Gen Con 2010 Main Event Armies

[kolakoski]

Originally Posted by Gulp

I used AE at GenCon a couple years ago.

I'll never field the AE in a competitive tournament again. Not only do you deal with games where they don't drop until late (if at all). When they do drop, you have to hope for initiative. If you don't get it, then you'll sometimes find yourself in situations where two have been killed in the first turn before you've even activated them.

Before I created the Valhalla Society, I used to field them fairly often. I did pretty well with them, but I was very careful about dropping them some distance away from the enemy, to take advantage of their range, treating their Grenade Special as a nice bonus, rather than their primary focus.

[Rÿchean]

I used to feel the same way you do, Gulp, about the AE. However, I still played them for GenCon Champ event in 2007. It was pretty nerve racking, but I did pretty well that year.(2nd place) Mattser played the AE last year and he won.

In a Marcus lead army, you can drop the AE behind your main line. With Marcus boosting their move to 5, they are much more playable as a typical advancing squad. You don't have to drop them in a compromising position. Marcus gives some flexibility in how they can be played.

They are a gamble for sure, but so long as the rest of the army isn't a pile of crap, it can work. I believe that is the key: You have to play them with an army that can stand alone.

[killercactus]

Originally Posted by Rÿchean

They are a gamble for sure, but so long as the rest of the army isn't a pile of crap, it can work. I believe that is the key: You have to play them with an army that can stand alone.

Deathreavers help a lot, too, since they both prolong the game and take the fire away from the AE.

[Gulp]

Originally Posted by Rÿchean

I used to feel the same way you do, Gulp, about the AE. However, I still played them for GenCon Champ event in 2007. It was pretty nerve racking, but I did pretty well that year.(2nd place) Mattser played the AE last year and he won.

In a Marcus lead army, you can drop the AE behind your main line. With Marcus boosting their move to 5, they are much more playable as a typical advancing squad. You don't have to drop them in a compromising position. Marcus gives some flexibility in how they can be played.

They are a gamble for sure, but so long as the rest of the army isn't a pile of crap, it can work. I believe that is the key: You have to play them with an army that can stand alone.

Interesting. I'm constantly amazed by how important having a critical grasp of a units functionality is key to really getting your points value. And I'm even more amazed at how often I THINK I have already achieved that grasp when the reality is much different than that.

[dok]

Originally Posted by Gulp

I'll never field the AE in a competitive tournament again. Not only do you deal with games where they don't drop until late (if at all). When they do drop, you have to hope for initiative. If you don't get it, then you'll sometimes find yourself in situations where two have been killed in the first turn before you've even activated them.

If you drop them 12 hexes back, or behind a screen, that won't happen. There are times when you should play the AE in a high-risk, high-reward fashion, but not always.

[yagyuninja]

The AE are fun but I definitely do not have the play experience to use them competitively. I'm not sure I've even used them since my RotV only days, to be honest.

Non-AE related...

I'm still waffling between a couple armies in my head for my 510 tourney tomorrow.

210 PK x3
120 Hydra
80 Raelin
100 Krav
510 - 15 hexes

I've play tested the PKs so much lately that I feel very comfortable with them. In this army I think they function to complement the powerhouses of their domains (hydra/melee, Krav/range) in a couple different ways. They can screen fairly effectively, and unlike rats they can do some damage if they need to. Braxas sucks though, and a fight against minions will be a hard fought battle.

210 Charos
120 Greenscales x2
100 Krav
80 Raelin
510 - 12 hexes

I've tested this a bit and I love the Greenroller. Maybe too light on lizards though, so I've also played:

210 Charos
180 Greenscales x3
120 Kaemon
510 - 12 hexes

But this lacks the Raelin/Krav that I cling to as a defense against the omnicron/taelord combo that I am almost guaranteed to see here in the northwest.

Last is this, which rolls so many dice every turn it is hard to resist. Again, hard against snipers and maybe other ranged commons? Not sure...

185 Nilfheim
120 Greenies x2
120 Hydra
80 Raelin
505 - 11 hexes

Actually, 2x Rats are probably better here than Raelin. Yeah, much better.

[Brownsfan82]

Originally Posted by dok

"Invasion" and "Jotun's Gap" both also have a 24-hexer startzone, although on Invasion they are too far apart for an OM-1 bomb. However, that's one of only two maps in the pool (Elswin Plateau being the other) where Zelrig can't OM-1 bomb. And there are several maps where Zelrig can hit a 7-hex area in the startzone from height, and then move and hit a different 7-hex cluster from height.

