Age of Annihilation - Backer Trend and Discussion

[Dad_Scaper]

I saw this on the Heroscape subreddit, from a non-Scaper. I thought it might belong here:

Hello members of the Heroscape community. Y'all currently have a Haslab going on right now to make a brand new set of your game, that if successful would probably bring your game back in full. I have never played Heroscape. I am however something of a toy collector and have see many a Haslab projects. So I wanted to take a moment and kinda share my experiences with previous Haslabs so you have this information.



"why is there only one option? there should be multiple tiers." Haslab is just the one thing. That is how each of the other projects have operated. Does it make total sense for Heroscape? maybe not. But this is not a traditional crowd funding campaign. it is more like an order list with a minimum.

"Why a Haslab, why not just release it in retail?" Well looking at the previous projects and the general blurb for what Haslab is, it is for products that have a large want but may be too big, or too niche. and with a Haslab they also test the waters if there is a demand, and if so, retail release will most likely be paired down.

"That price is really steep." I'm gonna level with you. just for the pure plastic you are getting. it is a good deal. in fact it is the fourth cheapest thing to come through Haslab. take a gander at older Haslab releses to see the price these project tend to go for. big examples being Unicron, Galactus, Sentinel, and jabba's barge. and those guys didn't come with a game and legacy parts.

"They are trying to make it War Hammer." I don't really see the Warhammer. to me this seems more positioned in the space of games like Gloomhaven. large big box boardgames, with ecosystems for expansion. and Gloomhaven goes for 170 dollars with a cardboard play area and also has unpainted minis.

"The backers are only at XXX number, I don't know if it is gonna get funded." Relax, you guys are actually moving at a pretty solid clip for this. most projects if my memory serves me only got fully funded two to three weeks in, and then people, now secure in the knowledge that it is fully funded, reached the stretch goals easily. also note only two projects did not completely fund. and that was mostly due to low fan demand. in fact take a look at the other Haslab going on right now. it is a more pricey project that needs 1000 more backers in total and 4000 to reach, and it still has 30 ish days to do so.

Look am I saying you should not have worries? no its fine to worry. this is your hobby, the thing you like. I just wanted to bring some context and previous experience to you guys so you might have more of a frame of reference. heck, their whole presentation made me kinda hype. maybe one day I will meet you out on the .... hexagon...field...? what ever you guys call it. hope this helps.

Link.

[caps]

I remain optimistic about the campaign. This post on reddit from a toy collector that is experienced with Haslab was encouraging, I thought.

FWIW I don't see the value in being negative or critical of the campaign at this time. While I agree with many of the criticisms, I'm not sure what value there is in repeating them. The game coming back will be a boon for all of us, and I'd rather see folks directing their energy in a positive direction, looking at the highlights and upsides rather than focusing on the mistakes and downers.

[caps]

Originally Posted by CapAp

I’m new to this board (joined last month), and have literally no knowledge of any of the “VC” and “CV3” organizations other than the nebulous idea that they create fan-made content. I’ve never looked at a unit from them. My guess is that most casual fans are like me. So if you’re interested in the casual POV, here’s mine:

For me, HeroScape was the “battle of all time”, not the battle of weird space monster factions.

For me, HeroScape is redcoats and elves fighting anime robots and knights.

For me, this would have been successful had it contained, say…. ghost pirates, cavemen and a post-apocalyptic biker gang (just for example). Or Frankensteins, sharks with lasers on their heads, and a steampunk airship crew (again, just off the top of my head). The possibilities are truly endless.

For me, this is unsuccessful containing 65 space mutant characters from a setting that I have no knowledge of or connection to, and tossing in Raelin and Drake and calling it HeroScape.

Those are all awesome ideas for the design team!

[TerminX]

Originally Posted by CapAp

For me, this would have been successful had it contained, say…. ghost pirates, cavemen and a post-apocalyptic biker gang (just for example). Or Frankensteins, sharks with lasers on their heads, and a steampunk airship crew (again, just off the top of my head). The possibilities are truly endless.

You are welcome to your take of course, but I'm not sure why these are cool with you but bugs, rocket raccoons, space pirates, cyberdemons and dryads aren't

i've kind of avoided this discourse until now but for me heroscape was all about how "everything" could be on the battlefield. and all the units they've shown so far fit pretty firmly under "everything". and frankly I dont think anything we've seen strays far enough from classicscape for it to generate this degree of discussion anyway

[CapAp]

Originally Posted by TerminX

You are welcome to your take of course, but I'm not sure why these are cool with you but bugs, rocket raccoons, space pirates, cyberdemons and dryads aren't

i've kind of avoided this discourse until now but for me heroscape was all about how "everything" could be on the battlefield. and all the units they've shown so far fit pretty firmly under "everything". and frankly I dont think anything we've seen strays far enough from classicscape for it to generate this degree of discussion anyway

It isn’t that they don’t fit, it’s exactly what you stated - they don’t feel like “everything”, they feel like all the same thing - techno-fantasy creatures clearly meant to fit into the same “universe”. A techno-fantasy universe. Techno bugs, techno raccoons, techno pirates, techno demons. It feels more like warhammer 40k than HeroScape.

