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  #49  
Old April 5th, 2011, 11:10 PM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

I think this is the standard champion to bond with the orcs, particularly the heavies. His squad munching abilities are pretty essential to allow the gruts to break through.

Also, I think the T-Rex should be known as Chompy, not the figure entirely. My
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  #50  
Old May 8th, 2016, 09:58 PM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

I know that I should know this but how does adjacency work when you are next to a figure but it is on a space higher than you? Are you still considered adjacent or do you actually have to be on the same level?

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  #51  
Old May 8th, 2016, 10:17 PM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

Quote:
Originally Posted by keglo View Post
I know that I should know this but how does adjacency work when you are next to a figure but it is on a space higher than you? Are you still considered adjacent or do you actually have to be on the same level?
Directly from the rulebook:

Quote:
If one figure's base is on a level equal to or higher than the height of the other figure, they are not adjacent and therefore not engaged.
So for Grimnak unless the other figure is on a space 11 or more levels higher than Grim's they are adjacent. Hope that answers your question.

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  #52  
Old May 9th, 2016, 06:21 AM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Goomonkey View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by keglo View Post
I know that I should know this but how does adjacency work when you are next to a figure but it is on a space higher than you? Are you still considered adjacent or do you actually have to be on the same level?
Directly from the rulebook:

Quote:
If one figure's base is on a level equal to or higher than the height of the other figure, they are not adjacent and therefore not engaged.
So for Grimnak unless the other figure is on a space 11 or more levels higher than Grim's they are adjacent. Hope that answers your question.
Yes you did answer my question. I'm not sure how I missed this in the rule book. I thought that it worked that way but I just wasn't sure. Thank you!

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  #53  
Old July 25th, 2017, 09:39 AM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

Although he synergizes well with blades and heavies, he is still cost 120 points and can be killed by cheaper figure very quickly. His chomp power has a 20% chance of success which is low if you are trying to use him as a hero killer. Grimnak Grins as a single figure has very liitle go for him except being huge and chomp. He is double base with 5 movement so he moves incredibly slow. He has 2 attack >D so he has a 50% chance to roll ONE skull. His defense will keep him alive longer than most troops who have the average of 3 Defense. He has the average life of 5 so he won't last any longer in that point. So after all this what I'm going to ask is why is he an A on the rankings? No offense to the people who chose his ranking.
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  #54  
Old July 25th, 2017, 10:13 AM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak View Post
Although he synergizes well with blades and heavies, he is still cost 120 points and can be killed by cheaper figure very quickly. His chomp power has a 20% chance of success which is low if you are trying to use him as a hero killer. Grimnak Grins as a single figure has very liitle go for him except being huge and chomp. He is double base with 5 movement so he moves incredibly slow. He has 2 attack >D so he has a 50% chance to roll ONE skull. His defense will keep him alive longer than most troops who have the average of 3 Defense. He has the average life of 5 so he won't last any longer in that point. So after all this what I'm going to ask is why is he an A on the rankings? No offense to the people who chose his ranking.
I think the A rating comes from three things:

1) Chomp can automatically destroy a squad figure. High cost figures like a Minion of Utgar or Sentinel of Jandar don't get to roll their high defense dice - they are just devoured. After the Chomp, Grimnak still gets an attack of 2 .. so essentially he is a double-attack figure. And then there is the fact that he can chomp heroes : )

2) After Grimnak's double-attack, he bonds with two different types of Grut squads - both of which have 4 figures. That means for 1 order marker on either the Blade or Heavy Gruts, you are getting 6 'attacks.' 6 attacks per OM is nearly unmatched in Classic.

3) Adding +1 attack and +1 defense to the Orc Warriors is great. As a double-space figure that gives more potential spaces to provide his bonus.
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  #55  
Old July 25th, 2017, 10:38 AM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

I don't make the rankings but...

