or something. Those both suck, of course, but this is more than just the usual Disengage and thus cannot use the exact same title. Perhaps JOINT DISENGAGE?
JUMP
When Deathcycle is moving across or down from
one space to another, ignore the elevations of
spaces in between if they are below the space
jumped from. Deathcycle may jump over water
without stopping, and may jump over figures and
obstacles such as ruins if their height is below the
space jumped from. Deathcycle may not jump
more than 12 levels down in a single jump without
risking falling damage.
The idea here is kind of a "Super Leap but only across or down". This is not needed for gameplay, but how on earth can you render a motorcycle and not let it jump over creeks and ditches? Well, I guess it is needed for gameplay somewhat, because this is sort of like CLIMB X4 (but only works in the down direction). This one is a tricky compromise between text length and understandability; I hope it's clear how it works.
DEATHSHIELD
When a unique Soulborg who follows Utgar
receives one or more wounds, you may sacrifice an
adjacent Deathcycle you control to block all
damage. That Deathcycle is destroyed.
This is pretty much the must-have effect: make Deathwalkers harder to kill. It doesn't have to take this form, but I think if my unit doesn't confer some kind of survivability bonus on 7000/8000/9000, then it has failed. I'm still looking for a better title for this one.


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Last edited by Just_a_Bill; July 8th, 2009 at 09:50 PM.
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  #2  
Old June 15th, 2009, 04:19 PM
Relenzo2 Relenzo2 is offline
 
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

If it's going to be a hero, you DEFINATELY need more defense. A squad is probably better, and I don't think the Jump ability is necessary. It will help make room for the other abilities.
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  #3  
Old June 15th, 2009, 11:24 PM
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Sherman Davies Sherman Davies is offline
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

A laudable project and goal, Bill.

You mentioned that this monstrosity has five powers. They're all intriguing, but if you're looking to cut one, my vote goes to Jump. The others seem more essential to your goal of improving the Deathwalkers' viability. I also vote to make them a unique squad, partly because the game can use a few more of those and partly because it would make it easier on those who'd like to use your custom card to buy the figs.

Are these cycles big enough in scale to look like they'd plausibly carry DWK9000? That's a BIG motorcycle.
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  #4  
Old June 15th, 2009, 11:53 PM
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ParaGoomba Slayer ParaGoomba Slayer is offline
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

Could you take a picture of one of those next to all the Utgar Soulborgs?

I'll have to pick some of those up ASAP.

Circumcision? HIS body, HIS decision. A person should have the right to their own body. "Sometimes you're right but you're always an asshole." - Anonymous neg rep
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  #5  
Old June 16th, 2009, 12:14 AM
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1moreheroscaper 1moreheroscaper is offline
 
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

I really like your thoughts here about helping out the DeathWalkers and the Zettians. I also like the cool find.
My response to the squad or common hero question. I really like the idea of 2 or more of these things moving at a time, but to keep the precedent of each figure in a squad being different, I think I like the common hero idea best. Unique is not a bad idea, but it seems to limit the unit, and the DeathWalkers are limited already.
As for the special abilities, I think Disengage and Death Shield are a must, but I agree that Jump may not be needed. I was also thinking that combining/altering the Fixed Gun Special Attack and the Utgar Unique Soulborg Transport might be easier if you combined it into a Cover Fire kind of special ability. If the unit ends up being a common hero, still allow two attacks, but maybe allow a Unique Soulborg that follows Utgar to move up to X spaces if you inflict a wound from an attack etc...
Maybe: SUPPORT FIRE SPECIAL ATTACK
Range 8. Attack 5.
Choose a figure to attack that is on a space in a
straight line from Deathcycle’s front or rear.
Deathcycle can attack up to 2 times with Support Fire
Special Attack as long as one targeted figure is in
front of Deathcycle and the other is behind. After each attack, you may move one unique soulborg that follows Utgar, you control, within X clear sight spaces of the Deathcycle that attacked this turn, if they Deathcycle inflicted any wounds.
I know that combined special is a wordy, but it's a rough idea/suggestion. Again, I like the idea you have here.

