BoSS Battlefront - Brainstorming Phase

[Porkins]

I liked the SZ CP's on Mygeeto (only 1 game so far). Maybe it works because Mygeeto is a larger map, but I liked that it forced you to defend the SZ area, not just empty it.

[TREX]

Thats how it played as well. I left a figure there to keep the other team from overtaking it.

[Yodaking]

As previously mentioned I hosted a Heroscape event last Friday night. There were 6 of us in attendance and I had set up 3 two player scenarios and 1 four player scenario for us to rotate through. One station had Scarif set up with the Battlefront rules and armies. That map only ended up getting played once. The two players were a friend who had just recently moved back after a few years away and had not played Heroscape the whole time he was away, so a bit rusty on the Heroscape rules themselves, and the other player was a regular C3G player of our but had never played HoSS before, so new to all the cards being used. I explained the Battlefront rules to them and left a print out of the rules for them to reference, then took off to play my own game so I didn't see exactly how it played out but I did talk to them afterwards.

They never had any questions or concerns with the Battlefront rules system at all so I think we are good on that front. They also both enjoyed playing the game even though it didn't end up being all that close. It was the Rebels vs. the Empire and the Empire player ended up throwing in the towel once the last of his squad figures was taken out. He had hero figures left in play but the Rebels still had a pretty big force and it was clear he would not be able to contest enough control points to have any hope of mounting a comeback. This outcome seemed to have a lot to do with some pretty lopsided luck. The Empire player said he had a successful Ozzel surprise attack roll only to watch every single attack he made either miss or get blocked. Then the Rebel player at one point had Derlin bond with a Rebel Heavy Gunner and went 5 for 5, getting a kill with every attack he made. I've never had that kind of good fortune with the RHG, only rolling 2 att. dice you don't often get a skull on all 4 attacks much less have the opponent fail to block 4 times in a row as well.

That being said, the Rebel player also mentioned how significant being able to move 7 figures at once using the Rebel Capt. & Rebel Troopers was for him. He was able to get an early lead going as a result. I asked him is any of the control points changed hands and he did say that the Empire was able to take the middle glyph at one point but then he retook it on the next round.

So while I think we are set on the rules and game play experience, I'm not so sure all armies are created equal in this format. It seems as though some units will see a big increase in their ranking when playing in this format. Rebel Captain & Thugs are the two I have seen have a significant impact. I can imagine that the Tusken Raiders and perhaps the Ewoks could also be pretty good with their large numbers. I also think we need to test what kind of impact the Imperial Officer & Bib Fortuna have on a game. With those two units able to bring back dead figures they may be able to win every Battlefront game they play not against each other.

Not sure what to do about it, if anything. Maybe just including with the rules a list of recommended armies or tips for army building specifically for Battlefront. That way players are at least aware of what a winning army looks like.

[TREX]

I too like the simplicity and balance of the rules. I think it will be a matter of metagame just as regular competitive is. I wouldnt worry too much with are units that respawn units. It will make people strategize differently. Glad to hear positive feedback here.

[Porkins]

I liked the Battlefront rules too. I have a bunch of comments about the Mygeeto map that I'll post in that thread...hopefully I'll have a chance to type that up tonight. Here are my comments about the Battlefront rules:

- I realize that we are using a working draft right now, but I think the rules will need a fairly significant rewrite to make things clear. For example, the rules say that control points are captured "At the end of a round." The rules also say that the Wannok wounding happens "At the end of each round." I think we all know instinctively that the control points change hands and then the wounding, but the rules will need to be clear.

- I liked the 5 control points; it didn't feel like too many. You'll usually be split 3/2 for one wound or 4/1 for three wounds. On a map with 3 CP's, you'll be split 2/1 for one wound or 3/0 for three wounds. I don't think it's likely to be 5/0 on a 5 CP map. On a map with an even number, say four CP's, you'll either be 2/2 or jump to 3/1 for two wounds, with no granularity between zero and two wounds. In fact, having even more CP's should actually increase the granularity. Say there are 7 CP's: now you have 4/3, 5/2, 6/1 but also more likely to have uncaptured CP's because you'd have to risk spreading thin. So you might have 2/3, 3/1, 4/2, etc. One thing we could do to prevent runaway victories is to limit the wounding to a maximum of 2 wounds per round.

- I like the teleporting mechanic a lot. It speeds up the game, especially on big maps, by getting figures to the front lines. One thing I would change: the rules allow the person who won initiative to place first. I think this is too powerful because it gives the person too much information to use for placing figures. Imagine on an initiative switch: one player attacks at the end of the round, then gets to attack first in the next round knowing exactly where he should teleport the figures to do maximum damage. I think that, like placing OM's, the teleportation should happen before rolling for initiative. This adds uncertainty to it and forces you to plan with contingency in mind like you would for OM's where you don't know who you will get to use first. Maybe have the person who went first in the previous round teleport first.


