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  #3193  
Old February 21st, 2019, 07:22 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

You seem to think that the +1/+1 for any dragon isn't enough of a reason to price her at 50 points just for that reason alone. Raising the bases stats of any dragon is a pretty big deal, especially when you can still bring Raelin along for even more defense. Her attack could be 0, or 4, and it wouldn't affect her price by more than 10 point in my mind, because her attack won't be the reason she's worth using. Her own defense is far more important, and I like that she is quite vulnerable when she's separated from the dragon, but that doesn't really matter, because unless you are dealing with Hops, Chainfighters, Warforged, or Wyverns, there will never be a reason that they wouldn't be within each other's stat boost range. She will need to be priced as though she will always be used with her best possible companion, which ever Dragon that is, because the stats boost is that good.

I view the way you currently have the movement mechanics as a good way of limiting her potential, because it means that if you want to keep the attack bonus, you can't move very far.
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  #3194  
Old February 21st, 2019, 08:15 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
You seem to think that the +1/+1 for any dragon isn't enough of a reason to price her at 50 points just for that reason alone.
Here are reports of some games where I've seen firsthand that it isn't.

I agree that her own attack has little bearing on her price, especially because these alterations to make her feel more active also make her weaker in some key ways as well. To my knowledge, the argument isn't over whether a usable attack makes her too powerful, but rather it's in line with the design and theme. Balance is another topic altogether that I don't expect people to believe me about without playing the unit.

Outside of units that can move opponents, which can really prey on her, she also struggles a lot against explosive Special Attacks (the temporary loss of positioning is often worth avoiding letting her and her dragon get attacked at once). In my testing, I've found Nilfheim to be the best companion (of course), but spending 240 points on him isn't usually worth the stat boost when you could build a better army instead.

Regardless, Nilfheim's one of the main reasons that I feel like she should be going down this route. All of these changes, with the exception of the movement boost (which will be adjusted if it tests as being too strong), benefit Nilfheim less than the other dragons. He'll already be using his base 6 normal attack (+1 for 7), so the possibility for getting an attack of up to 6 with Eltris is nearly worthless to him. On the other hand, dragons like Zelrig, Othkurik, Mimring, and Brimstone get a little bit more options, of which only Zelrig is a large concern (although the capability of Eltris getting in an extra die than him is, as mentioned, not too significant on her balance). Throw in the sizable risk of losing your turns by placing Order Markers on her instead of the dragon, and the Nilfheim combo is looking even worse than it was earlier in my testing, which I think is a good change.
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  #3195  
Old February 21st, 2019, 09:36 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
I'm hoping to submit these guys as a faction/group pretty soon. What does everyone think?

NAME = DALMOR OF IRONSTONE
GENERAL = AQUILLA
PLANET = FEYLUND
SPECIES = DWARF
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = WARRIOR
PERSONALITY = STEADFAST
SIZE/HEIGHT = SMALL 3

3 LIFE
4 MOVE
1 RANGE
3 ATTACK
5 DEFENSE
60 POINTS

Imposing Threat:
An opponent's figure that is engaged with Dalmor of Ironstone, rolls 2 less attack dice when attacking small and medium friendly Common figures with a normal attack.

Strategic Charge:
Before moving Dalmor of Ironstone, if a friendly figure within 6 clear sight spaces is engaged, you may add 2 to Dalmor of Ironstone's move.

Climb X2:
When moving up or down levels of terrain, Dalmor of Ironstone may double his height.

--------

NAME = GREAT AXES OF IRONSTONE
GENERAL = AQUILLA
PLANET = FEYLUND
SPECIES = DWARVES
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE SQUAD
CLASS = WARRIORS
PERSONALITY = FEARLESS
SIZE/HEIGHT = SMALL 3

LIFE: 1 (4 FIGURES)
MOVE: 4
RANGE: 1
ATTACK: 3
DEFENSE: 3
80 POINTS

Tenacity:
When rolling Attack dice, if at least 2 skulls were rolled, add 1 skull to what ever was rolled. When rolling Defense dice, if at least 2 shields were rolled, add 1 shield to what ever was rolled.

Strategic Charge:
Before moving a Great Axe of Ironstone, if a friendly figure within 6 clear sight spaces is engaged, you may add 2 to that Great Axe of Ironstone's move.

