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C3G Library This area collects all the released designs. Feel free to post any figure specific questions in their individual books.


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  #229  
Old December 13th, 2021, 11:36 PM
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Re: The Book of Doctor Doom (Sorcerer)

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Originally Posted by IAmBatman View Post
Sure, but do the algebra: that doesn’t answer whether swapping = modification or not.
For sure, I was more just ruminating.

By the logic that was used during the re-roll debate, re-rolls don't count as modification, because they are not adding/subtracting dice, adding/subtracting auto-skulls, etc. They are merely allowing you to achieve a result that was always possible, through the method of giving you a second chance at rolling the dice.

By that logic, I do think swaps fall under the same category as re-rolls, and would not be 'modifying.'
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  #230  
Old December 14th, 2021, 02:48 PM
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Re: The Book of Doctor Doom (Sorcerer)

I'd rule that re-rolls are modifying a roll too.

I see the semantic argument about how allowing a re-roll isn't modifying the SA. But you're absolutely for sure changing the actual roll.
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  #231  
Old December 15th, 2021, 12:51 PM
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Re: The Book of Doctor Doom (Sorcerer)

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Originally Posted by Ronin View Post
I'd rule that re-rolls are modifying a roll too.

I see the semantic argument about how allowing a re-roll isn't modifying the SA. But you're absolutely for sure changing the actual roll.
I agreed with you back then, but that was definitely the line we drew in the sand when it came to soft-breaking the "SAs can't be modified" rule.

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Yeah, I can see the logic there. I’m guessing we’d extend that same logic to D20 rolls as well? So stuff like Lodin and Sage can’t mess with SA D20 rolls but Constantine can? B5 is kind of a weird corner case, just cause his power kind of operates on a “higher level” than other D20 modifiers.
Yeah, that's how I see it. He's not adding/subtracting from the roll, he's just forcing you to redo it.
(And yeah, the standard argument about "powers can always break rules.")
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  #232  
Old December 16th, 2021, 10:30 AM
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Re: The Book of Doctor Doom (Sorcerer)

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Originally Posted by MrNobody View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronin View Post
I'd rule that re-rolls are modifying a roll too.

I see the semantic argument about how allowing a re-roll isn't modifying the SA. But you're absolutely for sure changing the actual roll.
I agreed with you back then, but that was definitely the line we drew in the sand when it came to soft-breaking the "SAs can't be modified" rule.
Adding dice to SAs gets real messy real quick. They're balanced around a certain number of dice used, and then there are some that give you a dice pool to roll with multiple times. Doesn't work cleanly. Rerolls don't change the actual mechanics of SAs, just gives you a do-over. So even though you're totally changing the roll, you're not modifying the SA itself, or changing how it works. If that makes sense.
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  #233  
Old December 16th, 2021, 10:43 AM
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Re: The Book of Doctor Doom (Sorcerer)

Because of the hard "no modifying special attacks rule," I'll agree that a reroll isn't "modifying" and that we've firmly established that precedent at this point.

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  #234  
Old December 16th, 2021, 11:14 AM
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Re: The Book of Doctor Doom (Sorcerer)

I think that's a bad definition of modification and we'd be better served by admitting we're not following the "no SA modification" bit.
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  #235  
Old December 16th, 2021, 11:18 AM
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Re: The Book of Doctor Doom (Sorcerer)

"No SA modification" isn't a sacred cow for me, so you won't hear argument from me. I'm just acknowledging the current reality of our precedent. If the Heroes want to change that, I'm not opposed.

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