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  #4201  
Old June 8th, 2020, 01:30 PM
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superfrog superfrog is offline
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I think most of the time it's best to state powers as positives rather than negatives.

Like the Mohican River Tribe could be 1/5/6/3/3 with a power that said "If a Mohican River Tribesman is not engaged, subtract 1 from his attack dice and 2 from his defense dice." That would play 100% the same, but it doesn't communicate the theme well.

I think Thick Skin similarly has a flavor that "-1 defense against specials" wouldn't bring.
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  #4202  
Old June 8th, 2020, 01:42 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I think I like the Rujin design. It doubles down on the Durgeths strengths (swamp, bonding heroes that benefit from getting kills) which is probably a good thing.

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  #4203  
Old June 8th, 2020, 02:05 PM
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Sir Heroscape Sir Heroscape is offline
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by superfrog View Post
I think Thick Skin similarly has a flavor that "-1 defense against specials" wouldn't bring.
Yeah, that's how I feel. Thanks for the thoughts.

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  #4204  
Old July 7th, 2020, 03:07 PM
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William099 William099 is offline
the above
 
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Hey guys photobucket wants me to pay to maintain my direct links for my custom thread, I would rather not do that. What is another option for hosting my pictures here on Scapers? I remember somebody suggested the gallery one time but I tried to upload and it says my account doesn't have the necessary permissions. What do the rest of you use?

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  #4205  
Old July 7th, 2020, 03:10 PM
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Dysole Dysole is offline
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Options

Gallery is only available to site supporters. If you want to support the site you get access to that and a number of other features (ridiculous PM box size was what convinced me to make the leap). If you don't want to or can't afford the site supporter thing, imgur tends to be a pretty good option. Those are basically my go tos if it's not something I want on Drive or Dropbox.

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  #4206  
Old July 7th, 2020, 03:15 PM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

PostImage is also really good. It's what I use for all my map pictures.

~HS2010, who should use the gallery instead now that he's gotten Site Supporter status.
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  #4207  
Old July 15th, 2020, 08:58 PM
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Leaf_It Leaf_It is offline
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

With the Specters of Aldorn moving forward in the SoV, I have decided to show off a hero I have designed to work with them.
Quote:
NAME = SIR ALDORN
GENERAL = VYDAR
PLANET = ARCTORUS
SPECIES = UNDEAD
UNIQUENESS = UNIQUE HERO
CLASS = ARCHMAGE
PERSONALITY = TRICKY
SIZE/HEIGHT = MEDIUM 5

LIFE: 4
MOVE: 6
RANGE: 6
ATTACK: 3
DEFENSE: 4
POINTS: 100

Phantom Walk:
Aldorn can move through all figures and are never attacked when leaving an engagement.

Levitation:
Aldorn does not take falling damage and may ignore all effects from terrain tiles he moves onto or occupies.

Aldorn's Command:
Before moving, you may move up to 4 Undead Terrors that you control within 8 sight spaces up to 6 spaces. For each Undead Terror that you move, subtract 1 from the move value of this card.

Spectral Chain Special Attack:
Range Special. Attack 1+ Special.
Choose a Specter of Aldorn you control adjacent to Adorn. You may then choose another Specter of Aldorn you control adjacent to the chosen Specter, or you may choose an opponent’s figure adjacent to the chosen Specter. You may continue choosing adjacent Specters you control until you choose an opponent’s figure. You may not choose the same Specter twice. When you choose an opponent’s figure, roll one additional attack die for each Specter you chose during this Special Attack up to a maximum of +6.
The figure I'm planning to use is "INVISIBLE WIZARD" from Reaper Miniatures.
Spoiler Alert!

The Specters aren't particularly sturdy, so taking the odd turn with a hero would be risky in most situations. Generally it would be a bad idea until the Specters are all but completely wiped out. To compensate for this, the design of this hero maintains the Specter's map control, and even relies upon it to be effective.

Aldorn's Command has a limitation because I found that it was too easy to get consistently high chains of Specters lined up without it. Even with this limitation, in the early game, and periodically throughout the game, you can often take turns with Aldorn over the Specters because no enemies will be close enough to attack anyway, or it would put you at a disadvantage to extend your forces far enough to do so. An experienced player will generally be able to get Aldorn out onto the battlefield before they actually need him to use his Special, and with 6 range he can take a few pot shots while keeping the Specters moving towards the enemy.
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  #4208  
Old July 15th, 2020, 11:00 PM
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Scytale Scytale is offline
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I don't disagree with a 4-power card for a Specter leader. Phantom Walk + Levitation are required, then Aldorn's Command for the leader thing plus a reason to activate Sir Aldorn.

But I'm not a fan of Spectral Chain. It seems like it's a bunch of bells and whistles but little music. I can see how it plays into Aldorn's Command nicely and gives the Specters a potential big hit, but it does so in a needlessly roundabout way. Which as a solo or with just one other power, maybe, but not something a 4-power card should have, even if the other powers are simple.

Think again of what you want: an offensive ability that relies on Specter positioning to help crack tough units. Here's a simple idea to kick off some brainstorming:

SPECTRAL DRAIN
Figures attacked by Sir Aldorn roll one less defense die for each adjacent Specter of Aldorn you control.
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  #4209  
Old July 16th, 2020, 02:21 AM
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Leaf_It Leaf_It is offline
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scytale View Post
I don't disagree with a 4-power card for a Specter leader. Phantom Walk + Levitation are required, then Aldorn's Command for the leader thing plus a reason to activate Sir Aldorn.