I don't think this is a bad map set for Zelrig at all!

Zelrig
Just a little story
I've found that trying to bomb a starting zone with Zelrig is very risky. It could pay off but it could kill the dragon without much benefit. 2 years ago I played Hendal and his 7StingersRaelin team on Fire Isle:
Perfect map for me, I could reach the 2nd or 3rd hex in his starting zone in one move. I won initiative. Yes! "Go in there Zelrig." I even found stingers without raelin's help in his starting zone. I rolled a BLANK! Next turn: 1 skull, 2 or 3 kills. THEN DEATH. This happened again in that tourney.

This doesn't always happen but:
In saying this Zelrig is still a solid figure to add to a team. But sacrificing him early isn't always smart. It might pay off, but even if i would have killed 7 stingers, thats less than 185 points worth of stingers.

I did get a risk reward against Damja at a michigan tourney when he had a omnicron sniper army. But I pulled Zelrig back when his team was more spread out.

Zelrig would be great for the main tournament if played right. I guess you could say that for a lot of figures though. I had more to say about Zelrig but forgot.

Airborne Elite
I agree with what has been said.

yagyuninja
I like your first army and the Charos army with 3 greenscales. Bonding with charos may be the new steamroller and with a good backup, hey why not? Krav, Raelin, and any screen is good.

In conclusion, I am really impressed with the quality of discussion in this thread.

[Clarissimus]

Originally Posted by Rÿchean

I am a Screw Day 2 Guy for sure . . . . My philosophy is to worry about getting there first and then deal with reinforcements.

I'm with you there. Getting to Day 2 is hard enough on its own. You have a have a solid army that you know forwards and backwards, know the mathcups and the maps, and maybe even a little luck to boost you into the championship.

I know I breathed a big sigh of relief when I sat down with a 3-1 record and faced a Gladiator army (I had Braxas).

Originally Posted by Gulp

When [the Airborne Elite] drop, you have to hope for initiative. If you don't get it, then you'll sometimes find yourself in situations where two have been killed in the first turn before you've even activated them.

Sounds like you maybe need to set them back a little farther. Move 4 isn't much but with range 8 you should be able to drop them to a safe location.

I sometimes have the opposite problem; I'll win initiative after the drop and find that only 3 of my 4 guys can get in range to attack

[Acinonyx]

I wanted to give thanks to the people here recommending being less Raelin dependent. I switched her out for two squads of repulsors with my minion army and it worked great. Even when my opponent didn't have rats, they worked pretty well grabbing glyphs and the damage they managed to do was gravy. Anything that draws fire away from the minions is a good thing.
I still haven't figured out how to take out stupid Captain America reliably with this army, but I guess that's not a worry for those of you able to get to Gencon! His special attack is sooo brutal. My friend was playing 2x 10th, Marcus, Cap and Theracus. It is pretty hard to keep Cap off the high ground when he brings a flying horse.

[Gulp]

Originally Posted by dok

"Invasion" and "Jotun's Gap" both also have a 24-hexer startzone, although on Invasion they are too far apart for an OM-1 bomb. However, that's one of only two maps in the pool (Elswin Plateau being the other) where Zelrig can't OM-1 bomb. And there are several maps where Zelrig can hit a 7-hex area in the startzone from height, and then move and hit a different 7-hex cluster from height.

I don't think this is a bad map set for Zelrig at all!

I was specifically referring to maps in the championship.

You're right. I forgot Invasion. Though as you said, you can't 1-OM bomb it, and this gets even worse if you lose initiative. Jotun's Gap also works, but from what I understand it is not going to be used in the championship.

Another thing I just noticed too. On Rift Valley, if you have Zelrig, you better hope you can avoid placing the remaining figures on the lava field because if you do, then you will have to choose between getting a couple good Zelrig shots (and getting him out of danger from the approaching units) or leaving your common squads sitting on the lava field for end of round burning.

EDIT: Hiding my noob.

[dok]

Every map is used in the championship.

Originally Posted by Rÿchean

The large events (Championship, Heat of Battle, and Generals Wars) will use all 10 maps.

[Gulp]

Originally Posted by dok

Every map is used in the championship.

Yeah, yeah. Rub it in. I'm a noob.

Stay tuned for the tomorrow's episode of Gulp Makes a Fool of Himself called "Special Attacks Get A Height Bonus".