The Book of Nightcrawler (Kurt Wagner) (II)

[Spidey'tilIDie]

It's important to note that the smell of brimstone also accompanies his Bamfing, so enhanced senses can help a person be prepared for him. I'd be in favor of 4 attack if we made it a Carry OR sneak attack choice. Seems very cool and I'm in favor of tough strategic decisions. I mean imagine he Bamfs with a Mutant Sidekick. Super cool to drop them at an intended target with the first Bamf then move on without them to sneak attack two others, then they get that activation. (I may have turn order mixed up, but still works if the Prof is doing his thing. Which brings up, does this guy make Angel obsolete?)

[japes]

Originally Posted by Spidey'tilIDie

It's important to note that the smell of brimstone also accompanies his Bamfing, so enhanced senses can help a person be prepared for him. I'd be in favor of 4 attack if we made it a Carry OR sneak attack choice. Seems very cool and I'm in favor of tough strategic decisions. I mean imagine he Bamfs with a Mutant Sidekick. Super cool to drop them at an intended target with the first Bamf then move on without them to sneak attack two others, then they get that activation. (I may have turn order mixed up, but still works if the Prof is doing his thing. Which brings up, does this guy make Angel obsolete?)

Has to be adjacent where Angle lets you be spaces away. So I don't think so.

[Arkham]

I don’t believe Angel would be made obsolete by Nightcrawler. For one, the point difference still makes Angel a nice filler support unit. Mainly though, Angel will work better defensively, as he can carry further defensively and his triggers within 3 clear sight spaces rather than adjacently. Not to mention offensively Nightcrawler would have to burn a BAMF! or two just to get adjacent to grab someone to carry. So he’ll still have his usefulness. That said, Nightcrawler is absolutely supposed to be a premiere mobility support unit.

As for the power change, I guess it depends on how it’s worded. Is it that if he carries anyone in his turn that disqualifies him to the -1, or is it only after that particular BAMF! that he won’t get the -1 it he chooses to attack. Essentially, are we suggesting it’s all or nothing, or does each BAMF! give him a new opportunity? I’m assuming by your latest example that the latter is the case, in which BAMF! 1 he carries someone, BAMF! 2 he attacks with -1, BAMF! 3 he carries someone and attacks. If that were the case, and people are open to a bump to 4 attack, I wouldn’t be opposed if that’s the direction the majority prefer.

[Spidey'tilIDie]

Still has that protect and save feel though, you know what I mean? That's a good point though, so maybe just a different option instead of replacing Angel.

[Spidey'tilIDie]

Originally Posted by Arkham

I don’t believe Angel would be made obsolete by Nightcrawler. For one, the point difference still makes Angel a nice filler support unit. Mainly though, Angel will work better defensively, as he can carry further defensively and his triggers within 3 clear sight spaces rather than adjacently. Not to mention offensively Nightcrawler would have to burn a BAMF! or two just to get adjacent to grab someone to carry. So he’ll still have his usefulness. That said, Nightcrawler is absolutely supposed to be a premiere mobility support unit.

As for the power change, I guess it depends on how it’s worded. Is it that if he carries anyone in his turn that disqualifies him to the -1, or is it only after that particular BAMF! that he won’t get the -1 it he chooses to attack. Essentially, are we suggesting it’s all or nothing, or does each BAMF! give him a new opportunity? I’m assuming by your latest example that the latter is the case, in which BAMF! 1 he carries someone, BAMF! 2 he attacks with -1, BAMF! 3 he carries someone and attacks. If that were the case, and people are open to a bump to 4 attack, I wouldn’t be opposed if that’s the direction the majority prefer.

Definitely meant the last. It should be on a Bamf by Bamf basis.

[japes]

Mobility options with Nightcrawler II and Shadowcat II will make a Captain Britain army lots of fun as well.

[Yodaking]

I actually don't have a problem with his point potentially going up some if the card is playing strongly. Gambit is a 210 and I don't feel like having him on par with Gambit is a crazy notion. I also read up on his wiki powers description last night and it mentioned in there how he was an excellent fencer with both hands, both feet, and his tail. That alleviates some of my thematic concerns about teleport carrying and attacking at the same time if he can effectively stab someone with all 5 limbs.