But I'm not a fan of Spectral Chain. It seems like it's a bunch of bells and whistles but little music. I can see how it plays into Aldorn's Command nicely and gives the Specters a potential big hit, but it does so in a needlessly roundabout way. Which as a solo or with just one other power, maybe, but not something a 4-power card should have, even if the other powers are simple.

Think again of what you want: an offensive ability that relies on Specter positioning to help crack tough units. Here's a simple idea to kick off some brainstorming:

SPECTRAL DRAIN
Figures attacked by Sir Aldorn roll one less defense die for each adjacent Specter of Aldorn you control.
What you are suggesting would allow for the Aldorn player to potentially lower defense by up to -6, or -10 if they are double spaced, which is enough to effectively make everything but DK9000 have 0 defense. Even with an upper limit like -3 or -4, that's still enough to set more than 50% of Heroscape's designs to 0 or 1 defense.

Just from a personal perspective, as neat as deathly touch is, I wouldn't want to design anything that lowered defense more than 1. Facing an opponent who lowers defense by any more than that, isn't fun. It falls in the same boat for me as removing order markers. It must be done very carefully, like the Fyorlag Spiders. I don't personally like the Varja, because against many armies, you don't get to play the game unless they just get unlucky. Even if it's balanced, and even if it's interesting, it's just not fun to play against. The specters are limited to only lower defense by 1, not just because of memory mechanics, but because I decided that it would be incredibly annoying to fight them, if it wasn't limited to -1.

If I wanted to do something like what you have suggested, I should just try to remove the "When attacking with the Specters of Aldorn" from Deathly Touch, and only give him Aldorn's Command.

The idea/theme behind Spectral Chain is very intuitive once you understand it. It's an attack that passes from the attacker through your figures until it reaches an enemy figure. It just takes a lot of words to get the mechanics of that fully written down. If I want it to be simpler, I could remove the damage boost from it, and just give it flat damage. Or I could do what I mentioned above, and try to get the wording of Deathly touch changed.
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  #4210  
Old July 16th, 2020, 09:49 AM
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Scytale Scytale is offline
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
What you are suggesting would allow for the Aldorn player to potentially lower defense by up to -6, or -10 if they are double spaced, which is enough to effectively make everything but DK9000 have 0 defense. Even with an upper limit like -3 or -4, that's still enough to set more than 50% of Heroscape's designs to 0 or 1 defense.
Lowering defense isn't actually any different than raising attack (except for some special powers), it's just an adjustment to the probabilities. And unlike raising attack, lowering defense is bounded by the Defense value of the target. So an "unfun" argument doesn't really make sense; being attacked by a figure that gains 3 attack is worse than being attacked by a figure that reduces your defense by 3. Either way you can't do anything about it when dice are rolled, it's just who gets or doesn't get dice.

So a power that lowers defense doesn't bother me any more (actually less) than a power that raises attack. Just as it's ok to have a potentially high attack due to the setup cost involved (think Glads/Blasts), it's similarly ok (rather, significantly more ok) to lower defense potentially a lot. For a single, modest attack that requires a fair amount of setup? That's fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf_It View Post
The idea/theme behind Spectral Chain is very intuitive once you understand it.
It's ok to have a power that takes effort to parse and understand, especially if it's ultimately intuitive. But the effort has to be rewarded in gameplay. Either the power needs to be gameplay-defining or have a big payoff. Spectral Chain doesn't define how Sir Aldorn is played: move figures forward and get a single solid attack isn't new or unique or limited to this power. Having to make a chain of figures is new, but it both plays against the core idea (helping board control) and is hard to do effectively. The end result is a lot of gameplay trouble for an attack that's normally just pretty good. The payoff is not worth the complexity in the wording or in the gameplay.
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  #4211  
Old July 16th, 2020, 10:07 AM
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

I agree with Scytales points above. However, I was also thinking last night about how the original idea behind Spectral Chain might be simplified, and came up with this.

Quote:
SPECTRAL CHAIN “SPECTRAL” ATTACK
Range Special. Attack 1+ Special.
Choose a figure to attack within 6 clear sight spaces in a straight line from Sir Aldorn. Roll one additional attack die for each Specter of Aldorn between Sir Aldorn and the chosen figure. Subtract one attack die for each empty space between Sir Aldorn and the chosen figure.
It has some significant mechanical differences from the original version, but I think retains the theme fairly well, is much more concise, and I think easier to understand initially. Even if it doesn’t end up being used for this figure, I think the concept is interesting and could potentially be used for another design.
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  #4212  
Old July 16th, 2020, 10:45 AM
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Scytale Scytale is offline
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Re: The Pre-SoV Workshop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Stupendous View Post
I agree with Scytales points above. However, I was also thinking last night about how the original idea behind Spectral Chain might be simplified, and came up with this.

Quote:
SPECTRAL CHAIN “SPECTRAL” ATTACK
Range Special. Attack 1+ Special.
Choose a figure to attack within 6 clear sight spaces in a straight line from Sir Aldorn. Roll one additional attack die for each Specter of Aldorn between Sir Aldorn and the chosen figure. Subtract one attack die for each empty space between Sir Aldorn and the chosen figure.
It has some significant mechanical differences from the original version, but I think retains the theme fairly well, is much more concise, and I think easier to understand initially. Even if it doesn’t end up being used for this figure, I think the concept is interesting and could potentially be used for another design.
The problem is "between" is not defined. Unless the attack is in a straight line, there are multiple pathways that can be drawn between the source and target.
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