Heroscapers
Go Back   Heroscapers > Custom HeroScape Creations > Maps & Scenarios > Architects of the Realms of Valhalla
Architects of the Realms of Valhalla Discussion and presentation of the maps approved by the ARV.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #37  
Old June 4th, 2017, 03:41 AM
Sir Heroscape's Avatar
Sir Heroscape Sir Heroscape is online now
Sir Formerly Known As adoney
 
Join Date: September 14, 2015
Location: U.S - Idaho - Boise
Posts: 5,459
Images: 81
Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: Request for Workshopping:Forgotten Sanctuary

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTravelingScaper View Post


https://www.heroscapers.com/communit...o=file&id=4657

My ultimate goal is to make the map tournament worthy.(And possibly have @Sir Heroscape play on it in one of his videos if its reworked to a better caliber. )
The OP of this thread outlines my response perfectly...so I'll quote...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Heroscape
IMPORTANT NOTE: Not all maps are competitive. This thread is a tool for both the fun and competitive maps. Feel free to workshop a map to work out kinks, but don't feel it has to be submitted for a competitive review, because even with tweaking, some maps are just not going to have a place in tournament play. Don't feel discouraged if after workshopping the map we still don't feel it is a competitive map; Heroscape is primarily a game of fun, and plenty of maps that don't make it to the competitive scene still see a lot of casual play.
I believe this is the case here. Your map is fundamentally flawed by its design for Competitve play in tournaments, BUT please don't be offended by that because it's still a great map and I love how you've built the castle with such limited terrain! I really like the design and will definitely use this in multiplayer games, scenarios or casual games...it's just that there is a certain standard a map needs to meet in order to be competitive and Tournament balanced and the core of your map design doesn't support that. If you'd like we can help you tweak it in areas you think need improvement for casual play?
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old June 4th, 2017, 04:53 AM
TheTravelingScaper's Avatar
TheTravelingScaper TheTravelingScaper is offline
 
Join Date: January 20, 2014
Location: USA - CT - Sterling
Posts: 129
TheTravelingScaper is surprisingly tart
Re: Workshop Thread

Hmm... I see what you are saying but I could easily follow Superfrogs example and (attempt to)change thecore design up to a more straightforward and balanced degree and potentially neuter the fundamental flaw that plagues the map of imbalance . I actually had an idea looking at some of the other top tens. Make a hexagonal castle (put 5 or so 7 hexs together make a moat with ramps going up to it ladders in it and rubble in it and trees and wall blockers galore.

And these "Standards", Is there a defined play dimension for tournament maps? I know Arv is 1MS and 2 EXP but does it have to have a certain footprint to be deemed within tournament regulation.

Quote:
Less-than-complete understanding of the rules is bad behavior? Since when?
-@Sherman Davies;


My Tradeslist : http://www.heroscapers.com/community...ad.php?t=51248

Last edited by TheTravelingScaper; June 4th, 2017 at 05:02 AM. Reason: added text
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old June 4th, 2017, 10:35 AM
superfrog's Avatar
superfrog superfrog is offline
This is merely a joke.
 
Join Date: March 12, 2012
Location: USA - CA - South Pasadena
Posts: 9,132
Images: 5
Blog Entries: 1
superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth superfrog is a man of the cloth
Re: Workshop Thread

In general: big castles =/= a tournament map. It just becomes too easy for range (especially flying range) if they gain the height first. Roads and ladders and glyphs can help, but if you look at BoV maps, for instance, you won't find more than 1 map with castle pillars. And if you look at the BoV tier thread that was started, I think that's near the bottom.

customs/maps/c3v/sov

how to:
make a card/post your maps

google sheets:
ohs link generator/attack outcomes

CVN~ "I highly recommend C3V customs!"
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old June 4th, 2017, 11:06 AM
Sir Heroscape's Avatar
Sir Heroscape Sir Heroscape is online now
Sir Formerly Known As adoney
 
Join Date: September 14, 2015
Location: U.S - Idaho - Boise
Posts: 5,459
Images: 81
Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: Workshop Thread