Climb X2:
When moving up or down levels of terrain, Great Axes of Ironstone may double their height.


The figures used are from the "Dwarf Patrol 1" set by em4 minatures. The picture shows them next to all official dwarves. Look for their green bases. The one that is pointing is Dalmar.


The Dwarf Faction is mostly complete, but 2 things it could use is a Unique Squad, and a Front Line Support Hero such as Dalmor. Strategic Charge holds these guys back at the beginning of the game by slowing them down until your main force has engaged the enemy. You'll have to keep the position your army's engagements in mind when you decide to bring them up, and in late game clean up, it can lead to tough decisions where you have to decide not to attack in order to keep their movement options open. It has some unique situations where you can engage with the first squad figure to activate Strategic Charge for the other 3. Tenacity makes these guys a fearsome force, but the roll requirement keeps it from being too powerful by allowing blanks, and rolls of 1. Dalmor is great at tying up a heavy hitter that would much rather be making quick work of your squaddies. 5 defense means he won't go down easily, but 3 life, and good positioning on the enemies part can keep him from being too powerful. Although he has the highest printed defense number of any of the dwarven heros, he lacks any additional abilities to help bolster this, and combined with only 3 life, aside from Darrak, I think he might actually be the easiest Dwarven hero to kill. His abilities can be negated with special attacks, and by simply avoiding him. Despite any down sides, he is still a good distraction, and his lower price point will be a very welcome addition to the faction.
These are neat power sets but they don't feel particularly dwarfy to me.

Your custom probably has too much Defense.

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  #3196  
Old February 21st, 2019, 11:24 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astroking112 View Post
So I'm sure you remember the first time you ran Eltris through here and I was pretty against her being able to ride any dragon. That hasn't really changed and I think an actual dedicated rider/dragon pair would be a lot cooler than someone who can ride any dragon. It would also open up a lot of space for design and you wouldn't have to worry about making a dragon too strong with any buffs since they'd be designed to work together. That said, I'll give some feedback on the current design as well.

First off, I think you could come up with a better class and personality than Rider and Fearless. They're not bad, but I think there could be better, especially when trying to sell a hardcore dragon rider. Champion and Loyal come to mind.

In all honesty, just having her basically be buffed stats to a dragon is pretty boring to me. Stats are fine, but dragons already have good stats and she's kind of pushing into overkill lane where extra stats are redundant. They usually only want more defense and Raelin is there for that. More move is a bad idea, IMO, because dragons are already so dang good at kiting. I am on board with the idea of having her be worth an occasional OM, but if your main focus is stat-boosting I don't think that's going to happen for all of the reasons you've brought up.

One way to help her see action is to give her a Bol-like ability that gives her the dragon's OMs after it dies. Unfortunately, that just plays more into the "along for the ride" idea and, while effective, just makes her a rider who waits for the dragon to die to actually do something. Another way to take her beyond being just extra stats and being worth OMs is to give her a Special power or attack that helps the dragons with their weaknesses. For example, if she were to have some kind of power that helps take on tough heroes, there would be more of a partnership as the dragons lay waste with their specials and she challenges any leaders who would threaten the dragon's weak defense.

