The Book of Super-Skrull (Kl'rt)

[Hahma]

We'll see what the old man has to say.

[Hahma]

Did everyone get my pm when I sent this guy to ERB? I ask because I sent it yesterday around the same time (5:30 am CST) and still haven't heard from either MH or BIV yet. I just want to make sure the PM went through.

[SirGalahad]

I got it.

[Hahma]

Originally Posted by SirGalahad

I got it.

Great. And I also now know it went through because The B.I.V. just pm'd me with his response.

Here it is:

Pretty cool.

Rock Wall BB: "...A non-flying figure moved lower by Rock Wall Bounce Back takes any falling damage that may apply.

Partial Invis: "...he cannot be the target of a non-adjacent attack, or any special power that requires clear sight."

Me likee!

Brandon

[IAmBatman]

Rock Wall BB's wording is based on the official Knockback 14.

[Hahma]

Originally Posted by IAmBatman

Rock Wall BB's wording is based on the official Knockback 14.

Then we're set there.

[Hahma]

Matt Helm had a bit more to say about Super Skrull than The B.I.V.

I hate to do this my man but I have a lot of comments on this one. I'll start with theasy one that I know your whole group will disagree with me on.

1) I do not believe he needs Lava Resistant. I'm sure it will end up on Human Torch as well so I guess you guys won't listen to me here but I think it is not a needed mechanic for most flame heroes and really just adds clutter to an already crowded card. Basically, if Silver Surfer, Superman and Doomsday aren't lava resistant, why would the Flame Power folks be? I know it is so that when you write up Flame Power attacks you can make Lava resistant folks immune but I just don't know why it can't be accepted that the concussive force alone could cause damage. Anyway, the power is written fine so obviously it's C3G choice.

2) Partial Invisibility - Does it really need the extra immunity to Special Powers that need line of Sight? I think we sometimes concern ourselves with "over-theming" it. Simpler is sometimes better and I'd suggest "... cannot be targeted for attack by a non-adjacent figure." I would justify it by saying that Special Power don't always need to be aimed whereas Special Attacks due. Special powers that require line of sight can still be used if you just catch a peak for a split second and you can focus on where your "target" is. I don't know, but I just don't like the complexity of adding in special powers.

3) Rock Wall Bounce Back seems to have holes.
a) the sentence "The space must be on the same level as or lower than its current location." needs fixing. A space is always on the same level as its current location because a space doesn't move. What you want to say is that the space must be on the same level or lower than the space that the affected figure occupied before the bounce back.
b) Is it really a bounce back if you choose a space that is on the exact opposite side of Super Skrull? Seems more of a matador move. But this is minor and I can live with it.
c) Is "non-flying" an acceptable substitution for "does not have the Flying or Stealth Flying special power." And why limit them anyway? If you do that than don't you want swingers to be able to avoid falling damage to? What about stretchers? I would probably leave that nugget off all together and once again think simpler (less complex).
d) "moved lower by..." I think the word lower can be removed because in order for falling damage to apply, it is mandatory that the figure was moved lower. More importantly though, you need to address if the moved figures receive leaving engagement attacks or not.

e) Finally, I'm not sure I love the theme here. You've basically made Super Skrull's strategy to use his body like a trampoline and I'm not sure if that's part of his MO.

On a final comment that's not necessarily a critical point. mechanically, you've made it very scary to attack him with an adjacent normal attack. I guess players will likely engage Super Skrull with a figure that they don't plan on attacking him with just to expose him to ranged units. The figure would then take a pounding with no OM's to fight back. I guess that's what you plan on using the Thing for.

[IAmBatman]

1) He doesn't even expect us to pay attention to this, so I won't.
2) We set a clear precedent with Martian Manhunter and then Invisible Woman that I think we're all happy with - so I'm prepared to disregard this comment as well.
3) All of the wording he took fault with is taken directly from Knockback 14 on an official card. I like the theme of non-flying - I think it's fun to use the flying powers and super strength powers for synergies more. If other people aren't digging that part, it's cool, but I think it's a fun twist. And I think when bounced back, it's easier to recover by flying than in the other situations. (And do we have any stretchy guys that don't also have super strength anyway?).
I wouldn't expect Matt Helm to love the theme here, as it's a card he's done his own version of that's very different. I can say he's fun to play, though and has a lot more going on for him that's exciting and interesting in gameplay than other versions of the character I've seen done.
Basically, I'm not seeing anything here convincing me changes are needed.

[Hahma]

Yeah, I figured you'd played him and knew how he worked and if there were any issues with the powers. Matt's SS is a lot different and simpler but we strive for better than simple. There's a lot to do to get SS pretty good with all that he can do so I think we did a good job in incorporating as much as we can in a cool way. Simple powers and cards can be used where required, but when doing so many cards, if we kept everything simple then we'd be running out of powers and overlapping units with too many similar stats/powers.

[IAmBatman]

I'm glad we're on the same page.

[Griffin]

I could barely stomach that ERB report honestly. Matt obviously doesn't know as much about "official wording" as he gives himself credit for, his design aesthetics are so very different from ours (which is fine, but we are not asking our ERB members to redesign our cards), and for a good ERB response, I think a member needs to understand our C3G cards like Martian Manhunter, and I don't think that he does.

~ Griff, disappointingly in disagreement

[IAmBatman]

Preemptive yea to move this guy to playtesting. 'Dem allies are hungry.