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  #253  
Old February 15th, 2015, 03:27 PM
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

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Originally Posted by Typhon2222 View Post
I think Vallum is a perfect name.
I'm glad you approve. You were actually one of the two posters I thought of who might call me out on it.

If it came down to it, my ace-in-the-hole was going to be that Hadrian's Wall (which has significant stone features) was called Vallum Aelium.

117-87-0 (4/13/09-2/22/15)
32-16-0 (10/17/09-7/21/12)

Last edited by Killometer; February 15th, 2015 at 03:30 PM. Reason: Any guesses who the other was?
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  #254  
Old February 17th, 2015, 05:32 PM
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

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Originally Posted by Killometer View Post
I have to get this up before my eyes start to bleed from analyzing it anymore.

Vallum
requires 1 RotV
supports 1 random power glyph and 1 random treasure glyph
Slippery Devil! trap included in build instructions



top view:
Spoiler Alert!


Design ramblings:
Spoiler Alert!
I like the look of that map. Nice.

Your custom probably has too much Defense.

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  #255  
Old February 18th, 2015, 03:17 PM
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Thanks @capsocrates . If you get to give it a whirl I'd love to hear how it played.

117-87-0 (4/13/09-2/22/15)
32-16-0 (10/17/09-7/21/12)
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  #256  
Old February 18th, 2015, 04:28 PM
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Maklar the Silver Prince Maklar the Silver Prince is offline
 
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killometer View Post
Thanks @capsocrates . If you get to give it a whirl I'd love to hear how it played.
I'm not caps, but I have played on Vallum (just a couple times).

Firstly, I'd like to say that I like the hex footprint, and the aesthetics of the map when its built. It looks quite good, like a pair of stone platforms upon which building were once, but it has crumbled and deteriorated. However...

I don't really like the way the height works.

Firstly, I think its a bit too hard on range. Its an incredible hassle getting to height, getting to where you can shoot at people, and shooting at people from a range with height all at the same time. Truthfully, using ranged units (in my limited experience) and going for the hills was the exact same thing as playing melee units and going into the hills.

Secondly, I found absolutely no allure in going up the lower hill as opposed to the higher hill. This was the one scenario in which range was okay on the height. A "meh" ranged squad can dominate from the higher hill to the lower hill, due to angles of line of sight being a friendly, and you know, the obvious fact of height advantage.

The height appears interesting, but usually seemed to end up in a drawn out, muddled up, fist fight on the upper hill.

I hope this didn't seem mean, I absolutely love the fact that this map only used 1 RotV. But I guess I just didn't enjoy this map. Hope this is beneficial.

The beatings will continue until morale improves!

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  #257  
Old February 18th, 2015, 04:51 PM
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maklar the Silver Prince View Post
Truthfully, using ranged units (in my limited experience) and going for the hills was the exact same thing as playing melee units and going into the hills.
You say that like it's a bad thing.

Seriously, though, that's almost exactly what I was going for. It's hard to make a map using just 1 RotV and have it not end up a bloodbath as ranged units blasts down from height on melee units trying to advance to engage.

Quote:
Secondly, I found absolutely no allure in going up the lower hill as opposed to the higher hill. This was the one scenario in which range was okay on the height. A "meh" ranged squad can dominate from the higher hill to the lower hill, due to angles of line of sight being a friendly, and you know, the obvious fact of height advantage.

The height appears interesting, but usually seemed to end up in a drawn out, muddled up, fist fight on the upper hill.
The higher hill is definitely the more tempting of the two. In my vision the lower hill is a place to threaten the glyph, or to slightly more quickly move towards the opponent's side, while still giving up an advantage to the higher hill. Maybe a strong fixed glyph (and/or one that doesn't help campers-Valda springs to mind) would pull some attention downhill.

I also wonder if the trough between the hills is too rough on melee units that want to try to move from the lower hill to the higher hill. Maybe, considering how many figures can fit on the highest level. I may need to revisit the gap, or eliminate some of the level 4 spaces...

Quote:
I hope this didn't seem mean, I absolutely love the fact that this map only used 1 RotV. But I guess I just didn't enjoy this map. Hope this is beneficial.
Not mean at all. I appreciate the feedback and candor, and everything you've said is beneficial (even the stuff that's wrong ).

117-87-0 (4/13/09-2/22/15)
32-16-0 (10/17/09-7/21/12)

Last edited by Killometer; February 18th, 2015 at 04:54 PM. Reason: If I *really* wanted to be mean to ranged I could make the glyph Thorian. >:D
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  #258  
Old February 18th, 2015, 05:03 PM
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Maklar the Silver Prince Maklar the Silver Prince is offline
 
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killometer View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maklar the Silver Prince View Post
Secondly, I found absolutely no allure in going up the lower hill as opposed to the higher hill. This was the one scenario in which range was okay on the height. A "meh" ranged squad can dominate from the higher hill to the lower hill, due to angles of line of sight being a friendly, and you know, the obvious fact of height advantage.