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  #6  
Old June 16th, 2009, 12:23 AM
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ParaGoomba Slayer ParaGoomba Slayer is offline
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

I think instead of being transports, they should be Scouts with an aura that reduces the defense of enemy units in range when being attacked by an Utgar Soulborg.

Basically a negative Raelin that reduces the defense of the enemy by 2, but the defense reduction only applies when the affected figures are rolling defense dice against an Utgar Soulborg. That way it helps all the Utgar Soulborgs, but since the Deathreavers only have 1 attack it wouldn't help them as much.

Make them a unique squad of 3, and give them a defense of 5.

Circumcision? HIS body, HIS decision. A person should have the right to their own body. "Sometimes you're right but you're always an asshole." - Anonymous neg rep

Last edited by ParaGoomba Slayer; June 16th, 2009 at 01:13 PM.
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  #7  
Old June 16th, 2009, 01:08 PM
Just_a_Bill's Avatar
Just_a_Bill Just_a_Bill is offline
 
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

Thanks for the feedback everyone. It certainly sounds like cutting Jump is the way to go. (It's funny how sometimes we need other people to nudge us into doing what we already "knew", consciously or otherwise, we needed to do.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ParaGoomba Slayer View Post
Could you take a picture of one of those next to all the Utgar Soulborgs?
I'll try to do that after I get home tonight, but for the time being here's a quick Photoshop hack with DW8K to give you a very rough idea.



Quote:
Originally Posted by 1moreheroscaper View Post
I really like the idea of 2 or more of these things moving at a time, but to keep the precedent of each figure in a squad being different, I think I like the common hero idea best.
I thought of that, too. If I end up going with the squad, I plan to mount one leaning/turning to the left, another leaning/turning to the right, and the third popping a little wheelie.

Quote:
I was also thinking that combining/altering the Fixed Gun Special Attack and the Utgar Unique Soulborg Transport might be easier if you combined it into a Cover Fire kind of special ability. ... Maybe: SUPPORT FIRE SPECIAL ATTACK ...
That's a pretty interesting idea, but remember the concept that this thing is not supposed to inflict wounds terribly often ... making the Deathwalker free move a somewhat rare occurrence.


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  #8  
Old June 16th, 2009, 03:55 PM
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

After seeing the comparison shot of the the Deathcycle and DW8000, I think your carry-type special ability would be fine--I can see a Deathwalker getting on the cycle.

Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.

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  #9  
Old June 16th, 2009, 07:53 PM
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ParaGoomba Slayer ParaGoomba Slayer is offline
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

They're basically the same size as a Deathstalker. They come packaged with a plastic slurpee straw and a nice little stand that will serve as a base until I get more spare double hexes.

In comparison to the other Utgar Soulborgs:






Circumcision? HIS body, HIS decision. A person should have the right to their own body. "Sometimes you're right but you're always an asshole." - Anonymous neg rep

Last edited by ParaGoomba Slayer; June 17th, 2009 at 05:24 AM.
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Old June 16th, 2009, 08:38 PM
Marro Warrior Marro Warrior is offline
 
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1moreheroscaper
I really like the idea of 2 or more of these things moving at a time, but to keep the precedent of each figure in a squad being different, I think I like the common hero idea best.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_a_Bill
I thought of that, too. If I end up going with the squad, I plan to mount one leaning/turning to the left, another leaning/turning to the right, and the third popping a little wheelie.
I like this idea.
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  #11  
Old June 17th, 2009, 01:38 PM
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

These are cool!!

I live across the street from 7-11. I need to get me some
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  #12  
Old June 17th, 2009, 10:55 PM
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ParaGoomba Slayer ParaGoomba Slayer is offline
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Re: Just_a_Bill's Deathwalker helper customs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skeletor View Post
I live across the street from 7-11. I need to get me some
Everybody lives across the street from a 7/11.

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