As for a potential way to boost him up a bit more (if the need/desire to do so is there), I'd love to see us come up with a way for his teleporting not get countered by Stuck/Rubber Wrap/Cyber Claw/etc. I started this discussion in the Cosmo thread (I was looking at including him in a Nightwrawler/Star Lord army that would be facing the Fan4 but ended up swapping him out for Gorilla-Man.) about countering the Cyber Claw power and a suggestion was made that a power that removed your figure from the board before placing it back on the board could potentially be the loop hole we are looking for.

BAMF! CARRY
Instead of his normal move, Nightcrawler may use BAMF! Carry. To BAMF! Carry, first remove Nightcrawler from the board, then place him on an empty space within 3 spaces of his previous placement. After placing Nightcrawler, you may choose a friendly Tiny, Small, or Medium figure that was adjacent to Nightcrawler before he moved with BAMF! Carry. Place the chosen figure on any empty space adjacent to Nightcrawler. When using BAMF! Carry, figures will not take any leaving engagement attacks. After using BAMF! Carry on your turn, you may use it 2 additional times.

A little more text, not sure if we have the room on the card, but thematically he really shouldn't have a problem Bamping! away while wrapped up by Reed. I left the carry target language the same though as I do think it would be much more difficult to Bamp! an ally away when Reed has them all wrapped up.

[Yodaking]

Originally Posted by Arkham

As for the power change, I guess it depends on how it’s worded. Is it that if he carries anyone in his turn that disqualifies him to the -1, or is it only after that particular BAMF! that he won’t get the -1 it he chooses to attack. Essentially, are we suggesting it’s all or nothing, or does each BAMF! give him a new opportunity? I’m assuming by your latest example that the latter is the case, in which BAMF! 1 he carries someone, BAMF! 2 he attacks with -1, BAMF! 3 he carries someone and attacks. If that were the case, and people are open to a bump to 4 attack, I wouldn’t be opposed if that’s the direction the majority prefer.

In my mind it was always Bamp! specific like you describe at the end.

[Arkham]

Point wise I definitely think 190-210 is where I'm looking to land at. Perhaps we need an overall consensus on the -1/carry thing, because I'm of the opinion with how skillful he is with all his limbs including the tail, how quick he is, and the fact that it's only a -1 we're talking about here, that it should be fine.

I'm not against the strategic choice Spidey is mentioning, but if it's not something that's necessary, I'd rather stray from restricting this guy. With how Nightcrawler I went over, I'd prefer we error in his favor in terms of usability, reliability, and effectiveness for his point value.

As for the loop hole to get out of being stuck, I'm all for it if others are on board. I know in the past any talk of trying to get around it using the verbiage of cancelling out other powers that were already cancelling out powers was a messy no-no, but if you've found a method that gets around all that, I see no character more deserving of it than the most iconic teleporter IMO.

[Ronin]

No strong opinion on the other stuff, but I wanted to weigh in on this...

Originally Posted by Arkham

As for the loop hole to get out of being stuck, I'm all for it if others are on board. I know in the past any talk of trying to get around it using the verbiage of cancelling out other powers that were already cancelling out powers was a messy no-no, but if you've found a method that gets around all that, I see no character more deserving of it than the most iconic teleporter IMO.

I'm not on board with it. It's an awkward fix for just one unit. It technically works but I don't think the intent is clear at all. If we were to come up with a fix for teleporters getting cyberclawed, it'd have to be something more clearly worded, and I'd want it on all the teleporters.

[Arkham]

I assumed as much. Based on the past I figured trying to incorporate a mechanic like that wouldn’t get the support. It’s a shame really as teleporters getting stuck is absolutely a theme break, and unfortunately in Nightcrawler's case, completely shuts him down 100%.

[Yodaking]

Spoiler Alert!

NAME = NIGHTCRAWLER
SECRET IDENTITY = KURT WAGNER

SPECIES = MUTANT
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = PROTECTOR
PERSONALITY = DEVOUT

SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE = 4

MOVE = 6
RANGE = 1
ATTACK = 3
DEFENSE = 5

POINTS = 190

BAMF! CARRY
Instead of his normal move, Nightcrawler may use BAMF! Carry. To BAMF! Carry, place Nightcrawler on an empty space within 3 spaces of his current placement. After placing Nightcrawler, you may choose a friendly Tiny, Small, or Medium figure that was adjacent to Nightcrawler before he moved with BAMF! Carry. Place the chosen figure on any empty space adjacent to Nightcrawler. When using BAMF! Carry, figures will not take any leaving engagement attacks. After using BAMF! Carry on your turn, you may use it 2 additional times.