@superfrog said it well @TheTravelingScaper . The core design of your map is the fact that it is a castle map. Castle maps for competitve play favor certain builds too much and instead of making it fun, you have frustrated people because the map beat them. Take dragon builds for example (which by the way are very competitively played), can you imagine being at a tournament and the entire time your opponent perches on top of the castle with the dragon ,out of reach, and just blasts your army? You would be devastated. We at the ARV love all submissions. Your maps are still unique and archived in our Archive Thread where people can still decide to use them for personal use. BUT then we evaluate those that have the best potential for being competitve and give our "sanction" as a means for tournament directors and players alike to know which of the maps are the best for tournament/competitve play. It's okay that your maps are not designed for competitive play, and I think it would be really neat for you to touch it up as it is to make it a really fun scenario map or casual game...and people will still use it.
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old June 5th, 2017, 12:55 AM
A3n's Avatar
A3n A3n is offline
"Let's Nut this Unit Out!"
 
Join Date: April 10, 2008
Location: Australia - Queensland - Nth Rockhampton
Posts: 19,508
Images: 52
A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth A3n is a man of the cloth
Re: Workshop Thread

Can you please provide feedback for this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by A3n View Post
I suppose somebody has to be first...

Quote:
Originally Posted by A3n View Post
My entry for the ARV The Uncharted Wellsprings contest:

Great Tree Pass
The world of Valhalla is in its own right a mystical world. A convergence of cosmic energies and forces. So it wasn’t really a surprise that after centuries of reverance and homage being made to the great tree of the pass, that a wellspring should appear below it’s boughs.


Download

Hold the Pass
(2 players)
Required Sets: Rise of the Valkyrie™ Master Set, Road through the Forgotten Forest™, Swarm of the Marro Master Set™

The Great Tree Pass, as it has become known, is a prominent crossing point of the Hvelgelmir river. The pass derives its name from the great tree standing on a mid-stream island adjacent to the pass. Standing strong against the tide, the tree has stood for over a century and is a demonstration of nature’s strength. Or maybe its strength comes from the blood that has washed its shores.
Now the tree stands as a marker of strength of another kind. Who will possess the wellspring shadowed by the great tree?
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old June 5th, 2017, 01:21 AM
BiggaBullfrog's Avatar
BiggaBullfrog BiggaBullfrog is offline
 
Join Date: December 31, 2009
Location: Logan or SLC, Utah
Posts: 2,101
Images: 241
Blog Entries: 4
BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla
Re: Workshop Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by A3n View Post
Can you please provide feedback for this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by A3n View Post
I suppose somebody has to be first...

Quote:
Originally Posted by A3n View Post
My entry for the ARV The Uncharted Wellsprings contest:

Great Tree Pass
The world of Valhalla is in its own right a mystical world. A convergence of cosmic energies and forces. So it wasn’t really a surprise that after centuries of reverance and homage being made to the great tree of the pass, that a wellspring should appear below it’s boughs.


Download

Hold the Pass
(2 players)
Required Sets: Rise of the Valkyrie™ Master Set, Road through the Forgotten Forest™, Swarm of the Marro Master Set™

The Great Tree Pass, as it has become known, is a prominent crossing point of the Hvelgelmir river. The pass derives its name from the great tree standing on a mid-stream island adjacent to the pass. Standing strong against the tide, the tree has stood for over a century and is a demonstration of nature’s strength. Or maybe its strength comes from the blood that has washed its shores.
Now the tree stands as a marker of strength of another kind. Who will possess the wellspring shadowed by the great tree?
Your map visually looks awesome! However, the main flaw in it is the imbalance of range vs melee. A ranged army can climb up the high ground and shoot advancing melee for days, while melee is stuck trying to cross a 1-hex bridge (which is easily blocked) or trying to slog through the low valley (a venture which would take several turns and that any unit would be incredibly lucky to survive). For me personally, a map's balance in range vs melee fights is one of the biggest things I pay attention to, and in all honesty this map just isn't fair to melee. I think that a range v range or melee v melee fight on this map would be interesting, though. Although even still, the wellspring area is still just so low that the journey down would almost always be suicide, meaning you have to focus on a battle of attrition on the bridge (and attrition dice-offs aren't really fun for competitive play). This map is cool enough that I would probably use it for a casual draft game, but as far as a competitive map goes, it falls short.

