The Book of Casual Rule: Knockback

[wriggz]

Originally Posted by Aggressive Sock

Thematically it makes sense to not stop directly in water when being knocked back, because of the force behind it.

Also, no it wouldn't cancel out the no falling damage rule, because it specifically states "except when it would wound or destroy the figure". But thematically, landing in water from knock back would still break the fall, thus no falling damage.

See I was reading it very literally. Like Lava can wound a figure while water stops a figure from being wounded.

However, if there is ever an "official" healing pool, then by the same logic the figure would heal as it move over the pool by knockback.

Water is weird.

[Arkham]

Originally Posted by wriggz

See I was reading it very literally. Like Lava can wound a figure while water stops a figure from being wounded.

However, if there is ever an "official" healing pool, then by the same logic the figure would heal as it move over the pool by knockback.

Water is weird.

It wouldn't heal the figure by those rules. You ignore the terrain unless it wounds or destroys the figure. Healing doesn't fall under either of those, quite the opposite.

[Karat]

Also the healing would probably be worded like this: "If a figure ends its movement on a water space..."

[wriggz]

Originally Posted by Aggressive Sock

It wouldn't heal the figure by those rules. You ignore the terrain unless it wounds or destroys the figure. Healing doesn't fall under either of those, quite the opposite.

Then I'm back to thinking that "falling" into water would take falling damage, since the water has a special terrain rule that "stops" the falling damage from occuring.

[Tornado]

This was just discussed a couple pages back. I think this sums it up.

Originally Posted by Karat

The ruling is it stops your movement, so if it preemptively ends your KB movement you roll for KB damage.

[wriggz]

Fair enough,

However, it is often difficult to know when a "ruling" is an opinion, or if it is "official". I fully realize I can decide for myself, but seeing as there was extensive playtests done to create the rule set, not to mention playtests to balance superhero figures it is best to play as the designers intended.

That said, it may be worth getting someone to update the OP with clarification regarding water, since it seems to be (at least to me) counter to the wording in the rule book. Clarifying the Falling damage/Falling damage into water would be helpful too.

Q: Does a figure knocked back into water and has remaining knockback points, have to stop its movement and roll for knockback damage?
A: Yes, a single spaced figure moving onto one water tile, or a double spaced figure entering onto two water tiles must immediately stop its movement, and if it has remaining knockback points roll for knockback damage.

Q: Does a flying figure knocked back off sever height receive falling or severe falling damage?
A: Yes, a flying figure receives damage from falling unless otherwise stated in the rules.

Q: Does a figure knocked back off sever height onto a water space receive falling or severe falling damage?
A: No, the water prevents the figure from receiving falling damage, however the figure still roles for knockback damage if it has remaining Knockback points.

It is funny this does not come up more with some of the crazy buildings people put into use, or the amount of water put on maps. Infact in the example in the offical rules, Grundy is about to hit Hawkgirl into water.

[TrollBrute]

The rules state to " Determine falling damage after Knockback has been resolved.". This means that you play through the Knockback, determine any damage, and then resolve any possible falling damage afterward, using official falling rules. Knockback has no effect on falling damage.

This makes your second and third FAQs unnecessary (and the second one is incorrect, as the rules state that a flying figure does not have to roll for falling damage). However, the first FAQ is a useful one, and is the official ruling, so hopefully one of our helpful mods can add that to the OP for anyone else who might have the question.

[wriggz]

Originally Posted by TrollBrute

The rules state to " Determine falling damage after Knockback has been resolved.". This means that you play through the Knockback, determine any damage, and then resolve any possible falling damage afterward, using official falling rules. Knockback has no effect on falling damage.

This makes your second and third FAQs unnecessary (and the second one is incorrect, as the rules state that a flying figure does not have to roll for falling damage). However, the first FAQ is a useful one, and is the official ruling, so hopefully one of our helpful mods can add that to the OP for anyone else who might have the question.

I'm not sure my second point is invalid, or even if it is incorrect. As you state, the rules say to resolve the falling damage after the knockback is complete. However, the fall occurred during the knockback, not after it, and thus the Flying power was negated during the fall.

So a figure may have 2 Knockback points. The first sends it over the cliff the second moves it one space further away. The fall occurred before the Knockback movement was completed so you should roll for falling damage, after the Knockback has been resolved if you go by the strict language of the rules.

Honestly, I'm not sure which side I'm on, just that a definitive answer is preferable.

[Karat]

Originally Posted by wriggz

I'm not sure my second point is invalid, or even if it is incorrect. As you state, the rules say to resolve the falling damage after the knockback is complete. However, the fall occurred during the knockback, not after it, and thus the Flying power was negated during the fall.

So a figure may have 2 Knockback points. The first sends it over the cliff the second moves it one space further away. The fall occurred before the Knockback movement was completed so you should roll for falling damage, after the Knockback has been resolved if you go by the strict language of the rules.

Honestly, I'm not sure which side I'm on, just that a definitive answer is preferable.

The definitive answer is exactly what the rules say. Knockback gets resolved first, and then you resolve any potential falling damage. Yes, it might be a little unthematic, but mechanically it is sound. Sometimes, theme must be sacrificed for mechanical balance. You can however house rule it that you roll for falling damage whenever it occurs.

[wriggz]

Originally Posted by Griffin

Yep.

And just as a note, figures with Flying CAN take falling damage at any time unless a power specifically says that it cannot (Shurrak), because Flying is optional. So you could chose to NOT have your Raelin fly as she walks off of a cliff and falls for damage. This is especially useful when taking over a figure's mind temporarily.

Also this clearly outlines the Falling Damage. I think Grif would be the authority here.

[Hahma]

Flying figures have always been able to take falling damage unless otherwise stated on their card. Not sure why this is an issue. Whether the figure falls due to knockback or some kind of pushing type power/attack from the opponent's figure, it still works the same.

[Grishnakh]

Originally Posted by wriggz

It is funny this does not come up more with some of the crazy buildings people put into use...

I might just interject here that C3G has never endorsed the use of my buildings with their customs figures and rules. Their knock back rules have simply not been play tested with my custom terrain in mind. Therefore, if you are playing a strictly C3G game, I really do not think you can fairly apply C3G knock back rules if you use my custom structures. Or any of my interactive terrain feature rules for that matter.