EN GARDE
Nightcrawler may attack with his normal attack up to 2 times at any point before or after his move or BAMF! Carry as long as he is on a space where he could end his movement. When attacking with Nightcrawler, if Nightcrawler used his BAMF! Carry special prior to the attack, the defending figure subtracts 1 from its defense.

BAMF! PROTECTION
When defending against an attack with Nightcrawler, each blank rolled instead counts as 2 additional shields. After Nightcrawler or a figure you control adjacent to Nightcrawler rolls defense dice against an opponent's attack, you may immediately use Nightcrawler's BAMF! Carry special.

C3G STANDARD PLAYTEST FEEDBACK FORM
NAME OF THE TEST UNIT (Nightcrawler II)

- THEME TEST/ Check to see if there are any powers or stats on the test unit card that does not accurately reflect the theme or likeness of what the character would and could do. Also consider destructible objects, and whether or not this characters powers should affect them.
Pass, the carrying and attacking at the same time does seem like a bit of a stretch though. Not because I don’t think he couldn’t pull it off once if he really needed to but rather the idea that he can do it constantly. Seems like a fairly tricky thing to pull off and he is doing on a regular basis rather easily. Maybe some kind of once per ____ restriction but I’m not sure how that would look.
- MIRROR TEST/ Check to see if the unit were played against itself, if there would be any loops that would upset the balance of the Game.
Pass, none that I can see although having one Nightcrawler chase another Nightcrawler all across the board as both Bamp! on attack on defense would be pretty funny to watch.
- BONDING TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing Bonding abilities to make sure there are no continual Bonding possibilities that do not stop appropriately or do not stop at all. This is to prevent loops in Bonding.
Pass, only tested the Lockheed & Capt. Britain bonding out directly and they seemed fine. Getting another figure to attack in addition to Nightcrawler’s two attacks is certainly icing on the cake. He really should be played with Lockheed or one of the Mutant Sidekicks fairly often if not already bonding via Prof. X or Capt. Britain.
- SYNERGIES TEST/ Compare the unit card with all possible currently existing synergies to make sure there are no factors that could break the game by making any unit to powerful or too weak.
Pass, lots of mutant synergy so I may have missed something but I don’t think he has any class or species synergy to worry about. The more generic stat-boosters are the more impactful force to draw upon for him and their effect on the game should be reflected in their own pricing.
- POWER CHECK/ Consider the test unit and all existing units and all glyphs to compare to and check for any powers that could be over amplified and break the game. Each power must define when it takes place, who or what it affects, and What are the stipulations on the power if there are any.
Pass, only concern is the stacking of a bunch of stat booster with his power set, but that really is a bigger issue of multiple stat boosters in one army and not really his problem as an individual card.
- FUN TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play.
Pass, not sure where to put this but I just wanted to note that in test 1 he rolled 6 def. dice (HG) and ended up with 5 skulls and 1 shield, taking 2W and clearly caught off guard there. Then on the very next def. roll he again rolled 6 dice, this time rolling 1 skulls, 1 shield, and 4 blanks for a total of 9 shields! He saw that attack from a mile away. Pretty fun to see he has the potential to disappear right before a big hit lands just using the regular def. dice and not the d20.
- FUN COMPETITIVE TEST/ Consider whether or not the design was fun to play against.
Pass, between the two games I saw him both really excel and also fall on his face. So combined I don’t think people will have a problem playing against him. However, if one player only seems to ever find themselves on the receiving end of the really strong performances, they might start to find him to be too much.
- DRAFTING TEST/ Consider whether or not this design is worth drafting.
Pass, lots of drafting options here. He can be drafted into a Prof. X mutant build, a Capt. Britain Excalibur build, added to a Star Lord and/or Capt. America build, be paired up with Lockheed or a mutant sidekick and added into just about any army, or build an army entirely around his ability to quickly move strong ranged attackers up to high ground and/or his ability to ‘rescue’ allies who are getting attacked. He should find his ways onto lots of game boards.
- USAGE TEST/ Consider whether or not all of the powers on this card were used or at least usable.
Pass, every power seems really useful to me.
- STRATEGY TEST/ Consider whether or not the design offers any real strategy or interesting tactics to the overall game.
Pass, when he is on your team you can use him as a quick strike force or as a defensive savior to try and keep your team alive longer.
_____________________________________________________________
Army Test 1
- Does it pass, Yes or No? yes
- What should be the unit's point value? Hard to say here as he didn’t get a chance to do much, Thunderball and Wrecker put together a run of 7 turns uninterrupted and took him out with an unrelenting barrage of attacks.
- Give a brief preview. I wanted to pair him up with his Excalibur leader for one of these tests. Witchblade is a strong ally for Capt. Britain and has a ranged attack that Nightcrawler can help set up on high ground. She also has a healing power so if she gets herself in trouble it will be Nightcrawlers job to whisk her away to safety and give her time to heal back up to full strength.
Map: Cross the Stream (small map, bridge over water)
Units: Capt. Britain, Nightcrawler II, Witchblade (800) vs. Wrecking Crew (800)

