Heroscapers
Go Back   Heroscapers > Marvel Legends HeroScape > Marvel Official Rules and FAQ's
Marvel Official Rules and FAQ's A place to discuss specific questions regarding Marvel rules and cards.

Notices


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #37  
Old October 20th, 2007, 12:40 PM
IAmBatman's Avatar
IAmBatman IAmBatman is offline
Best There Is! - C3G Con 2020 Champ
 
Join Date: February 15, 2007
Location: USA - AL - Montgomery
Posts: 134,949
Images: 110
IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer
I find him appropriately costed. Like any piece, sometimes he won't earn his full cost, and sometimes he'll earn more. He could easily dominate a 500-600 point game all by himself, but at 360 points, you shouldn't expect any less. That said, the AE are perfectly capable of taking him out by themselves if he's not played carefully.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old October 20th, 2007, 01:08 PM
ThrasherDarkrai's Avatar
ThrasherDarkrai ThrasherDarkrai is online now
 
Join Date: September 4, 2007
Location: USA - NY - New York City
Posts: 3,894
Images: 31
ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness
Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmBatman
I find him appropriately costed. Like any piece, sometimes he won't earn his full cost, and sometimes he'll earn more. He could easily dominate a 500-600 point game all by himself, but at 360 points, you shouldn't expect any less. That said, the AE are perfectly capable of taking him out by themselves if he's not played carefully.
Minor correction. He's 370.
My main problem with him is that if he loses somehow, you don't have enough army space to back him up really. He's a unit that needs to be played extremely well in mixed games, or your screwed.

The user formerly known as Bloody the Marro Stinger!
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old October 20th, 2007, 01:13 PM
IAmBatman's Avatar
IAmBatman IAmBatman is offline
Best There Is! - C3G Con 2020 Champ
 
Join Date: February 15, 2007
Location: USA - AL - Montgomery
Posts: 134,949
Images: 110
IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer
Depends on the army size. And the thing is, he only loses "somehow". I agree that he's high risk, high reward, but he's sturdy enough to get that high reward as often as not.
And you can still get some decent units for 130 points if it's a "standard" 500 point game. Even if it's just the Krav and Eldrim or Isamu and Marcu, they can make a big difference with Hulk at their side. Three squads of roborats would be nice as well to tie down Hulk's targets until he's ready for them. You could even add Isamu as a Raelin assassin.
To some extent, I would argue that Red Skull is the worst unit to play in mixed games. Not that his ability to eschew turn markers doesn't come in extremely handy in mixed games (it does), more that his life and defense are pretty frail for a 190 point investment.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old October 20th, 2007, 01:15 PM
Fezzikthedoor's Avatar
Fezzikthedoor Fezzikthedoor is offline
I got your favorite member right here
 
Join Date: February 15, 2007
Location: Japan-Kasumigaseki-Tokyo
Posts: 733
Fezzikthedoor knows what's in an order marker Fezzikthedoor knows what's in an order marker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloody the Marro Stinger
Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmBatman
I find him appropriately costed. Like any piece, sometimes he won't earn his full cost, and sometimes he'll earn more. He could easily dominate a 500-600 point game all by himself, but at 360 points, you shouldn't expect any less. That said, the AE are perfectly capable of taking him out by themselves if he's not played carefully.
Minor correction. He's 370.
My main problem with him is that if he loses somehow, you don't have enough army space to back him up really. He's a unit that needs to be played extremely well in mixed games, or your screwed.
I'd agree with that. Conversely, when played well, he really can be a one-man wrecking crew. In a 500pt game you could easily team him up with Keldra and have 50 points left over for squadies. Keep her back with the squadies for protection, send out the Hulk, get him pissed, and jump back to her.

...hmm...actually, there are all kinds of problems with that...in any case, I think he's a beast of a unit that more than holds his own.

Plus he's got purple pants. Purple Pants. That pretty much tells you all you need to know.

You are the brute squad!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grishnakh finally
And go Flock yourself.
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old October 20th, 2007, 01:16 PM
ThrasherDarkrai's Avatar
ThrasherDarkrai ThrasherDarkrai is online now
 
Join Date: September 4, 2007
Location: USA - NY - New York City
Posts: 3,894
Images: 31
ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness
Well, Red Skull can be protected well by surrounding him with a bunch of Roborats, like, 2 squads. That leaves 230 points. Using that, we can get a fair amount of heroes to use. Mimring is a good one, and leaves 80 points, which we can use to get something like... Shiori and Marcu. Or, we could go with the Roborats/Red Skull, and get Kaemon Awa and Iskra/Retchets, topped with Isamu.
Edit: Yeah, agreed. He can be good when you know how to use him, but we first have to find OUT the best way to use him...
And agreed with Purple Pants. Especially RIPPED Purple Pants.