If this feels like the battle of all time to you, cool! I hope it funds. It just doesn’t to me. And after being excited originally, I’m not after seeing the units.

[Good Pig]

Originally Posted by TerminX

You are welcome to your take of course, but I'm not sure why these are cool with you but bugs, rocket raccoons, space pirates, cyberdemons and dryads aren't

i've kind of avoided this discourse until now but for me heroscape was all about how "everything" could be on the battlefield. and all the units they've shown so far fit pretty firmly under "everything". and frankly I dont think anything we've seen strays far enough from classicscape for it to generate this degree of discussion anyway

Of the examples given there are both pirates and also a steampunk airship in the set... This is perhaps the strangest criticism I've seen yet.

The argument is you like Frankenstein but not cyborgs? Biker gangs or airship crew but not pirate crew? Sharks but not necessarily pirate sharks? I'm so lost. Maybe this was really a sarcastic post and I misread the tone.

[CapAp]

Originally Posted by Good Pig

[
Of the examples given there are both pirates and also a steampunk airship in the set... This is perhaps the strangest criticism I've seen yet.

The argument is you like Frankenstein but not cyborgs? Biker gangs or airship crew but not pirate crew? Sharks but not necessarily pirate sharks? I'm so lost. Maybe this was really a sarcastic post and I misread the tone.

I see, I thought you guys were trying to understand why people like me aren’t funding it. It turns out you just want us to understand we’re wrong for not funding it.

Since I’m not interested in an argument or being belittled, I’ll go back to lurking. Thanks for the welcome.

[IAmBatman]

Originally Posted by caps

FWIW I don't see the value in being negative or critical of the campaign at this time. While I agree with many of the criticisms, I'm not sure what value there is in repeating them. The game coming back will be a boon for all of us, and I'd rather see folks directing their energy in a positive direction, looking at the highlights and upsides rather than focusing on the mistakes and downers.

I mean, there have been a lot of posts with folks wondering why this doesn't have more support or actively encouraging folks to leverage the full force of their finances to make it happen, which seems like it invites a response from other folks. If that response isn't wanted, I guess that's OK, but it feels a bit like trying to silence criticism or different perspectives, which doesn't feel super healthy for the community.

We're all rooting for this to be successful, but I feel like it's fair to have an open, safe place to express where we're coming from, even if it's not all gung-ho positive. Suggesting otherwise feels like a bit of a "loyalty test" that I fear will make folks feel marginalized from the community. I was pretty heavily feeling that way the other day when I was told that we shouldn't be critical at all, just positive, and then was told to "go away" when I pushed back at that idea.

I hope our goal for folks who don't feel this is an incredible success so far isn't to get them to "go away." Personally I care a lot more about the health of the community after this campaign than the success of the campaign itself.

[rudyvalentine]

Originally Posted by Dad_Scaper

I saw this on the Heroscape subreddit, from a non-Scaper. I thought it might belong here:

Link.

Unless I’m missing something, this is just not true. Heroquest funded on the same site with two pledge tiers. Not only that, the indication before the campaign started was to look at how we did Heroquest because that’s how we’ll do Heroscape.

[IAmBatman]

Originally Posted by rudyvalentine

Unless I’m missing something, this is just not true. Heroquest funded on the same site with two pledge tiers. Not only that, the indication before the campaign started was to look at how we did Heroquest because that’s how we’ll do Heroscape.

It's definitely not true in the case of the Heroscape campaign. I believe it's largely true for all of their other campaigns which are were more focused on selling a single toy.

[SuperSamyon]

Originally Posted by IAmBatman

I mean, there have been a lot of posts with folks wondering why this doesn't have more support or actively encouraging folks to leverage the full force of their finances to make it happen, which seems like it invites a response from other folks. If that response isn't wanted, I guess that's OK, but it feels a bit like trying to silence criticism or different perspectives, which doesn't feel super healthy for the community.

We're all rooting for this to be successful, but I feel like it's fair to have an open, safe place to express where we're coming from, even if it's not all gung-ho positive. Suggesting otherwise feels like a bit of a "loyalty test" that I fear will make folks feel marginalized from the community. I was pretty heavily feeling that way the other day when I was told that we shouldn't be critical at all, just positive, and then was told to "go away" when I pushed back at that idea.

I hope our goal for folks who don't feel this is an incredible success so far isn't to get them to "go away." Personally I care a lot more about the health of the community after this campaign than the success of the campaign itself.

Thank you for saying this. This board is the only place I feel we can have civil discussions about this topic. The Facebook group is extremely aggressive and the discord group isn't interested in any meaningful discussion.

It's important that people's perspectives are documented so that any mistakes won't be repeated should this campaign get a second chance.

[Good Pig]

@CapAp , I apologize if my reply was harsh.

I think it's good to keep in mind that the designers of this project are just regular people who frequent the threads and read all these comments.

If you don't like sci-fi, alien or units with technology, then I still hope the project funds for your sake, because after this Master Set there could be an opportunity for your cavemen or Mad Max bikers to join the battle of all time.