I won ! (...but I'm so disappointed...)

[Grungebob]

somewhere I'm sure!

[morgonis]

back to the original post where your 8yr old son ran sobbing from the room.....may have been a prime time to teach him several rules of life...such as "finish what you start", "dont give up", and "how to lose"

my father never played any games with me until i was 8, then he taught me otherllo and chess (hes 2 favorite games) he never once went easy on me and i was 15 before i had won a game of chess against him, STILL havent won Othello yet btw (im 30 incidently)..

whats my point?...if my father had went easy on me and let me win sooner, i would have prolly expected much in life to work out if i only tried a little and trusted on everything else involved to fall my way instead of working hard for it and in essence makeing it happen.

no offense ment, everyone raises their children different, just seems many of the kids these days are held back from the realitys to much...no offense, just my opnion

[Double Oak]

Back to one of our subdiscussions in this thread

Good to know we have so many sons in the local HS group! As I get to know the folks better, will definitely get some Dad/son games going here in DFW area.

Figures that my son is going to be outta town on the next local game day - ah but there are many game days ahead!

[Mr. Underhill]

Originally Posted by Aranas

Anything similar happened to you?

No. You ara a cold, heartless bastard!

I've got 4 squids, and play mostly with my 9 year old. Sometimes he wins, sometimes he loses.

I agree with the sentiments expressed earlier in this thread: kids need to learn that they can't win all the time. They need to observe their role model being a gracious winner and a good loser - so that they can learn to be the same.

On occasion I have played with a handicap to even the game up a little. Junior has more points to draft than me for example - I get 400 and he gets 500. Alternatively, I'll draft 400 and junior can pick whomever he likes for his team.

You could also place glyphs closer to his starting position.

I reckon the example you've cited, whilst not impossible, would not be a regular occurence - namely the AE drop right off the kick-off into his zone. This teaches the little ones that chance can deal all sorts of kooky events - which can be undesirable for someone and fortunate for others.

Here endeth my child psychology session.


Mr. Underhill

[Aranas]

Fun to exchange with you on this subject Mr Underhill, despite the distance. Perth Australia! I hope you get better distribution of HeroScape products than up here in Canada...

Back on the subjet, one thing my son is still unable to accept is to loose a DeathWalker in the first round. I suggested to him to draft other figures but those big robots are soo cool!

[Mr. Underhill]

Yeah, my boys are the same. Sometimes they can't see past the first impression.

There have been several occasions when they've drafted Mimring, Grimnak, DW9K, etc only to have them wiped out by seemingly minor characters.

Kids are kids, and they're pretty much the same whether they're Aussie kids or Canadian kids. This offers us a great opportunity to teach them to look beyond the external features and examine each character for their hidden talents or weaknesses. I'm not saying that this is always applicable in the real world, but it may just be.

For me, the best part is talking my boys through the choices that they are making whilst at the same time, letting them make mistakes of their own and discussing what they could have done differently.

I agree with other comments made earlier: generations of today are victims of being mollycoddled by over-protective parents/carers. It's finding the right balance though, and I reckon playing games (like HS) offers us a great opportunity to bond with and teach our kids in a safe environment.

You gotta look at yourself as a father and see if you're like Homer J. Simpson, Ned Flanders or somewhere in between.

When I was a kid, my dad used to tell me, "A man who never made a mistake, never made f@*k all!" Admittedly he was not a cultured fellow, and his language was rather colourful, but I still got the message.



Mr. Underhill

[DoesntCompute]

I tried something different with my oldest (10) last weekend. We were playing Chess and usually, I talk about the moves he could make or why he should have done something different and he has started to get frustrated. Last weekend, I said, "let's play a learning game." The idea was not to win but to learn. Both of us explained what we were trying to do with our moves and then we discussed whether that was a good plan. I would tell him that I was moving piece X so that I could pin his pawn with my next move. We would then figure out together what his best options were to avoid the trap I was setting. We both learned a lot and there were no hard feelings because the stated goal was to learn not to win.

[Mr. Underhill]

Originally Posted by DoesntCompute

I tried something different with my oldest (10) last weekend....

