Casters of Valhalla

[OEAO]

Matthew, William, and I are streaming the Online 4x4 Finals right now on Matthew's twitch (Filthe).

Edit: Link to video below. We commentate Dok vs Vegie, the end of Cody vs Sir HeroScape, and then chat about some team formats.

https://m.twitch.tv/videos/663219317

[vegietarian18]

Thanks for recording the match. It was fun to watch it back.

Just briefly on why I moved Nerak down instead of just pinging with MBS for +1 attack and Paralyzing Stare at the end. Nerak up on the road was physically blocking Deathchasers from getting an attack on the 4th that he was engaged with, so sending him deep into the startzone gave me one more attack. Also using Nerak like this pinned the 4th deep in their own startzone; they could Wait then Fire down Nerak but I don't really care since that gives me time to get my last Deathchasers up and finish the 4th off with the help of height MBS later.

People often play the Nerak MBS combo either too much like cheerleaders or too much like bruiser bonders when really Nerak and MBS are each a mix of both and you need to use them that way.

[OEAO]

Originally Posted by vegietarian18

Thanks for recording the match. It was fun to watch it back.

Just briefly on why I moved Nerak down instead of just pinging with MBS for +1 attack and Paralyzing Stare at the end. Nerak up on the road was physically blocking Deathchasers from getting an attack on the 4th that he was engaged with, so sending him deep into the startzone gave me one more attack. Also using Nerak like this pinned the 4th deep in their own startzone; they could Wait then Fire down Nerak but I don't really care since that gives me time to get my last Deathchasers up and finish the 4th off with the help of height MBS later.

People often play the Nerak MBS combo either too much like cheerleaders or too much like bruiser bonders when really Nerak and MBS are each a mix of both and you need to use them that way.

That’s really interesting. I’m very inexperienced with the army (I’ve only played DCs a handful of times), but that makes a lot of sense. Congrats on the win!

[caps]

Still listening to the first two part mega episode and I had a couple thoughts

1) would you ever consider splashing DCs? Probably just 1x because 2x is too big of a commitment. If your army has Raelin they can sit pretty near your start zone until you have an opportunity to spring them out for a few attacks. You could also use them to grab valda to speed up the development of the rest of your army. They don't even need to hold it; just grab it for a couple OMs.

2) it made me laugh that you say good players know why they win and why they lose. My wife hates it when I analyze a game afterwards "if I had only done X I probably would have won" or "if I hadn't done Y I probably would not have lost" etc.

[OEAO]

Originally Posted by capsocrates

Still listening to the first two part mega episode and I had a couple thoughts

1) would you ever consider splashing DCs? Probably just 1x because 2x is too big of a commitment. If your army has Raelin they can sit pretty near your start zone until you have an opportunity to spring them out for a few attacks. You could also use them to grab valda to speed up the development of the rest of your army. They don't even need to hold it; just grab it for a couple OMs.

2) it made me laugh that you say good players know why they win and why they lose. My wife hates it when I analyze a game afterwards "if I had only done X I probably would have won" or "if I hadn't done Y I probably would not have lost" etc.

Thanks for listening! The second one becomes pretty ramble-y, so feel free to skip it.

I've been toying around with some mixed bonding armies (Death Chasers and Romans, and Death Chasers and Heavies/Blades, although I haven't been completely satisfied with any of my builds). They're definitely really interesting with only 1-2 squads because they threaten so much of the map pretty much immediately. Fewer than 3 squads of Death Chasers is pretty much Lewis and Clark territory, so to speak. I don't know if anyone's really done it, but if you can crack the code, I think there's a lot of potential.

As for #2... Well, you're a good player, so it checks out! But seriously, that's the most important thing one can do to improve. What happened, why did it happen, what should I have done differently to make this thing happen better, etc. I try to find at least one-two mistakes in every game I play, win or lose. The big thing to remember is to not overanalyze during the game and go on tilt- a lot of people have that problem ("Oh, I screwed that up", and then they focus on that mistake, causing them to make more mistakes, which they then reflect on, which leads to more mistakes...) The best thing you can do during the game is say, "I messed that up", and then move on as if it's an entirely fresh game with the current board state as the start of the "new game".

[vegietarian18]

I've certainly tried Deathchaser splash before since I like Deathchasers a lot. It's really hard imo. DCs are a 3 man squad with two defense, four with Raelin. It's just so easy for them to die. Not just one to limit your activations but all 3 and then your bonder is useless. It's along the same line as splashing Venocs to be honest.

Deathchasers I do think have a diminishing return effect with 5+ squads though since the battle rush is less impactful if you're just walking across your startzone. Part of the reason my 3x DC build was able to succeed is because you can get all the best spots out of the startzone with only 9 orcs, the extra orcs just go to worse and worse spots.

Regardless the best splash squads are defensive ones. I think IS's build from last year is pretty instructive if you want to learn how to make splash armies. It's so plain but that's kind of the point.

[OEAO]

Originally Posted by vegietarian18

I've certainly tried Deathchaser splash before since I like Deathchasers a lot. It's really hard imo. DCs are a 3 man squad with two defense, four with Raelin. It's just so easy for them to die. Not just one to limit your activations but all 3 and then your bonder is useless. It's along the same line as splashing Venocs to be honest.

If anyone has, it’s you!

I meant more in a tourney; I don’t think anyone’s brought 1-2x Death Chasers to Main Event.

@Cleon really likes 1x Venocs...

[OEAO]

I’m not sure that the best splash squads are defensive. While you do want some defensive ones, I think there’s a lot of value in having a squad of bruisers (be it Kozuke, or Horned Skulls, or Death Chasers). While Death Chasers are the most fragile, I think they’re a good budget option that someone could make work.

[Dysole]

If I'm splashing 1x Vippers why am I not splashing 1x Rats?

I really liked fomox's Armoc Vipers x2 and Mittens in 2017 (I think). The rest of the army is interesting for different reasons, but I like that as an offensive splash (although probably a bit expensive as a splash but maybe in a bigger build) since it is very fast and has enough staying power to actually be able to do some real offensive damage.

~Dysole, who did really like IS's build from last year

[OEAO]

Originally Posted by Dysole

If I'm splashing 1x Vippers why am I not splashing 1x Rats?

I really liked fomox's Armoc Vipers x2 and Mittens in 2017 (I think). The rest of the army is interesting for different reasons, but I like that as an offensive splash (although probably a bit expensive as a splash but maybe in a bigger build) since it is very fast and has enough staying power to actually be able to do some real offensive damage.

~Dysole, who did really like IS's build from last year

I think Vipers fill a very different role than Rats. Power level would be another reason; 1x Rats is good.

[vegietarian18]

Kozuke and Horned Skull Brutes are both good choices as offensive splashers but they both have abilities that allow them to hide further back from the battle and then rush in on one single turn, and +1/2 defense relative to Deathchasers. It's not unworkable (nothing is unworkable in RtW really) but it's just hard.

[Dysole]

I mean I guess, but at the same time if I'm down to my last 40 and figuring out what to do with it, I'm probably more looking for something to smooth matchups than a strike force. It's also in my opinion much easier to play 1x rats wrong than it is to play 1x vipers wrong.

~Dysole, who will admit her army building strategies aren't what everyone follows