Spoiler Alert!

Bamp! Carry Usage: Carried Witchblade out of the SZ and onto HG to start the game.
En Garde Usage: Used to lower Thundeball’s def. die on his first att. after carrying Witchblade out, att. from HG too but Thunderball rolled 5 shields to block.
Bamp! Protection Usage: Counted blank to block as 2 shields an attack, stayed in place to keep WC from trying to move up to even ground. Used to move away from Thunderball after he used his SA and avoided being moved against his will as a result. Moved and carried Witchblade to maintain HG after they were att. by THunderball’s SA after Thunderball had managed to get up to even ground with Whichblade.
Damage Dealt: 1W to Thunderball from HG on 2nd att. of turn.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? An unwounded Wrecker & Bulldozer (still in SZ) won the day.

Ruling made mid-game: Thunderball wanted to use his SA to break up Nightcrawler & Witchblade so Nightcrawler couldn’t Bamp! Carry her away on defense, but since Nightcrawler’s defensive power says “immediately after rolling def. dice” and Thunderballs’ SA power does not use the word immediately, I ruled that Nightcrawler would be able to Bamp! before Thunderball could choose where to move any wounded figures. Nightcrawler ended up taking 2W from the att. and Bamped! away still adj. to Witchblade (who blocked). I then didn’t let Thunderball move Nightcrawler to within 1 space of his original placement as Nightcrawler had moved already on his own. Not 100% sure this was correct ruling.
Recap: First round was moving up and some initial fighting resulting in a few wounds but nothing crazy happened (Capt. Britain 1W, Thunderball 1W, Piledriver 2W’s). Then in the second round the WC won initiative and it got a bit crazy. Thunderball and Wrecker ping-ponged back and forth with turns, taking 7 turns between them all on OM1, during which Wrecker put 2W on Nightcrawler with his SA when Kurt rolled 1 shield and 5 skulls on def., then Kurt took 2 more W’s from Wrecker on 2 different attacks and Nightcrawler was done for. Thunderball capped the incredible run off by moving up to even ground with Witchblade (since Nightcrawler was now out of the way) and hitting her for 3W when she rolled just 1 shield on 7 dice. Capt. Britain and Witchblade put a quick 4W on Thunderball once they finally got a chance to go, but then Witchbalde again rolled just 1 shield on 7 def. dice and Piledriver put her down. Capt. Britain then finished off Thunderball but didn’t have anyone left to bond with. Capt. Britain continued the 1 shield defense roll trend for his team when Wrecker stepped up adj. and smacked him for 3W. Capt. Britain then managed to deck Piledriver for 3W from HG to end the round. In round 3, Capt. Britain stood tall when Wrecker tried to smack him, then finished off Piledriver. That was his last act of defiance though as he again rolled 1 shield on def., not that it would have matter much had he rolled slightly better as Wrecker rolled all skulls to put him down and win the game.
_____________________________________________________________
Army Test 2
- Does it pass, Yes or No? yes
- What should be the unit's point value? He was feeling pretty strong here, I wouldn’t not draft him at a higher price. How high I’m not sure but I also can’t see myself not drafting him with Bane very often.
- Give a brief preview. Here I opted to pair him up with the Lockheed to test out the strength of that bonding option, than I threw the two of them into a Star Lord build with Bane in tow for some double stat boosts. Gorilla Man & Venom both have a base att. of 6 that could get up to 7 or 8 and should challenge the Fan4’s high defense should Nightcrawler fail to eliminate Sue before getting wrapped up. If Reed wraps up Nightcrawler, then Venom can go after her. Bane also could rage out for some big att. dice rolls if needed and I’ll certainly send Gorilla Man into the fight first and see if I pass the curse onto one of the Fan4 and disrupt their bonding/synergy.
Map: Cross the Stream
Units: Nightcrawler II, Lockheed, Star Lord, Bane, Gorilla Man, Venom (Marvel) (1000) vs. Fan 4 (1000)

Spoiler Alert!