Basically, I agree with you that the +1 attack/defense isn't as powerful as some people may think. But if the purpose of the card is to give a buff that's not that great, then why draft her? I just think she needs to be able to shine as an actual help to a dragon.
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  #3197  
Old February 22nd, 2019, 12:32 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Otherwise, Dragon Rider is about as good of a dragon-riding power as is possible in the game, and Companion's Strength is fitting, but I'm not thrilled about a +1/+1 boost to any big dragon, some of the game's strongest solo units. An Attack of 4 seems entirely unnecessary, even unthematic. Attack 5 when nearby the dragon?
I'm curious what you mean by unthematic. Do you have an example of where this is the case in fiction? I personally don't see any reason to make her offensively weak, but I don't feel that strongly about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
Her own defense is far more important, and I like that she is quite vulnerable when she's separated from the dragon, but that doesn't really matter, because unless you are dealing with Hops, Chainfighters, Warforged, or Wyverns, there will never be a reason that they wouldn't be within each other's stat boost range.
Don't forget about powers like Throw on Jotun and Heracles, or how Boreos can more or less do the Wyvern thing. That could certainly be problematic for the warfaring partners.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggaBullfrog View Post
First off, I think you could come up with a better class and personality than Rider and Fearless. They're not bad, but I think there could be better, especially when trying to sell a hardcore dragon rider. Champion and Loyal come to mind.
I momentarily shuddered at the thought of another Human Champion when I read that, and one that could connect Knight and Dragon armies no less! Then I remembered that she's an Elf. Crisis averted.
Seriously though, I think Loyal fits decently well with her sculpt, but I think Fearless or even Dauntless fits a little better personally. Maybe Tricky or Valiant if you really want to but I think opening those cans of worms would be unnecessary. I don't know if Champion would be better than Rider, the only other alternatives I can think of would be Warrior or Hunter, but honestly with the introduction of the new riding mechanic, it would be nice to see the new Rider Class to differentiate them, although I doubt Heroscape will ever see more than three Dragon Riders(Perhaps a mage and an archer for the others?).
@Astroking112 , from what I can tell of Eltris's abilities, you get +1/+1 to both her and the companion if they are within three spaces, but you only get to take the Dragon's turn, the +1 move boost, and the ability to carry Eltris if they start that turn adjacent to each other. That seems fine to me, however I think it would make more sense and certainly be more effective if you could take the Dragon's turn as long as they start within three spaces(other factors remaining unchanged.).
This way, you could take OM 1 to move and attack an enemy hero a short distance away with Eltris, use OM 2 to move her dragon companion adjacent to her and maybe make use of its Special Attack, and take OM 3 to get the heck out of dodge. I think this opens up a lot of interesting tactical possibilities between the two, and makes your next course of action harder to predict.

All in all, she looks pretty well put-together. Keep it up!

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  #3198  
Old February 22nd, 2019, 02:33 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggaBullfrog View Post
So I'm sure you remember the first time you ran Eltris through here and I was pretty against her being able to ride any dragon. That hasn't really changed and I think an actual dedicated rider/dragon pair would be a lot cooler than someone who can ride any dragon. It would also open up a lot of space for design and you wouldn't have to worry about making a dragon too strong with any buffs since they'd be designed to work together. That said, I'll give some feedback on the current design as well.

First off, I think you could come up with a better class and personality than Rider and Fearless. They're not bad, but I think there could be better, especially when trying to sell a hardcore dragon rider. Champion and Loyal come to mind.
Heh, yeah. I still like her working with any dragon more than just a new one for all the reasons that we discussed last time, but I'm more than happy to receive more feedback.

I'm not sure that Rider is any significantly worse than Champion, but the class doesn't matter too significantly to me here. I doubt that we'll ever see Elf Champion Bonding or anything like that, so I'm fine with exploring other classes.

After thinking about it for a little bit, I actually really like the Loyal personality. Fearless still fits, but given that her design is geared towards choosing a single dragon and sticking with it (and that the dragon could have many varying personalities), a more general Loyalty seems really fitting. I'll make this change on my next pass through the card.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggaBullfrog View Post
In all honesty, just having her basically be buffed stats to a dragon is pretty boring to me. Stats are fine, but dragons already have good stats and she's kind of pushing into overkill lane where extra stats are redundant. They usually only want more defense and Raelin is there for that. More move is a bad idea, IMO, because dragons are already so dang good at kiting. I am on board with the idea of having her be worth an occasional OM, but if your main focus is stat-boosting I don't think that's going to happen for all of the reasons you've brought up.
I think that this is a solid argument. Each dragon generally excels in different stats, such as Nilfheim or Quahon having great attacks, Charos having superb defense, or Zelrig and Nilfheim having a good move. Adding +1 to each of these is bound to push a boundary for each dragon that doesn't really need it, which makes that boost feel less needed. I'm not completely convinced to abandon the stat boosts yet, but this is giving me a lot to consider.

