The Book of Gladiatrons

[rdhight]

Originally Posted by netherspirit

From the FAQ, Chomp is worded with no indication that it is optional, yet it was ruled to be an optional ability. That sets a precedent that any power that doesn't indicate whether its optional or mandatory should be conidered optional until ruled otherwise.

That was what I was basing my guess/preference on-- no "must" in the text, so it must be optional. Oh, well. Here's hoping someone at Gencon can appeal this one to the Supreme Court.

[TheMainMan]

Originally Posted by Cavalier

CYBERCLAW IS OPTIONAL!

Cyberclaw is optional for the Gladiatron. He can not however give an enemy the ability to go ahead on by.

[tsukifu]

I wish it were optional, and we'll continue to play that way informally, but I'm not buying any of this stuff about how it has to be considered optional because doesn't say "must." It's a negative ability--it doesn't demand that you do something but it does demand that an opponent NOT do something.

Originally Posted by card

All small or medium opponent's figures that enter or occupy a space adjacent to any Gladiatron may not move. Figures affected by the Cyberclaw cannot be moved by any special power on an Army Card or Glyph.

I guess they could've added a line that specifically says "Cyberclaw cannot be turned off," or something to that effect, but I'm not sure I see a real graceful way to phrase the card so that it includes that magic word "must" and makes it clear it's not optional. To me, the words "may not" could very reasonably be seen as the negative equivalent of "must."

[Homba]

I see that the WotC "ruling" is just a "quickie WotC ruling" with no indication of having been sent to Craig. So it is no better than the opinion of someone on this site.

If someone asks Craig at Gencon, for goodness sake make sure he has a free minute where you can explain the question to him, the various scenarios, and the consequences of ruling one way or the other. This is not a simple question.

1) Jotun throwing an enemy fig currently clawed by a Glad friendly to Jotun. Can the Glad release his grip so that Jotun can throw the enemy?

2) Bargained-for release in a free-for-all game resulting from a temporary alliance. If a clawed fig promises (non-binding of course) to go attack a third party, can the Glad player agree to release him?

3) A cyberclawed Marcu switching control, and the newly controling player wanting to release the cyberclaw ... wait, that's not even an issue since when control switched Marcu would be friendly to the Glad and could freely move past, right?

In essence, is Cyberclaw "always on" or is using the power at the discretion of the Gladiatron (or MajorX17) player? (But the scenarios help clarify the issue a lot).

H

[rdhight]

We're all right on No. 3.

[Homba]

Compare: Flying. "When counting spaces for Nilfheim's movement, ignore elevations." Is Flying "always on," or is it discretionary?

Of course we now know Flying is discretionary - even though it orders you to ignore elevations when counting spaces for movement.

Insisting that Cyberclaw is always on is IMO like insisting that Flying is always on. There are two (well, three) problems with this:

1. It is contrary to a most basic level of common sense. I am not talking about "realistic rationalization" - I'm talking about something much more basic than that - call it the avoidance of blatant absurdity. Can the Glad consciously open his claw or not? The FAQ already tells us he can, when he judges it to be to his tactical advantage - if he feels so compelled to leave engagement that he's willing to risk a leaving swipe. It is consistent with the theme embodied in this FAQ ruling (a soulborg able to make tactical decisions) that the soulborg can release the claw in other situations if judged to be tactically advantageous (allied Jotun wants to throw the victim into lava).

2. It needlessly - let me emphasize Needlessly, because it is a ruling of choice, not of necessity - eliminates a subtle flexibility that makes the game more interesting (more tactical choices) without significantly impacting game balance.

3. Contrary to the unambiguous order to ignore elevations when counting spaces for movement, Flying is NOT always on.

If one pauses for a moment from a rigidly formalistic, "blinders on" approach and acknowledges other rulings (including one Glad-specific ruling), one defaults to the conclusion that Cyberclaw is discretionary. And IMO a discretionary cyberclaw is good for the game.

H

[tsukifu]

Yeah, it was clearly a quickie answer.

While I still don't agree that the wording of Cyberclaw makes it obvious it should be optional, I totally agree that it could be seen that way and--more importantly--that the game is much better with it that way.

Homba, you make about the best point I've heard anyone make as for a reason why it should be optional:

Originally Posted by Homba

Can the Glad consciously open his claw or not? The FAQ already tells us he can, when he judges it to be to his tactical advantage - if he feels compelled to leave engagement.

Totally right--if the Glad can choose to leave the engagement, then he should also be able to choose to let the other figure leave it. That's pretty hard to refute, I'd say.

[MrBarkypants]

BTW, Large figs. negate the cyberclaw.

[Hex_Enduction_Hour]

Originally Posted by TexMex

Maybe it's just me, but is anyone else pissed off that these guys - having the same root as "gladiators" - are hunters. I mean, they could have actually made Sparticus useful! Maybe this is just my quibble...

Someone else had mentioned this at one time. Caravaggio or somebody.
Gladiatrons as 'Gladiators' might've given the Blasts/Glads combo too much of an edge if they were drafted with Spartacus.

Granted, Spartcus's influence would mean no movement bonding/activation with the Blasts, but 3 attack and 4 defense for any given round would be hardcore for a four-man, Cyber Clawing, Melee Defense bonusing, common squad.

Then the following round would see the Homing Device kick in. And that would be pure devastating, if not already.

[Zeus Jupiter]

So, how's this for a competitive Soulborg themed tourney army?

500 Points
2xGladiatrons-160 points
Blastatrons-60 points
Major Q9-180 points
Major X17-100 points

I've never played at a tournament, so I don't know what the usual point limit is, but if it were a 500 point battle setup, I think this army would pretty much rule. And this army looks really cool on the field. Nice color scheme. Maybe throwing Carr in there instead of X17 would give it a little more of an edge, but if you're big into themes, then it works well just how it is.

[ThrasherDarkrai]

Originally Posted by Zeus Jupiter

So, how's this for a competitive Soulborg themed tourney army?

500 Points
2xGladiatrons-160 points
Blastatrons-60 points
Major Q9-180 points
Major X17-100 points

I've never played at a tournament, so I don't know what the usual point limit is, but if it were a 500 point battle setup, I think this army would pretty much rule. And this army looks really cool on the field. Nice color scheme. Maybe throwing Carr in there instead of X17 would give it a little more of an edge, but if you're big into themes, then it works well just how it is.

Major X17 is a waste when you already have 2 glads. Remove him.
With that, add another squad of Blasts, and Isamu/Guilty.

[Hero Hot Hatch]

I own two squads of these guys. I've been dying to test them, but I want the Blastratrons to play these with. I don't have those yet. It should be a lot of fun. I've been looking for a range/hand combat combination that holds the line for range units. Talking about holding the line with cyberclaw and 4 defense these guys can do the job and the Gladiatrons' bonding with the Blastratrons should be a "Blast" to play. No wonder they are so popular. Not only can they hold the line literally, but boost the attack of the Blastratrons better than with height advantage. It should be an interesting combination to counteract an Orc army's ability to bond and disengage or stealth flying abilities such as the EIs. This combo should be good against vampires, too.

Another good squad for holding the line is the Sentinels of course, but the Gladiatrons are more, cost less and boost offense of the Blastratrons. Moreover, small or medium size opponents can't disengage a Gladiatron and sneak in.