The user formerly known as Bloody the Marro Stinger!
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old October 20th, 2007, 01:25 PM
IAmBatman's Avatar
IAmBatman IAmBatman is offline
Best There Is! - C3G Con 2020 Champ
 
Join Date: February 15, 2007
Location: USA - AL - Montgomery
Posts: 134,949
Images: 110
IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer
Red Skull could still be picked off at range with that scenario. I'd argue that, for the points, in mixed play, an army of

Hulk, roborats x3, Isamu

would clock an army of

Red Skull, roborats x2, Mimring, Shiori, Marcu.

Who's going to kill Hulk there? Mimring might get a wound or two on him, but Hulk won't let Mimring play the hit and run game that works so well on others. One superleap and their engaged. Mimring can disengage every turn and shoot from afar to slow down the size of Hulk's attack, but his base attack is plenty to get past Mimring's small defensive number, and with this strategy Mimring is risking a disengagement swipe every turn.
Shiori and Marcu are going to have a hard time cracking through Hulk's defense of six.
Red Skull in this army is a figure you'd want to play back to take full advantage of his tactical abilities. But he's also the best candidate in this army to take out Hulk. Your best shot, IMO, would be to tie Hulk down with rats (though his special attack should make short order of them) and bring Skull close to try his dust of death a couple times before Hulk breaks free and demolishes him. You get that lucky high roll, awesome, game over pretty much. If not, you don't have anything left that can really take Hulk out.
I'd take my chances on that roll being 18 or lower for the two or three chances Red Skull would get.
Also, if I'm playing the Hulk army, I'm using Hulk on everyone except Red Skull (who my opponent will probably be keeping back anyway), I'm using my roborats to keep my opponent's off of Hulk, and I'm using Isamu to slip through the rat curtains and attempt to assassinate Red Skull (of which he has a decent shot, given Red Skull's frailty, IMO).
Mimring would be annoying against My rats with his fireline, but, like I said, Hulk could make short order of the red dragon.
Hulk with his base attack averages two skulls per attack. This increases as he's injured. Mimring and Red Skull both have defense of 3, meaning an average of one shield at a time. On the other hand, the highest of their attacks, Mimring's at 4, averages only 2 skulls an attack, which is the same as the number of shields Hulk averages.
Neither one is going to live long engaged with Hulk.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old October 20th, 2007, 01:27 PM
IAmBatman's Avatar
IAmBatman IAmBatman is offline
Best There Is! - C3G Con 2020 Champ
 
Join Date: February 15, 2007
Location: USA - AL - Montgomery
Posts: 134,949
Images: 110
IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer
To summarize, I'd say the *best* way to use Hulk is aggressively. Let your buddies take out the D20 instakill or mindshackling hot shots if they can, but feel free to Superleap Hulk right in (he'll have a target on his head from the start), tie up range, beat down swarms several figures at a time, and smash the more dangerous heroes with concentrated attacks.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old October 20th, 2007, 01:35 PM
ThrasherDarkrai's Avatar
ThrasherDarkrai ThrasherDarkrai is online now
 
Join Date: September 4, 2007
Location: USA - NY - New York City
Posts: 3,894
Images: 31
ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness
However, that's just Red Skull vs. the Hulk. Red Skull does fairly well against more armies then just a Hulk army. Face him against the Hulk, and of COURSE you'll lose.

The user formerly known as Bloody the Marro Stinger!
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old October 20th, 2007, 01:55 PM
IAmBatman's Avatar
IAmBatman IAmBatman is offline
Best There Is! - C3G Con 2020 Champ
 
Join Date: February 15, 2007
Location: USA - AL - Montgomery
Posts: 134,949
Images: 110
IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer
I was just showing how the army you selected as a better army in mixed play compared to the Hulk army I mentioned would likely get eaten up by the Hulk army. Perhaps we should consider a typical 500 point all classic scape army to compare them against?

How about the old 500 point standby:
Q9
Nakita
Original Raelin
Krug

You've got two powerhouses in this army (ranged powerhouse, Q9 and melee powerhouse, Krug) that could tear up most armies. You've also got a couple of defensive units that make them harder to kill. I think this army, frankly, is going to cause some problems for both the armies we discussed, but I like Hulk's chances against Q9 (the main threat of this army) better than Red Skull and company's.