At the very least, I'm leaning towards cutting it down to either focus on move and attack or attack and defense, which should help address this at least a little bit. Defense and move are definitely the more impactful boosts anyway, since most dragons don't use their normal attack as often. Of the two, I think that defense will probably be more consistently useful (and avoid making kiting problems any worse) and simpler to implement, so I'll probably go back to the old +1/+1.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggaBullfrog View Post
One way to help her see action is to give her a Bol-like ability that gives her the dragon's OMs after it dies. Unfortunately, that just plays more into the "along for the ride" idea and, while effective, just makes her a rider who waits for the dragon to die to actually do something. Another way to take her beyond being just extra stats and being worth OMs is to give her a Special power or attack that helps the dragons with their weaknesses. For example, if she were to have some kind of power that helps take on tough heroes, there would be more of a partnership as the dragons lay waste with their specials and she challenges any leaders who would threaten the dragon's weak defense.

Basically, I agree with you that the +1 attack/defense isn't as powerful as some people may think. But if the purpose of the card is to give a buff that's not that great, then why draft her? I just think she needs to be able to shine as an actual help to a dragon.
The prospect of replacing Companions' Strength altogether is something that I'm going to have to think more on. There are obviously a lot of directions that a new ability could go, be it hero-slaying or something else. I really appreciate your ideas here; they've at the very least gotten the gears turning. If I can settle on something that I like more than the stat boost, I'll definitely try it out.

I do want her to remain simple, though. Since she's essentially an addition to other units that can already be taken without her, I don't want her to complicate things with crazy new abilities or anything. I do think that the stat boost can work, it just was pretty underpowered from past tests and I felt like she could be improved to have room for a little more activity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo Ultra View Post
Seriously though, I think Loyal fits decently well with her sculpt, but I think Fearless or even Dauntless fits a little better personally. Maybe Tricky or Valiant if you really want to but I think opening those cans of worms would be unnecessary. I don't know if Champion would be better than Rider, the only other alternatives I can think of would be Warrior or Hunter, but honestly with the introduction of the new riding mechanic, it would be nice to see the new Rider Class to differentiate them, although I doubt Heroscape will ever see more than three Dragon Riders(Perhaps a mage and an archer for the others?).
I'm going to stay far away from Valiant for fairly obvious reasons. I know that the Elven Wizards are generally Tricky or Valiant, but I don't think we need to follow that convention here (Syvarris is Precise, for example). Fearless and Dauntless are both good fits for the sculpt, but for the reasons I listed above, I think that Loyal is actually a really good idea.

As for the prospect of additional Riders, I don't have any plans to make more and am not tied to the class. I just want to leave the design space open for anyone else to make their own types of Riders, should they want to. If VC would prefer to see a different non-synergistic class for Eltris other than Rider, I'll have no objections.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo Ultra View Post
@Astroking112 , from what I can tell of Eltris's abilities, you get +1/+1 to both her and the companion if they are within three spaces, but you only get to take the Dragon's turn, the +1 move boost, and the ability to carry Eltris if they start that turn adjacent to each other. That seems fine to me, however I think it would make more sense and certainly be more effective if you could take the Dragon's turn as long as they start within three spaces(other factors remaining unchanged.).
This way, you could take OM 1 to move and attack an enemy hero a short distance away with Eltris, use OM 2 to move her dragon companion adjacent to her and maybe make use of its Special Attack, and take OM 3 to get the heck out of dodge. I think this opens up a lot of interesting tactical possibilities between the two, and makes your next course of action harder to predict.
That's an interesting concept, but I kind of want to force the player to keep placing Order Markers on her. Loosening the restriction on how you can take a turn with the dragon will open up more possibilities that'll be harder to predict, but making their separation easier invites Greenscales back into the mix. It also might require splitting up the Dragon Rider power into two different umbrellas to work properly, which could complicate the card. I appreciate the suggestion, but I think that it'd probably be best to keep the turn-taking to adjacency only.
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  #3199  
Old February 22nd, 2019, 05:56 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Hereís a bit of a far fetched idea, and I donít know if youíve ever tried it...

Why not let her literally ride the dragon... on itís card. When the dragon lands, you can have her attempt a dire attack by dismounting and charging.

Something like:

Dragon Rider
After revealing an Order Marker on this Army Card, and instead of taking a turn with Eltris, you may plave her figure on the Army Card of an adjacent Huge Dragon you control. After taking a turn with that Dragon, if it attacked a figure, you may place Eltris on an adjacent space and take a turn with her. If you do, she must attack a figure.

