The Book of Wyvern

[Tai-Pan]

So what would be the proper Wyvern-Spider ratio?

I kind of think it is number of wyverns +1= number of spider squads.

1 squad of spiders is just a pain. They almost never survive long enough to get to use their web special. The Wyvern helps quite a bit by being able to bring back something for them to try it on, but at soon as one dies, you're out of luck. Drafting at least two allows you to lose a couple and still be able to use their web special. It also allows you to send out five and leave on sitting in the start zone to manage predator order markers like Warlord Alpha said. With a wyvern to deal with, I doubt an enemy is going to worry about the spiders until the wyvern is gone, or unless they are engaged to a spider and don't want to chance a disengagement hit. That said, I think anymore than one squad of spiders per wyvern (after the extra one for casualty purposes) is too much. You'll end up with a bunch of spiders sitting on the field with no more predators to bond with.

Of course, if you bring Estivara along, Spiders get boosted up to where they may offer a threat to enemy figures, and the ratio could then be altered accordingly.

[killercactus]

Originally Posted by Tai-Pan

So what would be the proper Wyvern-Spider ratio?

I kind of think it is number of wyverns +1= number of spider squads.

1 squad of spiders is just a pain. They almost never survive long enough to get to use their web special. The Wyvern helps quite a bit by being able to bring back something for them to try it on, but at soon as one dies, you're out of luck. Drafting at least two allows you to lose a couple and still be able to use their web special. It also allows you to send out five and leave on sitting in the start zone to manage predator order markers like Warlord Alpha said. With a wyvern to deal with, I doubt an enemy is going to worry about the spiders until the wyvern is gone, or unless they are engaged to a spider and don't want to chance a disengagement hit. That said, I think anymore than one squad of spiders per wyvern (after the extra one for casualty purposes) is too much. You'll end up with a bunch of spiders sitting on the field with no more predators to bond with.

Of course, if you bring Estivara along, Spiders get boosted up to where they may offer a threat to enemy figures, and the ratio could then be altered accordingly.

I like the following:

1 Wyvern = 2 spider squads
1 Wyvern + Venoc Warlord = 2 spider squads if you have more scouts (read: Vipers or Mohicans), 3 if not.
1 Wyvern + Estivara = 3 squads
1 Wyvern + Estivara + Venoc Warlord = 3-4 squads, depending on other scouts
Sujoah = unplayable now that Wyvern and Estivara can be played in the same army for less than him and do nearly exactly the same thing, except they also grab people and boost the Spiders' attack.

[gorthan313]

Originally Posted by killercactus

I like the following:

1 Wyvern = 2 spider squads
1 Wyvern + Venoc Warlord = 2 spider squads if you have more scouts (read: Vipers or Mohicans), 3 if not.
1 Wyvern + Estivara = 3 squads
1 Wyvern + Estivara + Venoc Warlord = 3-4 squads, depending on other scouts
Sujoah = unplayable now that Wyvern and Estivara can be played in the same army for less than him and do nearly exactly the same thing, except they also grab people and boost the Spiders' attack.

Oh, alright. You can take your Wyvern along, and I'll take X17.

Now that I think of it, how would that work? COULD an enemy wyvern even carry Major X, or would it's movement be stopped by Improved Cyberclaw?

[killercactus]

Yes - a Wyvern could grab X17, but after it lands it would be stuck.

It won't matter though - my Estivara's venom will wreck X17.

[Rich10]

Originally Posted by killercactus

Yes - a Wyvern could grab X17, but after it lands it would be stuck.

It won't matter though - my Estivara's venom will wreck X17.

KC, I see a troubling pattern. Is Estivara turning into the new Runa for you?

[killercactus]

Originally Posted by Rich10

KC, I see a troubling pattern. Is Estivara turning into the new Runa for you?

I don't know - she is a lot like Runa, huh? She's an evil, female Utgar figure with a D20 Special Power that kills anything on a 20. The only difference is she's actually useful.

I don't think Runa will ever truly be replaced, but I do like Estivara a lot because she works well with my other favorite hero - Mittens.

[gorthan313]

Originally Posted by killercactus

Yes - a Wyvern could grab X17, but after it lands it would be stuck.

It won't matter though - my Estivara's venom will wreck X17.

And then my Dund will come in and paralyze all your guys in fear(Right after NGS mindshackles the Wyvern, of course)!


In all seriousness, we'll just have to wait and see how well X17 does!

[The Orange Mailman]

When I first viewed the Wyvern's Talon Grab ability, I thought that it was a real game changer. But after having played a handful of times with one or two of them in an army, it doesn't seem like this figure has overly changed the game. Granted, I haven't gone up against an army that is overly reliant on Raelin, but I did recently have a battle in which one time it was definitely NOT to my advantage to talon grab, and the other time it was.

Here was the match-up.

Spiders x 2
Wyvern x 2
4th Massachusetts x 3
Drake (ROTV)
600 points

against

Mohican River Tribe x 3
Brave Heart
Axegrinders x 2
Darrak Ambershard
Migol Ironwill
Water Elemental x 1
600 points

In one instance, my first Wyvern alighted where he had height advantage against Migol. I thought about Talon Grab, but the result would be the loss of height advantage. So I kept the Wyvern there, using him and 4th Massachusetts to bring Migol down. Keeping Migol away from the high ground where he could gain the height advantage was more important.

In the second instance, after the first Wyvern had been taken down by dwarves, I had the chance to engage Darrak with the second Wyvern. He was over in one corner of the board with a couple of Dwarves and Tribesmen. I realized that his Sneak Attack power could prove detrimental. So after the initial engagement and attack (inflicting one wound or so), I disengaged, used Talon Grab, and carried him over to the other corner where the Wyvern disposed of him there away from his companions.

It wasn't a major earth shattering blow, but one of many throughout the game. In every battle there may not be the huge opportunity, but perhaps a small scale tipping point. Talon Grab can prove useful in certain situations, but not every situation.

[killercactus]

I've found Talon Grab to be very useful. My favorite uses of it so far are:

1. Pick up a figure and drop it so it's engaged to 3 Spiders. Then, if the Wyvern fails to kill it, you can try and Entangle it while moving and attacking with 3 different Spiders (if you want).
2. Pick up a blocker or screen figure and move it so the Spiders can get at the important units.
3. Pick up a figure on height and move it down
4. Pick up a figure in Raelin's aura and drop it outside of Raelin's aura.
5. Pick up Raelin and drop her onto a hex where a bunch of Estivara-boosted Spiders can get high ground on the same turn, and wreck her (this works for pretty much any hero, but I love killing Raelin)