But like I said, it looks great, and so does the .pdf! In fact, I was meaning to ask you (not to derail the thread too much): did you do that yourself or is there a program that you used to make it? I really like the presentation and especially thought that the way you incorporated the wellspring into the victory conditions for your scenario was really awesome!
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old June 5th, 2017, 01:25 AM
BiggaBullfrog's Avatar
BiggaBullfrog BiggaBullfrog is offline
 
Join Date: December 31, 2009
Location: Logan or SLC, Utah
Posts: 2,101
Images: 241
Blog Entries: 4
BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla
Re: Request for Workshopping:Forgotten Sanctuary

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTravelingScaper View Post


https://www.heroscapers.com/communit...o=file&id=4657

My ultimate goal is to make the map tournament worthy.(And possibly have @Sir Heroscape play on it in one of his videos if its reworked to a better caliber. )
Late to the party on this one but wanted to throw this in: this map looks awesome aesthetically (like so many maps that didn't make it in the top 10)! Its problem is that in competitive play, the whole map will never be used. The action will just focus on the area immediately between the start zones. Like others have said, it's hard to make a castle map competitive, and having it clear off to the side just doesn't work. That said, I would totally use this map if I were playing a superhero capture-the-flag game, where the flag is somewhere in the castle. I think it has awesome scenario potential, just not so much competitively.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old June 5th, 2017, 04:22 AM
TheTravelingScaper's Avatar
TheTravelingScaper TheTravelingScaper is offline
 
Join Date: January 20, 2014
Location: USA - CT - Sterling
Posts: 129
TheTravelingScaper is surprisingly tart
Talking Re: Request for Workshopping:Forgotten Sanctuary

Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggaBullfrog View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTravelingScaper View Post


https://www.heroscapers.com/communit...o=file&id=4657

My ultimate goal is to make the map tournament worthy.(And possibly have @Sir Heroscape play on it in one of his videos if its reworked to a better caliber. )
Late to the party on this one but wanted to throw this in: this map looks awesome aesthetically (like so many maps that didn't make it in the top 10)! Its problem is that in competitive play, the whole map will never be used. The action will just focus on the area immediately between the start zones. Like others have said, it's hard to make a castle map competitive, and having it clear off to the side just doesn't work. That said, I would totally use this map if I were playing a superhero capture-the-flag game, where the flag is somewhere in the castle. I think it has awesome scenario potential, just not so much competitively.


This... this is very true and reasonable logic. Due to the core design of my map only about 1/3 will be used. One possible thing (scenario) I can foresee is have 2 people team up against a person who is starting in the castle,while utilizing the poorly thought out start-zones.( To win,the attackers get a greater number of points worth of figures than the defenders figures within its walls at the end of any round after the 3rd.(maybe poor isn't the phrase; they just aren't appropriate for this format due to a lack of uniform army build for the ARV/BRV/Tournament and as @Sir Heroscape )said previously or implied, the map is half as important as the army you draft or bring. As such design choices ,such as The lack of any way for a double spaced non-flying figure to traverse to the top is a major balancing issue considering flying range,(Protectors Mimring among others would just rain hell upon everything below.) I myself am probably going to start a map thread in the near future and see how that works out and experiment and get some feedback to test and see what really makes a map pop visually and what makes at balanced at the same time.

Quote:
Less-than-complete understanding of the rules is bad behavior? Since when?
-@Sherman Davies;


My Tradeslist : http://www.heroscapers.com/community...ad.php?t=51248
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old June 5th, 2017, 07:08 AM
Sir Heroscape's Avatar
Sir Heroscape Sir Heroscape is online now
Sir Formerly Known As adoney
 
Join Date: September 14, 2015
Location: U.S - Idaho - Boise
Posts: 5,459
Images: 81
Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: Workshop Thread

@A3n Bigga couldn't have said it much better. In addition to his comments, I will also add the map is very long. It could take potentially the while first round just to develop an army (especially melee) into any engagements or good position. Map size is and was a factor in scoring the Top 10. Competitve maps generally allow for some action to take place within the first round and this map design makes that difficult. This is important because in a tournament setting, there is a time clock as well as limited space. A tournament director likes to be able to get at least 2 maps on a table, and this one would take up just over half of a table making it hard to put any other map down. Also if you're taking such a long time developing your army through the map, it will take a lot of time off the clock and many games could potentially be "called to time"...and nobody likes that. Those are a couple practical reasons it scored lower for me but nonetheless important. That said, aesthetically and thematically very well done (and I would also like to know how you did that .pdf trick )!!
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old June 6th, 2017, 08:44 PM
vvildeyedjoker vvildeyedjoker is offline
 
Join Date: March 16, 2017
Location: USA-PA-Harrisburg
Posts: 141
Images: 1
vvildeyedjoker knows what's in an order marker vvildeyedjoker knows what's in an order marker
Re: Request for Workshopping

I was hoping to get feedback on this one. I personally liked this one better then my other one but I would like to hear the judges opinion.