Sorry, itís 5 AM and Iím probably too tired to talk shop.

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  #3200  
Old February 22nd, 2019, 11:13 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Dragon Rider
After revealing an Order Marker on this Army Card, and instead of taking a turn with Eltris, you may plave her figure on the Army Card of an adjacent Huge Dragon you control. After taking a turn with that Dragon, if it attacked a figure, you may place Eltris on an adjacent space and take a turn with her. If you do, she must attack a figure.
Now THAT ^ I like!! Definitely thematic, and very unique and fun. I could see that being a way better direction then just a straight up stat boost.

In fact you could put Eltrisí Att to 3 (which was concerning some at 4) and then give her a special attack or ability that is an Att of 4, conditional upon if youíre attacking a figure engaged with the Dragon hero. Then itís as if sheís jumping off (hence the mini) and coming down on the opponent or being invigorated to defend the Dragon. I think Flameslaywr has found something here for you. I know personally Iíd love taking a hero with this general design with my dragons to literally ride and then pop in the board and Attack. But not just a straight up stat booster. This way youíre getting turns with eltris and she can be more than just a sidelines hero giving help passively.
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  #3201  
Old February 22nd, 2019, 11:38 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Dragon Rider
After revealing an Order Marker on this Army Card, and instead of taking a turn with Eltris, you may plave her figure on the Army Card of an adjacent Huge Dragon you control. After taking a turn with that Dragon, if it attacked a figure, you may place Eltris on an adjacent space and take a turn with her. If you do, she must attack a figure.
Now THAT ^ I like!! Definitely thematic, and very unique and fun. I could see that being a way better direction then just a straight up stat boost.

In fact you could put Eltrisí Att to 3 (which was concerning some at 4) and then give her a special attack or ability that is an Att of 4, conditional upon if youíre attacking a figure engaged with the Dragon hero. Then itís as if sheís jumping off (hence the mini) and coming down on the opponent or being invigorated to defend the Dragon. I think Flameslaywr has found something here for you. I know personally Iíd love taking a hero with this general design with my dragons to literally ride and then pop in the board and Attack. But not just a straight up stat booster. This way youíre getting turns with eltris and she can be more than just a sidelines hero giving help passively.
This is good, up to the "must attack a figure" clause. That has the "uncertain future" problem. If she, for example, dies to a leaving engagement attack before making her attack, then she fails to meet the condition for taking the extra turn. Just get rid of that clause and it's ok.
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  #3202  
Old February 22nd, 2019, 04:30 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Dragon Rider
After revealing an Order Marker on this Army Card, and instead of taking a turn with Eltris, you may plave her figure on the Army Card of an adjacent Huge Dragon you control. After taking a turn with that Dragon, if it attacked a figure, you may place Eltris on an adjacent space and take a turn with her. If you do, she must attack a figure.
Now THAT ^ I like!! Definitely thematic, and very unique and fun. I could see that being a way better direction then just a straight up stat boost.

In fact you could put Eltrisí Att to 3 (which was concerning some at 4) and then give her a special attack or ability that is an Att of 4, conditional upon if youíre attacking a figure engaged with the Dragon hero. Then itís as if sheís jumping off (hence the mini) and coming down on the opponent or being invigorated to defend the Dragon. I think Flameslaywr has found something here for you. I know personally Iíd love taking a hero with this general design with my dragons to literally ride and then pop in the board and Attack. But not just a straight up stat booster. This way youíre getting turns with eltris and she can be more than just a sidelines hero giving help passively.
This is good, up to the "must attack a figure" clause. That has the "uncertain future" problem. If she, for example, dies to a leaving engagement attack before making her attack, then she fails to meet the condition for taking the extra turn. Just get rid of that clause and it's ok.
Sorry, I forgot anout the uncertainty thing. But yeah, go for this idea if you want Astro.

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Old February 22nd, 2019, 06:37 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

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Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Dragon Rider
After revealing an Order Marker on this Army Card, and instead of taking a turn with Eltris, you may plave her figure on the Army Card of an adjacent Huge Dragon you control. After taking a turn with that Dragon, if it attacked a figure, you may place Eltris on an adjacent space and take a turn with her. If you do, she must attack a figure.
Now THAT ^ I like!! Definitely thematic, and very unique and fun. I could see that being a way better direction then just a straight up stat boost.