The height appears interesting, but usually seemed to end up in a drawn out, muddled up, fist fight on the upper hill.
The higher hill is definitely the more tempting of the two. In my vision the lower hill is a place to threaten the glyph, or to slightly more quickly move towards the opponent's side, while still giving up an advantage to the higher hill. Maybe a strong fixed glyph (and/or one that doesn't help campers-Valda springs to mind) would pull some attention downhill.

I also wonder if the trough between the hills is too rough on melee units that want to try to move from the lower hill to the higher hill. Maybe, considering how many figures can fit on the highest level. I may need to revisit the gap, or eliminate some of the level 4 spaces...
I think Valda would definitely be a good step, but I'm still not sure if I would take that bait, though I think its more of my play style than something else. Perhaps if you put more more hexes into the lower hill and less in the higher hill? That could lead to the high hill real-estate becoming even more valuable though.

The trough did seem awfully rough on people, not just melee. Having that small divide there seemed to lead to an "after-you" aspect when playing armies that couldn't shoot across the tiny little gap.

Any who, I don't really think cutting down on the level 4 spaces is the answer. It just makes the area even more precious... ?

Yeah, I have really no experience with making maps.

The beatings will continue until morale improves!

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  #259  
Old February 18th, 2015, 05:22 PM
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Killometer Killometer is offline
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maklar the Silver Prince View Post
Any who, I don't really think cutting down on the level 4 spaces is the answer. It just makes the area even more precious...
It makes them more valuable, potentially making even more action occur at them, but it can make it more difficult to difficult to establish command over them. The more units that can fit on the highest level means that many more units to knock off to take control of it. Fewer spaces also makes you prioritize who you want there more. Imagine how much more careful you'd be about placement if you could only fit 3-4 figs on the top level compared to being able to jam in a squad and a half of Greenscales plus their dragonking plus Raelin plus...

Any please don't take all my contrarian jibber-jabber to mean I'm discounting your opinion (or that of anyone else who feels like chiming in). I really do appreciate the feedback.

117-87-0 (4/13/09-2/22/15)
32-16-0 (10/17/09-7/21/12)

Last edited by Killometer; February 18th, 2015 at 05:41 PM. Reason: ↓↓↓ Be careful about how much you stroke my ego, I might start to believe you. ;)
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  #260  
Old February 18th, 2015, 05:26 PM
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Maklar the Silver Prince Maklar the Silver Prince is offline
 
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killometer View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maklar the Silver Prince View Post
Any who, I don't really think cutting down on the level 4 spaces is the answer. It just makes the area even more precious...
It makes them more valuable, potentially making even more action occur at them, but it can make it more difficult to difficult to establish command over them. The more units that can fit on the highest level means that many more units to knock off to take control of it. Fewer spaces also makes you prioritize who you want there more. Imagine how much more careful you'd be about placement if you could only fit 3-4 figs on the top level compared to being able to jam in a squad and a half of Greenscales plus their dragonking plus Raelin plus...
So true, Jedi Master Killometer.

The beatings will continue until morale improves!

Maklar the Silver Prince's Customs

Last edited by Maklar the Silver Prince; February 18th, 2015 at 05:35 PM. Reason: Or maybe you would prefer to be Emperor of the World? :)
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  #261  
Old February 18th, 2015, 05:59 PM
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Using just one ROTV set, you don't have roads/wall walks or many LoS blockers to help out melee units, so I would say it's a good thing for the map layout to favor hand-to-hand combat.
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  #262  
Old February 19th, 2015, 11:37 PM
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraph View Post
Using just one ROTV set, you don't have roads/wall walks or many LoS blockers to help out melee units, so I would say it's a good thing for the map layout to favor hand-to-hand combat.
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  #263  
Old February 19th, 2015, 11:39 PM
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maklar the Silver Prince View Post
Firstly, I think its a bit too hard on range. Its an incredible hassle getting to height, getting to where you can shoot at people, and shooting at people from a range with height all at the same time. Truthfully, using ranged units (in my limited experience) and going for the hills was the exact same thing as playing melee units and going into the hills.
That's my cartographic dream! Oh gods of Valhalla, lend me your inspiration, that I may make a single-RotV map on which ranged dost tremble, and suffer.
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  #264  
Old February 20th, 2015, 09:13 PM
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Killometer Killometer is offline
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Re: Killometer's maps ~ Vallum (single RotV) added 2/2/15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Typhon2222 View Post
Oh gods of Valhalla, lend me your inspiration, that I may make a single-RotV map on which ranged dost tremble, and suffer.
That's really one of my two cartographic obsessions. Balanced full asymmetry being the other (more about that later...).

I'm working out a couple variations of Vallum with fewer level 4 spaces and/or merged hills, but they need a little more tweaking and testing before they're ready for the public eye. In the meantime I'm always interested in hearing more input on it as it stands-the more outside angles I can see it from the better.

117-87-0 (4/13/09-2/22/15)
32-16-0 (10/17/09-7/21/12)

Last edited by Killometer; February 20th, 2015 at 09:14 PM. Reason: ...but not too much later. ;)
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