Bamp! Carry Usage: Carried Bane with him when he went after Sue. Carried Bane again while going after Ben, and then after killing Ben. Used to carry Lockheed away from Gorilla-Man so he could then move into Lockheed’s spot and att. Gorilla-Man from HG.
En Garde Usage: Attacked Sue after carrying Bane with him for a -1 def. modifier, than attacked a second time. Attacked Ben for a -1 def. modifier, then attacked a second time which killed Ben, used his 3rd move at this point to reposition himself and Bane. Att. Gorilla Man from HG twice, the first att. had the -1 def. modifier. Att. Reed after using Bamp! and adj. to Bane, att. a second Reed a 2nd time without moving.
Bamp! Protection Usage: While he rolled blanks on def., he never actually needed to count them to get his blocks in this game and never moved him or an ally after they were attacked, mostly because Reed was locking figures down.
Damage Dealt: 3W to Sue with his first att. of the game, was boosted by both Bane & Star Lord while Sue only rolled 3 def. dice, 2W to Sue on second att. to put her down in Round 1, Turn 3. 3W to Ben on opening att. of R2, was boosted by Bane & Star Lord again while Ben rolled 5 skulls on 5 dice, then attacked Ben a 2nd time and dealt another 2W when Ben whiffed on 6 def. dice. Att. Gorilla Man from HG while boosted by Bane & Star Lord after carrying Lockheed out of the way dealing 2W’s, then att. again from the same position without moving and dealt 1W. Att. Reed after using Bamp! for 1W.
Who won and how many wounds did they have? Nightcrawler unwounded, Gorilla-Man (formally Lockheed) unwounded, Bane w/4W’s and Venom w/1W won.

Recap: The Fan4 quickly took over HG at the center of the board and things were looking good, then suddenly Nightcrawler and Bane appeared behind them and Nightcrawler killed Sue, then Nightcrawler kills Ben and it didn’t look good. Reed did manage to lock Nightcrawler down after that and take him out of the fight for a bit, but since Reed couldn’t hurt him he eventually had to leave and go after the stat boosters, which freed Nightcrawler up to do his thing once more. Johnny managed to set Bane and Gorilla man on fire, then as the Guardians clumped up returned to the mix and went Supernova. This worked out quite well as he dealt wounds to everyone but Nightcrawler and Venom (who was out of range) while also ending Gorilla-Man and becoming the new Gorilla-Man. Unfortunately he was stuck on LG but eventually managed to take out Star Lord before Lockheed finished him off and became the new Gorilla-Man. While Johnny put up a good fight, Reed just couldn’t land any blows and went down without taking anyone with him. Sue going down at the end of R1 was a pretty big blow to the Fan4, than losing Ben at the start of R2 created a hole they couldn’t hope to dig themselves out of. Nightcrawler boosted by Bane and Star Lord was the key to both of those critical blows. He’s looking a little strong after this one.
Final Thoughts: The first game showed that he can go down when the focus of enough attacks, but that was also with only high ground boosting his def. In the second game, when boosted by Bane and Star Lord he was like Teflon when attacked, although he never became the primary focus as Bane and Star Lord needed to go first. I’d consider dropping his def. down to 4 though as a dial to keep his power level in check some, even without allies boosting him he should have high ground fairly often with his extremely efficient mobility. He can also break away from multiple attack melee figures or attempt to hide behind cover from multiple attack ranged units. As for his attack output, for the most part I only received the -1 def. modifier from his first attack as the situation often dictated that I not move again before attacking the second time. That was in large part due to the map layout I used combined with figure placement. Still it seems as though he will be able to get both high ground and the -1 def. modifier on the first attack quite often, then the second att. will get one benefit or the other but not both. So his base double att. of 3 is solid on its own. The stat boosters are where he can get nasty as I was able to take both Sue and Ben out with 1 OM each. Ben rolled really poorly on def. so I don’t anticipate that being a regular occurrence, but Sue is certainly going to fear this guy.