In fact you could put Eltrisí Att to 3 (which was concerning some at 4) and then give her a special attack or ability that is an Att of 4, conditional upon if youíre attacking a figure engaged with the Dragon hero. Then itís as if sheís jumping off (hence the mini) and coming down on the opponent or being invigorated to defend the Dragon. I think Flameslaywr has found something here for you. I know personally Iíd love taking a hero with this general design with my dragons to literally ride and then pop in the board and Attack. But not just a straight up stat booster. This way youíre getting turns with eltris and she can be more than just a sidelines hero giving help passively.
This is good, up to the "must attack a figure" clause. That has the "uncertain future" problem. If she, for example, dies to a leaving engagement attack before making her attack, then she fails to meet the condition for taking the extra turn. Just get rid of that clause and it's ok.
Sorry, I forgot anout the uncertainty thing. But yeah, go for this idea if you want Astro.

I might even go so far as

--to give her an automatic skull for the dismounting attack
--Let her dismount into any empty space within two (three?) clear sight spaces
--Name it Dismounting Leap or Leaping Strike or something

Basically like she leaps off and comes crashing down on someone.

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Old February 22nd, 2019, 11:17 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Sorry for only getting to this now; I was busy with other matters earlier in the day. I do appreciate everyone's responses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by flameslayer93 View Post
Here’s a bit of a far fetched idea, and I don’t know if you’ve ever tried it...

Why not let her literally ride the dragon... on it’s card. When the dragon lands, you can have her attempt a dire attack by dismounting and charging.

Something like:

Dragon Rider
After revealing an Order Marker on this Army Card, and instead of taking a turn with Eltris, you may plave her figure on the Army Card of an adjacent Huge Dragon you control. After taking a turn with that Dragon, if it attacked a figure, you may place Eltris on an adjacent space and take a turn with her. If you do, she must attack a figure.

Sorry, it’s 5 AM and I’m probably too tired to talk shop.
I've actually considered both of those things before, but decided against them for a couple of reasons. Placing Eltris on the dragon's Army Card is a neat representation but ultimately not any different from any form of reverse-carry unless she can stay on the card over the course of multiple turns, similar to how Mok has Dwarven Gunners. It doesn't change this design at all to leave her on the board and place her after the dragon's turn, for example.

I decided against letting her attack after the dragon because some like Nilfheim are already multi-attackers, so I didn't like the idea of her flat-out adding another attack to them. That said, this is the first time that anyone has thought of limiting it to only normal attacks, which makes it significantly more interesting. I'm not quite happy with how heavily it encourages Nilfheim (since Quahon and Charos become the only other reasonable choices), but that's possibly the most appealing idea for letting both attack that I've heard yet.

I also want to keep the "choose only one dragon" mechanic, to avoid letting her jump from Nilfheim to Zelrig to Othkurik or anything crazy like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape View Post
In fact you could put Eltris’ Att to 3 (which was concerning some at 4) and then give her a special attack or ability that is an Att of 4, conditional upon if you’re attacking a figure engaged with the Dragon hero. Then it’s as if she’s jumping off (hence the mini) and coming down on the opponent or being invigorated to defend the Dragon. I think Flameslaywr has found something here for you. I know personally I’d love taking a hero with this general design with my dragons to literally ride and then pop in the board and Attack. But not just a straight up stat booster. This way you’re getting turns with eltris and she can be more than just a sidelines hero giving help passively.
I don't think that dropping her attack to 3 would be necessary if going that route. The mini and mechanics themselves would encourage the playstyle enough that you'd rarely play her another way, and there still hasn't been a compelling reason offered yet for why 4 attack is off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo Ultra View Post
I might even go so far as

--to give her an automatic skull for the dismounting attack
--Let her dismount into any empty space within two (three?) clear sight spaces
--Name it Dismounting Leap or Leaping Strike or something

Basically like she leaps off and comes crashing down on someone.
I don't think an automatic skull would be necessary, but leaping could be an interesting direction to take that idea. It does make targeting different figures significantly easier, though. I'm more concerned with making the design to where it can be taken with different dragons and encourage build variety rather than decrease it.
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