Choice! Great stuff, that could be applied to HS play with the little people, eh?



Mr. Underhill

[markwars]

Let me start by saying that I am lucky enough to live in the DFW area, so I do get my chances to play other adults from time to time. But on a day to day basis my only HS partner is my six year-old son (he'll be seven at the end of this summer). There was very little chance that he wouldn't initially like this game. It has cool figures (which he likes regardless of the game) and buildable terrain (which he also likes regardless of the game) so he's going to want to play with the pieces no matter what. As a dad my wish is that by the time he's 9 or 10 he'll be a competent player that can at the very least hold his own against other kids his age. And my dream is that he will love to play this game with me even when he's visiting me in the nursing home. So I have had to strategize about my very approach to Heroscape.

There are two things that I am really really trying to avoid. Number One is making my son hate this game because of the way I play it. Number Two is giving him a bad attitude about winning or losing. It's a double edged sword. On the one hand I can teach him by example and dust him game after game and tell him "that's life". On the other hand I can let him beat me to give him that carrot while foregoing any real life lessons thus indulging my desire to have him play me. Neither of those seemed like much fun so I've taken a different approach. There are ways to show kids the nuances of the game while letting them feel in control. Here are some of the ways we play...

Unit vs. Unit play - This way of playing came to me after participating in Kentak's awesome "last man standing" event last year. What we do is simply play one card vs one card. It's very useful when we get new figures to just try them out and see how they work in game play. It's also very quick and if my son loses there's twenty more matches within an hour. As long as he is occasionally winning and we keep switching up units his attention is locked on.

He Drafts - This way of playing has taught me more about the game than him perhaps. I always let him know that he better give me a crummy army because when we play this way I give no quarter. Typically he will select about 800 points worth of large figures and heroes and I'll be stuck with about 200 points worth of figures he doesn't particularly like. This method has taught me how to utilize figures I myself would never choose and how to capitalize on better figures' weaknesses. By letting your kids decide on your army they can also learn that perceived crappy figures can sometimes be really good and that the figures everyone likes have problems too. After about a year of this kind of play I know he is getting smarter because he's making better and better decisions about which figures to give me to ensure a win for himself. He may not be making macro-level strategy decisions yet, but having a good knowledge of what figures do what is paying off for him.

Scenario play rather than Match play - This is a way to play that both of us enjoy. We build a huge map, place all sorts of baddies on it, and then let him choose a force to achieve the objective with. The good things about this...it teaches him how to build good maps, it teaches him how draft an army based on his opponent, and it never puts me in the villains seat. I'm merely the Dungeon Master (so to speak) and he's the only participant. If he loses he doesn't feel like Dad beat him, and if he needs advice along the way he feels like it's fair to ask me.

These are the three most effective ways I've found to keep his interest and ego intact. These types of play also serve my own selfish desire to train my son to be a Heroscape master.

Having said all that there are still times where I feel like it's appropriate to play him straight up draft matches and either beat him or let him win. It's my job as a parent to know when the appropriate type of play is needed. Heck sometimes it's best to not even use the rules and instead chuck marbles at figures in his sandbox.

[Mr. Underhill]

markwars,

Wow! Fantastic ideas. I like the "one on one" play, and the "He drafts" concepts. Thanks mate!

As I've said before, I play mostly with master 9 yr. But I also have master 11yr that I'd like to play with and especially have some quality time with. Problem is, he is autistic and doesn't function the same as my other kids, but I really want to have the same fun with him as I do with master 9.

His developmental disorder means that he is sometimes rigid and concrete in his thinking, so your play methods have given me some valuable inspiration that may help me get my little disabled boy having some fun with his brother and I.

Thanks again!!


Mr. Underhill

[markwars]

You put it all in perspective Mr. Underhill. Good luck with your pursuit. I wish you all the success in the world.

[Kepler]

I play with my 4.5 yo and I let him win a lot, but some times he gets mad if he wins to much and we have to keep playing until I win.

If my kids cries when he loses a game when he is 8 then it will be time for a serious talk about sportsmanship.