I think this Game Mode is great. It's still Heroscape, but with an interesting focus on area control that normal Heroscape tournament style games doesn't have. I give it

[TREX]

Glad you like it as much as I do @Porkins . Its simple. Its heroscape. Its battlefront. The turrets make it super fun right? I love the turret placement on mygeeto.

[Porkins]

The turrets are good, but that middle section needs more cover and less water.

[White Knight]

Reading about the auto-wounding gap with control points, I'm wondering if it would work better to have each person roll an attack dice for each control point they control. Skulls from one team would cancel skulls from the other team, and then any extra skulls would be placed as wounds.

On average:
1:0 --> .5 wounds
2:0 --> 1 wound
2:1 --> .5 wounds
3:0 --> 1.5 wounds
3:1 --> 1 wound
3:2 --> .5 wounds
4:0 --> 2 wounds
4:1 --> 1.5 wounds
5:0 --> 2.5 wounds

It's not as predictable, but it prevents one team from completely dominating with wounds.

Just a thought...

[TREX]

@White Knight , I like the idea, but you have to really work to control the glyphs( On mygeeto anyways) On the battlefront game if you capture the control point the enemies forces dwindle. Say you have horrible luck and cant roll any skulls yet you are dominating all the control points? I think that would be a fail for theme. If you can dominate the control points the wound is well rewarded. In the game we played on it was very rare that we got to wound more than 2 times. Most of it was 1 time. It was a very gradual decline with the wounds, just fighting for the glyphs is where most of the casualties were awarded.

[Yodaking]

I also prefer the auto wound approach over the gamble. In the early and middle rounds the control points captured is usually even or an advantage of 1. You would really have to pull off some good bit of tactics and luck to get an advantage of 2. It is only at the end of the game when one team may be running out of figures that the advantage can start to grow, but that too I suppose is accurate to how the video game played.

[japes]

Originally Posted by Porkins

I liked the Battlefront rules too. I have a bunch of comments about the Mygeeto map that I'll post in that thread...hopefully I'll have a chance to type that up tonight. Here are my comments about the Battlefront rules:

- I realize that we are using a working draft right now, but I think the rules will need a fairly significant rewrite to make things clear. For example, the rules say that control points are captured "At the end of a round." The rules also say that the Wannok wounding happens "At the end of each round." I think we all know instinctively that the control points change hands and then the wounding, but the rules will need to be clear.

- I liked the 5 control points; it didn't feel like too many. You'll usually be split 3/2 for one wound or 4/1 for three wounds. On a map with 3 CP's, you'll be split 2/1 for one wound or 3/0 for three wounds. I don't think it's likely to be 5/0 on a 5 CP map. On a map with an even number, say four CP's, you'll either be 2/2 or jump to 3/1 for two wounds, with no granularity between zero and two wounds. In fact, having even more CP's should actually increase the granularity. Say there are 7 CP's: now you have 4/3, 5/2, 6/1 but also more likely to have uncaptured CP's because you'd have to risk spreading thin. So you might have 2/3, 3/1, 4/2, etc. One thing we could do to prevent runaway victories is to limit the wounding to a maximum of 2 wounds per round.

- I like the teleporting mechanic a lot. It speeds up the game, especially on big maps, by getting figures to the front lines. One thing I would change: the rules allow the person who won initiative to place first. I think this is too powerful because it gives the person too much information to use for placing figures. Imagine on an initiative switch: one player attacks at the end of the round, then gets to attack first in the next round knowing exactly where he should teleport the figures to do maximum damage. I think that, like placing OM's, the teleportation should happen before rolling for initiative. This adds uncertainty to it and forces you to plan with contingency in mind like you would for OM's where you don't know who you will get to use first. Maybe have the person who went first in the previous round teleport first.


I think this Game Mode is great. It's still Heroscape, but with an interesting focus on area control that normal Heroscape tournament style games doesn't have. I give it

The cap of two wounds seems like a good idea to me. My goal is to prevent too much of the runaway winner syndrome and capping it at two seems like it works. You already have an advantage in having more spaces to teleport to.

Maximizing the CP's seems cool too since you do have that added strategy of trying not to spread yourself too thin.

[TREX]

When you play a scenario how we have it currently youll find its quite hard to wound more than twice in a round end. With 5 control points each team will grab the closer on to their sz and then take the next closer one and fight for whats left. By the time you might get 4 out of 5 to wound 3 times the game should be close to being over anyways.