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak
Although he synergizes well with blades and heavies
Well let's not dismiss this as a lot of his cost is tied into this fact. Heavy Gruts are arguably the best bonding squad in the game, so a bonding option for them that boosts their attack is not insignificant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak
he is still cost 120 points
120 isn't ridiculous compared to some of the Roman or Knight bonding options who are the other 4 man squad premiere bonding units (100+ for Gilbert/Alastair/Denrick/Marcus/VW/Valguard/Forgehammer)

Also keep in mind that blade gruts are 40 points and arguably undercosted, and Heavy Gruts (or Blades) also have a very cheap 50 point potent hero Nerak. So the 120 point cost isn't even that far off from other similar bonding army options, and taking into account the cost of Nerak is fairly balanced for the type of army he is going to be in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak
and can be killed by cheaper figure very quickly.
This is not correct except in either poorly played Grut armies, or selective ranged examples. You may have to specify your 'cheaper figures', but against melee, Grimnak should have a screen of 5 defense Heavy Gruts that need to be taken out before he sees a steady stream of attacks. And of course chomp and 3/4 attack Gruts are going to quickly take down a melee offensive.

Against range of course Grimnak will struggle more but here's where you have to specify 'cheaper figures'. Even there, the gruts have the speed and disengage to get around most screens to get to the Krav or tie down troublesome ranged figures. If the figures you were referring to are a hoarde of Mass/Regiment, then well I don't think that's an argument for saying Grimnak can be killed too quickly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak
His chomp power has a 20% chance of success which is low if you are trying to use him as a hero killer.
yes...don't do that.

His chomp power has 100% against squad figures though...so probably some good value there

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak
Grimnak Grins as a single figure has very liitle go for him except being huge and chomp.
Bonding with a 4 man squad, and giving a double boost to that squad, as well as attacking in addition to figure destruction are all additional benefits.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak
He is double base with 5 movement so he moves incredibly slow.
Indeed he does, but that's alright because as we outlined he doesn't want to outpace his screen of gruts. If you want speed in your grut army you have disengaging squad options or a much speedier Nerak or Tornak. In addition, double base on an adjacent aura figure is a good thing. (8 spaces of aura vs. 6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak
He has 2 attack >D so he has a 50% chance to roll ONE skull.
His additional attack is just icing on the cake of chomp + squad attack boost. It comes in handy more than you might think.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak
His defense will keep him alive longer than most troops who have the average of 3 Defense. He has the average life of 5 so he won't last any longer in that point.
Already touched on some things, but 4 defense, 5 life has some staying power. Also keep in mind that Nerak (a must in your army) will boost him to 5 defense.

In addition, the amount of attacks he sees should be minimized by the bonding squad. You can protect him or engage the enemy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak
So after all this what I'm going to ask is why is he an A on the rankings?
mostly because...
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  #56  
Old July 25th, 2017, 11:12 AM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

Thanks for the great points that really give credit to the figure. I would still pick Krug but he does bond and boost well with the two different squads. I like to hear why troops get ranked and how people come to the conclusions. Thanks again
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  #57  
Old July 25th, 2017, 11:41 AM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

The Chomp being able to open a hole for the Orc's to move through combined with their Disengage can really help with map control.
At least that is what I remember a more skilled player than I mentioning.
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  #58  
Old July 25th, 2017, 12:23 PM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

Grimnak is ranked highly because he is consistently strong. Sure he may have a bad game every once in a blue moon because Q9 just ripped him apart with 3 attacks of 3 skulls, but beyond those games, he will often earn his points back. And depending on who he chomps, can earn back far far more. There just aren't many figures who offer guarenteed anything in this game, Grimnak offers free OHKO.

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  #59  
Old July 25th, 2017, 01:36 PM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekthefreak View Post
Thanks for the great points that really give credit to the figure. I would still pick Krug but he does bond and boost well with the two different squads. I like to hear why troops get ranked and how people come to the conclusions. Thanks again
And that's totally fair! When looking at the grades, remember that they are intended only to present the value of the unit in its best role, in a competitive environment.

So Grimnak's A grade is an assessment of how valuable he is in an expertly handled army of Heavies in a tournament setting. Thank you for asking the question, these conversations are always interesting.

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  #60  
Old July 25th, 2017, 02:42 PM
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Re: The Book of Grimnak

Glad I could start it. I had some stuff i wanted to talk about the empirium but i accidentally hit previous thread so it deleted it all and I'm too lazy to rewrite it all
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