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old October 20th, 2007, 02:12 PM
Fezzikthedoor's Avatar
Fezzikthedoor Fezzikthedoor is offline
I got your favorite member right here
 
Join Date: February 15, 2007
Location: Japan-Kasumigaseki-Tokyo
Posts: 733
Fezzikthedoor knows what's in an order marker Fezzikthedoor knows what's in an order marker
IMB, I enjoy Bloody, make no mistake, but he'll do this back and forth with you for weeks on end. He will outlast you...he has the energy of youth on his side!

You are the brute squad!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grishnakh finally
And go Flock yourself.
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old October 20th, 2007, 02:17 PM
ThrasherDarkrai's Avatar
ThrasherDarkrai ThrasherDarkrai is online now
 
Join Date: September 4, 2007
Location: USA - NY - New York City
Posts: 3,894
Images: 31
ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness ThrasherDarkrai wears ripped pants of awesomeness
Quote:
Originally Posted by IAmBatman
I was just showing how the army you selected as a better army in mixed play compared to the Hulk army I mentioned would likely get eaten up by the Hulk army. Perhaps we should consider a typical 500 point all classic scape army to compare them against?

How about the old 500 point standby:
Q9
Nakita
Original Raelin
Krug

You've got two powerhouses in this army (ranged powerhouse, Q9 and melee powerhouse, Krug) that could tear up most armies. You've also got a couple of defensive units that make them harder to kill. I think this army, frankly, is going to cause some problems for both the armies we discussed, but I like Hulk's chances against Q9 (the main threat of this army) better than Red Skull and company's.
Yes, that's true. Still, Red Skull has a chance if his men destroy enough of the army (at least Raelin and Krug) for Red Skull to get some shots with Dust of Death with his Rats. It'd be interesting to see who can do more damage to that army on average.
Still, I don't think this argument is getting either of us anywhere. I may have the energy of youth, but I know when an argument is pointless... most of the time, anyways.
And Fezzik, I think that's the reason I like CoNGS so much already. :P

The user formerly known as Bloody the Marro Stinger!
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old October 20th, 2007, 02:57 PM
IAmBatman's Avatar
IAmBatman IAmBatman is offline
Best There Is! - C3G Con 2020 Champ
 
Join Date: February 15, 2007
Location: USA - AL - Montgomery
Posts: 134,949
Images: 110
IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer IAmBatman is a wielder of the Ban Hammer
Out of curiosity, I playtested that army I mentioned against my Hulk army (and lost). Hulk did 320 points worth of damage before blanking out on defense against Krug too many times cost him. He took out full life Q9 protected by Raelin's aura (I really should have sent in Isamu first to try to assassinate her, but I got impatient and foolish). Then a wounded Hulk leapt over and took out Raelin in one attack. Then he went up against Krug, foolishly, when he probably should've just disengaged and let the rats try to wear him down. Hulk put four wounds on Krug, then Krug finished an already pretty wounded (from Q9) Hulk.
The roborats managed to put the last 4 wounds on Krug, but not without taking major casualties. With two roborats and Isamu left against all three Nakitas, I knew I was in trouble. One rat died to engagement strike, the Nakitas killed the second, and Isamu rolled a 4 on disappear, biting it as well.
All in all, I felt Hulk was beatable but not a bad investment. The army I put him up against is about the best army you can get for 500 points, IMO, and designed to face up against Hulk. Still, he pretty much held his own, and if I'd made his allies do more, I think he might have prevailed.
All in all, I'm thinking that against Q9 and Krug, Hulk needs more than a bunch of cannon fodder backing him up. The rats really weren't worth that much, since Hulk gets you engaged fast, so range doesn't really come into play. If I had it to do over, I would've gone with the Krav and Eldgrim to take out the Nakitas and Raelin, or Sgt. Drake or Agent Carr to provide a secondary heavy hitter.
I think your army would do ok as well, but I really don't think they have a reliable Q9 killer, which is essential in mixed games. If you're counting on a D20 roll to kill Q9, you're in trouble (and should probably be investing in someone like Ne-Gok-Sa instead of Red Skull for a lower risk and higher reward).

C3G can be played with official Heroscape, but it's not recommended.


DISCLAIMER: C3G claims no ownership of the characters or artwork used for C3G customs. All rights for the characters belong to their respective publishers/creators. C3G cards are not intended for sale, and C3G does not authorize any party to profit from C3G cards.

Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Heroscapers > Marvel Legends HeroScape > Marvel Official Rules and FAQ's
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:39 PM.

Heroscape background footer

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.