Looking at the other submissions I'm thinking it is a little small. Also the two Glyphs so close together would be a hard nut to crack if one side took both, i guess it just didn't happen enough in play testing for me to think about it.

Title: Tree of Might

Author: VVildeyedjoker

Req: 1 Rotv, 1 RttFF, 1 TJ
Spoiler Alert!

Last edited by vvildeyedjoker; June 6th, 2017 at 08:51 PM. Reason: added 2c
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old June 6th, 2017, 11:09 PM
Sir Heroscape's Avatar
Sir Heroscape Sir Heroscape is online now
Sir Formerly Known As adoney
 
Join Date: September 14, 2015
Location: U.S - Idaho - Boise
Posts: 5,459
Images: 81
Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun Sir Heroscape is a penguin with a machine gun
Re: Request for Workshopping

Quote:
Originally Posted by vvildeyedjoker View Post
I was hoping to get feedback on this one. I personally liked this one better then my other one but I would like to hear the judges opinion.

Looking at the other submissions I'm thinking it is a little small. Also the two Glyphs so close together would be a hard nut to crack if one side took both, i guess it just didn't happen enough in play testing for me to think about it.
The main concern here was the easily accessible 7hex height so close to the startzone. This is a ranged pods dream map and would absolutely dominate. Not only is the height too high and close to the startzone but there are too many choke points that are easily defendable and difficult for an attacking army to push through to reach any type of pod. The map is a little too congested. If you moved the 7hex height to the edge of the map on the other side of the bridge walls that would open things up a lot more and potentially balance the map.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old June 7th, 2017, 01:13 AM
BiggaBullfrog's Avatar
BiggaBullfrog BiggaBullfrog is offline
 
Join Date: December 31, 2009
Location: Logan or SLC, Utah
Posts: 2,101
Images: 241
Blog Entries: 4
BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla BiggaBullfrog is inducted into the Halls of Valhalla
Re: Request for Workshopping

Quote:
Originally Posted by vvildeyedjoker View Post
I was hoping to get feedback on this one. I personally liked this one better then my other one but I would like to hear the judges opinion.

Looking at the other submissions I'm thinking it is a little small. Also the two Glyphs so close together would be a hard nut to crack if one side took both, i guess it just didn't happen enough in play testing for me to think about it.

Title: Tree of Might

Author: VVildeyedjoker

Req: 1 Rotv, 1 RttFF, 1 TJ
Spoiler Alert!
Like Sir Heroscape said, the 7-hexer was the main concern, along with the congestion issues the map presented. A few other issues I noted were:
There's a heavy glyph imbalance - one side has easier access to one of the glyphs than the other. This is heightened by the fact that the Defense glyph is much better than the Unique Attack glyph, so whoever is closer to it is going to have a distinct advantage.
I was also pretty worried about left-right flow on the map. In the middle of the map, there are only the two one-hex wide bridges going across. Even close to the start zones, the 7-hex high ground is a road block to movement. Those points don't really allow the map to breathe as much as it should.
The map itself isn't super big, but it does take a lot of movement to traverse. Making better paths would help that.

Overall I like the look of it and think it has some great potential. It's kind of reminiscent of Invasion in the BoV. You did a great job at spreading the jungle around for good cover (although it's all next to fairly high ground - on this map I don't think it's as bad of an issue but usually you'll want it on even lower ground). As-is there is plenty that I both like and don't like about this map, but I do think that with some work it can be a really great map!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Heroscapers > Custom HeroScape Creations > Maps & Scenarios > Architects of the Realms of Valhalla
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Pre-SoV Workshop greygnarl Custom Units & Army Cards 3993 February 21st, 2020 11:13 PM
Bad_Calvin's Workshop - update 4-7 bad_calvin Custom Terrain & Obstacles 54 June 5th, 2009 10:09 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:33 AM.

Heroscape background footer

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.